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Brady "Pleads the 5th" when asked if he feels appreciated.


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I said it right after the super bowl that BBs decision to bench Butler was so out there that it could potentially cause him to lose the locker room, or at least demoralize some of his players...

Lots of guys on the team, including tram captains and their super stars like Gronk and Brady all wanted Butler to play...

I can't imagine the frustration that Brady must feel to go for 500+ yards passing (NFL record) in the SB that should have been his 6th title and lose because their defense couldn't stop a nose bleed and got shredded all night long

I just try to forget about it because it drives me crazy so much. The only thing that keeps me sane is that a player said it "wasn't without merit"

"Wasn't withou merit" did he kill someone? Even if it was a team rule or whateva you play the guy. It's the damn super bowl and he's out of your life after the season.
 
I said that after 2017 should have been the switch from Brady to Jimmy. They need to replenish talent regardless. Now you've got a 41 year old crybaby to coddle while being in the same position as last year (needing to score 45 to win).
We have a 41 year old that just was mvp of the league and put up 500 yards in the Superbowl. That's what got you to conclude it's time to make the switch? And 45 to win? I'd take Brady over Jimmy to do that right now.
 
I rather him play the whole game too. We would have won. You have to placate the other half on these boards though otherwise they will never see what you want to show them.

A lot of those fans you're referring to are either more Bill Belichick fans or more Tom Brady fans. I seriously doubt they're lifelong Patriots fans and I seriously doubt a lot of them have any ties to New England whatsoever. They'll be among the first to disappear when both are gone.
 
@KontradictioN

I'm curious what you think of the offensive game plan and how that fits your narrative that the game plan lost the game before it was even played?
 
A lot of those fans you're referring to are either more Bill Belichick fans or more Tom Brady fans. I seriously doubt they're lifelong Patriots fans and I seriously doubt a lot of them have any ties to New England whatsoever. They'll be among the first to disappear when both are gone.

They are also the first ones to start raging in the game day threads and talking about how BB needs to go. Honestly its like 6 people, they all echo the same things as each other, and if you go back and look they quote each other as the source of the "sources" that they use in arguments.

Honestly, find any other fan base in the world that would talk **** about their MVP 5 time championship winning player rated as the best of all time. I'd wager its non existent.
 
@KontradictioN

I'm curious what you think of the offensive game plan and how that fits your narrative that the game plan lost the game before it was even played?

It didn't. The offense posted 33 points and over 600 yards. The game plan there was fine and limited what the Eagles were able to do well. But if you want to blame the offense, I'm all ears as to why. Just let me know so I can grab an extra pair of boxers.
 
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Get used to it. When you make a simple, correct, assertion that the game plan on defense lost the game and make that point even excluding Butler and people still lose their minds over it, it'll be a conversation that will be had for many months/years to come.
I get it, I want answers too, but I have accepted that we aren't getting any until Bill does another documentary or writes a book. I guess I look at it as I accept Bill for all his frustrating maddening BS, why can't everyone else? That's me, projecting. I'm ready to move on, even if TB12 and the rest aren't.
 
It didn't. The offense posted 33 points and over 600 yards of total offense. The game plan there was fine and limited what the Eagles were able to do well. But if you want to blame the offense, I'm all ears as to why. Just let me know so I can grab an extra pair of boxers.
My point is that even with a game plan that as you said was fine (I would say much better than fine) they still made a critical mistake at a critical time that helped lead to the loss.
My point is even if the defensive game plan sucked you still need to execute and tackle.
The game was not lost prior to kickoff due to poor game planning.
Sitting Butler did not help and did not make the defensive game plan look any better but they still had many many moments in that game where execution could have made the difference.
The coaches had their share of mistakes as did the players to say it was completely lost before kickoff just because of the defensive game plan is false and belittles the effort that the guys on the field put in to get them within one drive of a title.
 
It didn't. The offense posted 33 points and over 600 yards. The game plan there was fine and limited what the Eagles were able to do well. But if you want to blame the offense, I'm all ears as to why. Just let me know so I can grab an extra pair of boxers.
Basically if you want to lay the loss at the feet of the coaches for how bad the defensive game plan was how do you reconcile that with the fact their offensive game plan kept them in it until the final minutes of the game?
 
