Is This Defense As Good As 2017?

[RobertWeathers]

The PPG crowd was ranting last year about points allows but in reality it was an awful defense. The run defense was atrocious. The pass defense allow average QBs to look good. I will be keeping an eye on our run defense this season and see how it performs.

So if a team has a good run D and shut down average QBs but allowed 24ppg is that a good defense to you?

Who had the better D last year, Denver or NE?

 

[PatriotsNumero1Fan]

So if a team has a good run D and shut down average QBs but allowed 24ppg is that a good defense to you?

Who had the better D last year, Denver or NE?

Well NE but keep in mind that Denver was awful last year offensively. Defense was on the field for the majority of the time.

By the way i would take donkeys pass defense over ours.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Well NE but keep in mind that Denver was awful last year offensively. Defense was on the field for the majority of the time.

Denver was 6th in offensive ToP. NE was 11th.

 

[maineman209]

I certainly hope that I'm wrong, but I think the Pats will score less and give up more this year than last.

YEAR PF PA REC Playoffs
2017 458 296 13-3 Lost SB
2016 441 250 14-2 WonSB
2015 465 315 12-4 Lost CG
2014 468 313 12-4 WonSB
2013 444 338 12-4 Lost CG
2012 557 331 12-4 Lost CG
2011 513 342 13-3 Lost SB
2010 518 313 14-2 Lost Div

 

[Brick27]

Yet to see a rational breakdown as to why the D will be worse off than last year. Also haven’t seen a breakdown of 2017 Malcolm Butler from those who are adament that he is the reason the D will take a step back.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I’m honestly not sure about this team at all. I have confidence they will end up getting better over the season but I think it could be rough ride.

On the other hand it certainly games the games more interesting.

 

[Patjew]

I feel like I don't know this team AT ALL on O, D, or even ST. So many moving parts...

I won't be surprised if they stink (relatively, like 9 or 10 wins). But I also won't be surprised if they come together well and are 13-3. One thing I do not expect is for them to appear dominant.

It will be interesting, though, as always.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Denver was 6th in offensive ToP. NE was 11th.

That’s terrible. You would think If your going to spout off reasoning as to why a defense struggled you would at least reference the stats to back up your claim.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Well NE but keep in mind that Denver was awful last year offensively. Defense was on the field for the majority of the time.

By the way i would take donkeys pass defense over ours.

Your lucky they only give me the option of 1 dislike. Your post deserved multiple.

 

[RobertWeathers]

That’s terrible. You would think If your going to spout off reasoning as to why a defense struggled you would at least reference the stats to back up your claim.

Ha.

Denver just had a weird defensive year. Had all the key stats but points allowed.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Ha.

Denver just had a weird defensive year. Had all the key stats but points allowed.

I’ll help him out. The Denver offense was bad but it was mainly due to the amount of turnovers. Thus the opposing offenses are starting in better field position. Could explain the spike in scoring defense.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I’ll help him out. The Denver offense was bad but it was mainly due to the amount of turnovers. Thus the opposing offenses are starting in better field position. Could explain the spike in scoring defense.

Their offense was putrid.

19 INTs and 26 offensive fumbles....yikes

 

[1960Pats]

Yet to see a rational breakdown as to why the D will be worse off than last year. Also haven’t seen a breakdown of 2017 Malcolm Butler from those who are adament that he is the reason the D will take a step back.

The Pats gave up 18.6 PPG in the regular season and 17.0 in the playoffs until they took out Butler and gave up 41 in the SB. They looked like a sieve doing it too.

 

[mgteich]

The Pats gave up 18.6 PPG in the regular season and 17.0 in the playoffs until they took out Butler and gave up 41 in the SB. They looked like a sieve doing it too.

They took out J Jones also.

In any case, the front six has been greatly improved with the return of Hightower and the addition of Clayborne, Shelton, Bentley, Rivers, and Davis. Wise and Butler should be improved with a year of experience.

The safety position is better with the replacement of Richards by McCourty as the 4th safety.

The corner position is indeed questionable, but is helped by the improvement elsewhere. Rowe and J Jones are back healthy to replace Butler and Bademosi. We have also added Dawson, Jackson and Crossen. Dawson should be at least a backup nickel.

 

[ausbacker]

I feel like I don't know this team AT ALL on O, D, or even ST. So many moving parts...

I won't be surprised if they stink (relatively, like 9 or 10 wins). But I also won't be surprised if they come together well and are 13-3. One thing I do not expect is for them to appear dominant.

It will be interesting, though, as always.

They took out J Jones also.

In any case, the front six has been greatly improved with the return of Hightower and the addition of Clayborne, Shelton, Bentley, Rivers, and Davis. Wise and Butler should be improved with a year of experience.

The safety position is better with the replacement of Richards by McCourty as the 4th safety.

