Punt returner options

[captain stone]

A 4.49 forty and a 6.71 3-cone don't seem too shabby to me.

It isn't; I was more closely referring to his height & length, and to his pedestrian leaping ability in order to overcome those disadvantages.

 

[maineman209]

It isn't; I was more closely referring to his height & length, and to his pedestrian leaping ability in order to overcome those disadvantages.

5097 is about average for Pats DBs.

33" vert and 116" long jump are a bit below average (~36" and ~122")

Butler posted 33.5" and 118", and look how he turned out.

 

[DarrylS]

Was listening to something yesterday about how many college players consider playing for Alabama is close to the same as playing for the 33rd NLF team .. Some who come from that touted program will struggle.. you ain't in Tuscaloosa any more.

There is a huge dropoff between "#33" and "#32"... with that being said after being banished to the ineptitude of the Ratbirds, after this stint in purgatory it may be a wake up call for Cyrus.. If anything it shows the value BB places on Special Teams, but we all knew that.

 

[maineman209]

Was listening to something yesterday about how many college players consider playing for Alabama is close to the same as playing for the 33rd NLF team .. Some who come from that touted program will struggle.. you ain't in Tuscaloosa any more.

There is a huge dropoff between "#33" and "#32"... with that being said after being banished to the ineptitude of the Ratbirds, after this stint in purgatory it may be a wake up call for Cyrus.. If anything it shows the value BB places on Special Teams, but we all knew that.

I really don't think that CJ was "banished". I think it was a combination of not quite being back from his ACL by cuts, and what BB said about ST in pre-season not being able to provide CJ with sufficient opportunities. BB seemed genuinely regretful about that, and, indeed, return blocking was dreadful in the pre-season, and still doesn't seem quite right even now (nor does kick/punt coverage).

In any case, I didn't think that CJ looked "awful" those last to weeks of Camp, just "not ready". In spite of that, he more or less held his own as a DB, and seemed confident handling the ball on punts.

I think it may be possible that the Pats intended to bring CJ back after he'd had little more time to heal up. The fact that he was on the Ratbirds PS may have been something of a bonus, in that CJ was participating in organized workouts and practices, at least as a scout team member, instead of trying to get back to game-shape on his own.

 

[DarrylS]

I really don't think that CJ was "banished". I think it was a combination of not quite being back from his ACL by cuts, and what BB said about ST in pre-season not being able to provide CJ with sufficient opportunities. BB seemed genuinely regretful about that, and, indeed, return blocking was dreadful in the pre-season, and still doesn't seem quite right even now (nor does kick/punt coverage).

In any case, I didn't think that CJ looked "awful" those last to weeks of Camp, just "not ready". In spite of that, he more or less held his own as a DB, and seemed confident handling the ball on punts.

I think it may be possible that the Pats intended to bring CJ back after he'd had little more time to heal up. The fact that he was on the Ratbirds PS may have been something of a bonus, in that CJ was participating in organized workouts and practices, at least as a scout team member, instead of trying to get back to game-shape on his own.

When I meant banished it was done so figuratively, not literally.. I do agree with your premise.

They always speak of how the rest of the league plays checkers, while BB plays chess.. I prefer no one is better at the "long game" in the NFL than BB.. he always has a plan, but injuries are the great equalizer that stymie those plans.

 

[Tony2046]

I really don't think that CJ was "banished". I think it was a combination of not quite being back from his ACL by cuts, and what BB said about ST in pre-season not being able to provide CJ with sufficient opportunities. BB seemed genuinely regretful about that, and, indeed, return blocking was dreadful in the pre-season, and still doesn't seem quite right even now (nor does kick/punt coverage).

In any case, I didn't think that CJ looked "awful" those last to weeks of Camp, just "not ready". In spite of that, he more or less held his own as a DB, and seemed confident handling the ball on punts.

I think it may be possible that the Pats intended to bring CJ back after he'd had little more time to heal up. The fact that he was on the Ratbirds PS may have been something of a bonus, in that CJ was participating in organized workouts and practices, at least as a scout team member, instead of trying to get back to game-shape on his own.

He looked pretty good in one of his PRs. Maybe wearing a shorter T-shirt would be an option.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

He looked pretty good in one of his PRs.

If he's over the yips with respect to catching the ball, it's clear that he can do a whole lot more with it afterwards than people like Chung and McCarron ever could.

 

[Uptown]

Great minds think alike I proposed this earlier as well.
Thinking Arizona will grab any kind of hope right now.

Straight up for Patrick Peterson.

 

[maineman209]

 

[mgteich]

Cy Jones is all I expect from a backup, emergency #8 DB on Game Day. Should we really expect more? Jones could have a couple of reps on defense, However, absent Game Day injuries, we don't need hm to have any reps at all.

Gilmore, Rowe, J Jones, McCourty, McCourty, Chung , Harmon

 

[maineman209]

Cy Jones is all I expect from a backup, emergency #8 DB on Game Day. Should we really expect more? Jones could have a couple of reps on defense, However, absent Game Day injuries, we don't need hm to have any reps at all.

Gilmore, Rowe, J Jones, McCourty, McCourty, Chung , Harmon

Chung seems highly likely to miss the game, and I'm fairly certain that Rowe will not be among the starters this week, if he's even active ("limited" with yet another groin injury).

That leaves: Gilmore, J Jones, McCourty, McCourty, Harmon.

Cyrus is the only other experienced DB on the roster (not counting Ebner's sporadic token snaps). He may see quite a few snaps this week, and perhaps going forward for at least awhile.