My point is that even with a game plan that as you said was fine (I would say much better than fine) they still made a critical mistake at a critical time that helped lead to the loss.
My point is even if the defensive game plan sucked you still need to execute and tackle.
The game was not lost prior to kickoff due to poor game planning.
Sitting Butler did not help and did not make the defensive game plan look any better but they still had many many moments in that game where execution could have made the difference.
The coaches had their share of mistakes as did the players to say it was completely lost before kickoff just because of the defensive game plan is false and belittles the effort that the guys on the field put in to get them within one drive of a title.
I’ve said in other posts that mistakes happen. For every team in every game. But the key, and this is especially so in the Super Bowl when you’re playing a higher caliber opponent with more offensive firepower, is to limit them. The game plan did that group zero favors. That’s been established in this thread as even opponents to that claim can’t estavlish that the game plan wasn’t a problem. Nor can that establish that the match-ups that the game plan put key positional groups in were favorable. Hence, the game plan sunk the game on that side of the ball. That’s on the coaches. On that side of the ball, the buck stops with Belichick. So the blame lays at his feet.

Basically if you want to lay the loss at the feet of the coaches for how bad the defensive game plan was how do you reconcile that with the fact their offensive game plan kept them in it until the final minutes of the game?

Two different sides of the ball with two different coaches. Furthermore, Belichick is far more involved in the defensive game plan than he is in the offensive game plan.

By the way, if you know my posting history on this forum, you’ll know that I’m usually the guy to come to the defense of the coaching staff re: game planning and adjustments.
 
That this quote is being brandished about without context is such BS. Brady's 5th amendment comment was a joke. He went on to praise Belichick, called him the greatest coach of all times and stated he could not have achieved all that he did without Belichick. But including the context would have spoiled the splash, so lets go with it. Really disappointed in Curran.
 
I said it right after the super bowl that BBs decision to bench Butler was so out there that it could potentially cause him to lose the locker room, or at least demoralize some of his players...

Lots of guys on the team, including tram captains and their super stars like Gronk and Brady all wanted Butler to play...

I can't imagine the frustration that Brady must feel to go for 500+ yards passing (NFL record) in the SB that should have been his 6th title and lose because their defense couldn't stop a nose bleed and got shredded all night long

I just try to forget about it because it drives me crazy so much. The only thing that keeps me sane is that a player said it "wasn't without merit"
Players can whine about coaching decisions in any loss. Patriot players are well aware that Belichick gives them a better chance to win than any coach could.
Blowing this up into “losing the team” is silly.
 
Does anyone else feel like even the context doesn't do much to help the quote? It still comes off a bit petty even if he comes back with his Tom Brady life and happiness wisdom
 
One other aspect of the game plan that was pretty crappy included rushing M. Flowers and dropping T. Flowers into coverage. This happened too often. Heck, M. Flowers rushed too often.
Clearly, we have too many Flowers’ on this team. ;)
 
I’ve said in other posts that mistakes happen. For every team in every game. But the key, and this is especially so in the Super Bowl when you’re playing a higher caliber opponent with more offensive firepower, is to limit them. The game plan did that group zero favors. That’s been established in this thread as even opponents to that claim can’t estavlish that the game plan wasn’t a problem. Nor can that establish that the match-ups that the game plan put key positional groups in were favorable. Hence, the game plan sunk the game on that side of the ball. That’s on the coaches. On that side of the ball, the buck stops with Belichick. So the blame lays at his feet.



Two different sides of the ball with two different coaches. Furthermore, Belichick is far more involved in the defensive game plan than he is in the offensive game plan.

By the way, if you know my posting history on this forum, you’ll know that I’m usually the guy to come to the defense of the coaching staff re: game planning and adjustments.
I think my big problem with you on this one is that you seem to only want to leave the blame solely at the feet of Bill. Bill benching one player does not forgive all the other mistakes. You seem to think no one could do no wrong because Bill put them somewhere that doing right was a little more difficult than the previous week with Butler. If Butler had been hurt and the game plan was the same I think your stance would be very different.
 