The corner position is indeed questionable, but is helped by the improvement elsewhere. Rowe and J Jones are back healthy to replace Butler and Bademosi. We have also added Dawson, Jackson and Crossen. Dawson should be at least a backup nickel.

If Shelton and Brown anchor and stonewall the interior with (hopefully) much improved performance from DE "additions" Clayborn and Rivers, provided Hightower stays healthy then I feel rather optimistic about the D.

The beauty of this stage of the season is most of us are hoping for the best version possible.

 

[fnordcircle]

I feel like I don't know this team AT ALL on O, D, or even ST. So many moving parts...

I won't be surprised if they stink (relatively, like 9 or 10 wins). But I also won't be surprised if they come together well and are 13-3. One thing I do not expect is for them to appear dominant.

Refresh my memory - what years have they been truly dominant? 2004? 2007? 2010?

There's a lot of years where they had some blowouts but then they'd have games they won like, 9-3 against the Browns or eek out a last second win against the Texans thanks to a catch by Daniel Graham or something.

I really wish they'd put every ****ing season up or at least the last decade's worth of games.

I expect 12 wins. If they manage to start 4-0 maybe even 14. The first 2 games are against 2 of the top 3 AFC contenders (I'm not including KC yet because they've got a giant question mark at QB)

 

[Tony2046]

I certainly hope that I'm wrong, but I think the Pats will score less and give up more this year than last.

My novice opinion so take it fwiw.

I was rewatching the 3rd preseason game vs the Panthers and there is some good defensive stuff the Pats were doing in it.

Some of the game seemed experimental with double stunts etc.. and leaving the edge wide open. But during the end of the first and into the second quarter they looked solid if not great.

1. Shelton looks solid at NT. This is, imo, is the key improvement over last season. He can two gap which means the LB's have less to worry about than they did last season.

2. They moved Malcolm Brown around during the game. Either on the left or right side of Shelton. Looking for match up opportunities during the game. Last season he was asked to be a quasi NT with 3rd down DT's anchoring his left or right side. That didn't work out well.

3. During one series Davis sealed the left side of the line perfectly, Brown pushed the LT back into Cam, Hightower got through a gap and flushed Cam out of the pocket. KVN chased him out of bounds for a two yard gain. It was perfect..

4. During another series they handed off to McCaffery. Their intent was to create a cutback lane but Shelton strong armed the guard, Davis kept the edge sealed by avoiding the TE block, and KVN plugged the lane. MB and Hightower held the left side of the Oline while Wise broke through and Chung maintained the edge. KVN, Shelton, Wise and Davis were in on the tackle.. (See image below)

So I disagree. I think this defense will be better if not much better than last season and give up less points.


I've circled Shelton handling two Oline guys which allows KVN to plug the lane. Good stuff.

 

[DarrylS]

Belichick traded Cooks and let Amendola leave and failed to provide adequate
replacements. Too bad Britt, Matthews, and Mitchell got injured. Minimal
attempt to add any rookies.

BB did not let "Amendola" leave, BB put a monetary value on his position and Miami made a better offer... "Minimal attempt to add any rookies"?? In the first two rounds BB opted for OL, RB and CB... were there better choices?? When the draft was held our WR's looked much different than they do now.. cannot rewrite Pats history by looking in the rear view mirror..

All February heard Sportstalk radio about how ineffective Cooks really was in this offense, despite his numbers he sucked according to them. They Pats trade Cooks for a decent draft pick and then they lament how BB let this wonderfullest WR go to the Rams.. it all seems so absurd after a while doesn't it???

 

[maineman209]

The Pats gave up 18.6 PPG in the regular season and 17.0 in the playoffs until they took out Butler and gave up 41 in the SB. They looked like a sieve doing it too.

The Pats gave up 42 to the Chiefs' RPO attack in week-1. Butler played every snap in that game.

One last time:

Butler's absence was NOT the reason that the Pats lost the Superbowl to Philly's RPO attack. If you disagree, I strongly recommend that you confine your comments to that effect to the Butler Mega-thread.

 

[supafly]

The Pats gave up 42 to the Chiefs' RPO attack in week-1. Butler played every snap in that game.

One last time:

Butler's absence was NOT the reason that the Pats lost the Superbowl to Philly's RPO attack. If you disagree, I strongly recommend that you confine your comments to that effect to the Butler Mega-thread.

I fully agree with you here. My only reasons for hesitation would be that I believe that Butler may have been able to secure some of the missed tackles, and that his absence may have had some negative effect on team morale (not as much as the tackling).

I believe that the poor run defense and misplayed scheme likely contributed much more to the loss than the absence of Butler. That all said, I can appreciate both sides, and I don’t want to totally derail the thread with too many back and forths with people who may feel differently. Ultimately, I think it was a bad decision and who knows, his presence may have prevented a touchdown, but I think the blame falls more on the inability to stop the run and (often) poor play against RPO teams.