 

[DaBruinz]

I hope the people imagining a Rowe-less defense are aware that JC Jackson is not the 6’1” he’s listed at, but actually 5’9¾”. Kyed pointed that out yesterday.

Eric Rowe isn't the 6'1 he's listed at either. He's only 6' and 3/4"

As I pointed out many years ago, some of the best corners in the league were under 6'. Including our own Ty Law.

 

[DaBruinz]

Chung seems highly likely to miss the game, and I'm fairly certain that Rowe will not be among the starters this week, if he's even active ("limited" with yet another groin injury).

That leaves: Gilmore, J Jones, McCourty, McCourty, Harmon.

Cyrus is the only other experienced DB on the roster (not counting Ebner's sporadic token snaps). He may see quite a few snaps this week, and perhaps going forward for at least awhile.

I fully expect us to see Cy Jones and one of either Crossen or Jackson on the field this week. Neither Crossen or Jackson can be much worse than Rowe and JMac were.

 

[DaBruinz]

It isn't; I was more closely referring to his height & length, and to his pedestrian leaping ability in order to overcome those disadvantages.

Gotta love when people pull out the "LENGTH" BS argument. And just what is Jones' length? Please enlighten everyone on where we can find that measurement?

 

[captain stone]

2016 NFL Draft Profile: Cyrus Jones

Actually, 31-3/8" arms aren't that bad on a 5'9-3/4 CB.

 

[maineman209]

2016 NFL Draft Profile: Cyrus Jones

Actually, 31-3/8" arms aren't that bad on a 5'9-3/4 CB.

I saw a listing for a guy in the 2017 draft with 28-3/4" arms. He was over 5'9".

I thought, "How TF does this guy even drink beer? With a sippy cup?"

 

[mgteich]

If there are truly 2 injuries (Chung and Rowe) should we expect one of the rookies to be active? After all, we've been told that they are both higher on the DB depth chart than C Jones.

Chung seems highly likely to miss the game, and I'm fairly certain that Rowe will not be among the starters this week, if he's even active ("limited" with yet another groin injury).

That leaves: Gilmore, J Jones, McCourty, McCourty, Harmon.

Cyrus is the only other experienced DB on the roster (not counting Ebner's sporadic token snaps). He may see quite a few snaps this week, and perhaps going forward for at least awhile.

 

[maineman209]

If there are truly 2 injuries (Chung and Rowe) should we expect one of the rookies to be active? After all, we've been told that they are both higher on the DB depth chart than C Jones.

Since Crossen has also been limited in practice with a hamstring issue (beginning last Friday, the 14th), that seems to leave JC Jackson to round out active DB depth.

It's interesting that, in this particular instance, the loss of two active DBs seems unlikely to have a huge impact on ST. Ebner is currently top in ST snaps at 44, followed closely by King, Slater and JJ (probably all participating on all four units). Before missing the 2nd half last week, Chung had 16 ST snaps - on a pace for 22 total, probably only two units. Rowe has yet to play an ST snap this season (he typically only plays a relative handful of ST snaps during the season), so his absence isn't a factor there.

So, even if Crossen is significantly better on ST than Jackson, there's no reason to push him to play on a bad hammy. NOTE: I'm not saying that Crossen IS a better ST player than Jackson; it's just a hypothetical to illustrate the point.

I haven't personally been "told" by anyone that Crossen and Jackson are higher on the depth chart for DB scrimmage snaps than Cyrus - at least not by anyone whose authority on depth chart matters I'm willing to accept, which certainly doesn't include media reports. It's possible that they are, but that something that only the coaches themselves really know.

All I know is that Cyrus has had considerably more experience playing DB in the regular season than either of the rookies (147 snaps to zero), plus two full sets of OTAs, one full Camp and two partial Camps. So, I'll go with that until there's some tangible evidence to the contrary.

 

[AlexB]

Since Crossen has also been limited in practice with a hamstring issue (beginning last Friday, the 14th), that seems to leave JC Jackson to round out active DB depth.

It's interesting that, in this particular instance, the loss of two active DBs seems unlikely to have a huge impact on ST. Ebner is currently top in ST snaps at 44, followed closely by King, Slater and JJ (probably all participating on all four units). Before missing the 2nd half last week, Chung had 16 ST snaps - on a pace for 22 total, probably only two units. Rowe has yet to play an ST snap this season (he typically only plays a relative handful of ST snaps during the season), so his absence isn't a factor there.

So, even if Crossen is significantly better on ST than Jackson, there's no reason to push him to play on a bad hammy. NOTE: I'm not saying that Crossen IS a better ST player than Jackson; it's just a hypothetical to illustrate the point.

I haven't personally been "told" by anyone that Crossen and Jackson are higher on the depth chart for DB scrimmage snaps than Cyrus - at least not by anyone whose authority on depth chart matters I'm willing to accept, which certainly doesn't include media reports. It's possible that they are, but that something that only the coaches themselves really know.

All I know is that Cyrus has had considerably more experience playing DB in the regular season than either of the rookies (147 snaps to zero), plus two full sets of OTAs, one full Camp and two partial Camps. So, I'll go with that until there's some tangible evidence to the contrary.

Presumably if Cyrus were higher on the DB depth chart than Jackson or Crossen, he wouldn't have been waived at cutdowns.

 

[maineman209]

Presumably if Cyrus were higher on the DB depth chart than Jackson or Crossen, he wouldn't have been waived at cutdowns.

They were healthy. Cyrus wasn't back up to speed yet recovering from his ACL. The Pats may have been somewhat surprised that he was claimed.

The last time Cyrus played with the Pats (in pres-season #4) was nearly a month ago. We have no idea where things stand now.