I think my big problem with you on this one is that you seem to only want to leave the blame solely at the feet of Bill. Bill benching one player does not forgive all the other mistakes. You seem to think no one could do no wrong because Bill put them somewhere that doing right was a little more difficult than the previous week with Butler. If Butler had been hurt and the game plan was the same I think your stance would be very different.
This is faulty logic on many levels. Taking the point of view you laid out in your first two sentences, no coach in NFL history should ever be blamed for a loss. Almost every player in any game in any sport that’s played at a competitive level makes mistakes throughout the game. The Patriots are no exception. The key, and Belichick himself has said this multiple times, is limiting them. However, when the game plan itself is a mistake a forces multiple players at multiple key positions to do something that they’re simply not good at, it becomes nearly impossible to limit those mistakes on that side of the ball. So, effectively, the game plan itself betrayed them. The game plan sunk the defense more than any one mistake that was made on the field. That gets laid at the feet of the coaches on that side of the ball and, since the buck stops with Belichick there, that’s where the blame goes. Unless you can seriously tell me that you believe that Richards covering Ertz over Chung, Chung cover Agholor over Rowe, and Rowe manning the CB2 position over Butler (on top of Bademosi even being on the field at all) are match-ups that you love, you agree with me on that.

As for your last sentence, that doesn’t make sense at all as a counter argument. If Butler was injured, he would have been physically incapable of playing. Butler wasn’t injured. He dressed for the game. He just simply wasn’t used and the coaching staff instead opted for a game plan that got shredded to the tune of 41 points.
 
That this quote is being brandished about without context is such BS. Brady's 5th amendment comment was a joke. He went on to praise Belichick, called him the greatest coach of all times and stated he could not have achieved all that he did without Belichick. But including the context would have spoiled the splash, so lets go with it. Really disappointed in Curran.
I might agree with you if this were a true arms-length media question. But this was Jim Gray, Brady's hand-picked media guy. That question was fed to Gray to set up Brady to give the answer he did. So you have to ask yourself why Brady wanted that question and answer out there.

I think Curran's piece today about this has it right -- Curran: Brady has it both ways with his Monday comments
 
This is faulty logic on many levels. Taking the point of view you laid out in your first two sentences, no coach in NFL history should ever be blamed for a loss. Almost every player in any game in any sport that’s played at a competitive level makes mistakes throughout the game. The Patriots are no exception. The key, and Belichick himself has said this multiple times, is limiting them. However, when the game plan itself is a mistake a forces multiple players at multiple key positions to do something that they’re simply not good at, it becomes nearly impossible to limit those mistakes on that side of the ball. So, effectively, the game plan itself betrayed them. The game plan sunk the defense more than any one mistake that was made on the field. That gets laid at the feet of the coaches on that side of the ball and, since the buck stops with Belichick there, that’s where the blame goes. Unless you can seriously tell me that you believe that Richards covering Ertz over Chung, Chung cover Agholor over Rowe, and Rowe manning the CB2 position over Butler (on top of Bademosi even being on the field at all) are match-ups that you love, you agree with me on that.

As for your last sentence, that doesn’t make sense at all as a counter argument. If Butler was injured, he would have been physically incapable of playing. Butler wasn’t injured. He dressed for the game. He just simply wasn’t used and the coaching staff instead opted for a game plan that got shredded to the tune of 41 points.
I'm not saying Butler was injured I'm saying had he been injured the game plan would have been the same. The point is players miss games all the time and schemes and plans get adjusted accordingly and players still are expected to execute regardless. Butler's absence does not let everyone else's mistakes get ignored or somehow blamed on Bill.

Again my problem is not that you say BB deserves blame it's that you seem to think he is the only one who does.
 
I'm not saying Butler was injured I'm saying had he been injured the game plan would have been the same. The point is players miss games all the time and schemes and plans get adjusted accordingly and players still are expected to execute regardless. Butler's absence does not let everyone else's mistakes get ignored or somehow blamed on Bill.

Again my problem is not that you say BB deserves blame it's that you seem to think he is the only one who does.
Making a mistake is not a problem. Refusing to correct it is.
 
As a life long Patriots fan, I think I’d be nuts to not love both Belichick and Brady equally....salt & pepper to me.

I love Brady’s fire and calmness and I love having Belichick’s hard-ass nature. I couldn’t stand Pete Carroll...heck, I still can’t stand that gum chewing, back-slapping cheerleader

As for the appearance of a controversy? Meh, I don’t care either way because Brady isn’t going to retire and Kraft isn’t going to fire Belichick. If anyone hopes or thinks otherwise, pass the bong
 
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