Cooks traded to Rams for 23 overall pick

[Triumph]

Randy Moss catch % in New England (full seasons only):

61.3
55.2
60.6

Deep ball receivers are going to have lower catch percentages.

Read my last post for an education.

Its free no charge.

 

[Deus Irae]

Read my last post for an education.

Its free no charge.

I don't need to, thanks. I was pointing out the problem with your particular claim, not arguing that Cooks didn't have some weaknesses in his game. Your percentage argument was a poor one. Your pointing to Cooks struggles more specifically is a better way to go.

That bit of education for you is also free of charge.

 

[maineman209]

There were some whispers that there were "issues" impacting his NFL future that would lead to a tumble to the 4th or 5th rounds. I'm extrapolating here but I'd guess those were the clots.

Maybe the "whispers" were simply about him having difficulty keeping weight on?

It seems to me that if the condition he has that caused his lung clots were detectable to the degree that teams could have known about it, it would've shown up definitively in the Combine medical and that would have been news.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Sorry Rob when some of us was saying he was the BB disciples didn't think so...most on PatsFans.com "bend with the wind". If BB trades Gronk right now the disciples would find a way to spin it. Like I said in my original post hypocrites are never wrong and it's plain to see why.

Well, as most know I'm a total BB Fanboy/Apologist but I think with Cooks its was and interesting situation. Generically hes a WR1 but he wasn't a a rock star here. I think in this offense he was a valuable and important piece but not a critical one. Obviously BB felt the same way.

I feel pretty comfortable saying BB went into acquiring Cooks with eyes wide open and an open mind. If Cooks evolved into THE piece in this offense and put up transcendent numbers BB might have made an all-out effort to pay him close to market for a WR1- but he didn't. He had a helluva year but as BB saw the WR market develop, JE11s rehab, Gronk settling in, Tom performing well and the defensive needs and 8.5m in cap space to use for extensions (Shaq? TB12?) he made the deal and got his 1st rounder back.

 

[long distance]

Some numbers on Cooks, especially on third down:



Cooks was just 3-of-12 when targeted on 3rd-and-5 or less during the regular season, and Brady only targeted him twice on third down overall in the postseason (0-for-2).

Great point.

 

[dafoe2016]

That's why he has the worst record in football, right?

What a stupid question that does nothing to discount my observation. How did that work out for him in 2006 when he tried to win a playoff game with zero NFL recievers? Or 2005 with no LBs, etc?

Being bare at one position is not going to even almost make you the worst team in football. It can and usually will prevent you from winning a title, though.

God forbid anybody say anything even remotely critical of Bill here. The koolaid drinkers will spring to his defense like somebody just insulted their mother. Even at the most benign comment. It's very cult like.

 

[dafoe2016]

I would never draft a WR #1. Neither would Bill. That's why he's the greatest of all time and you're a below average troll.

You can read Bill's mind? Amazing! Sad that you are so intellectually limited you can't make a decent argument so you just throw the T word around. Pathetic.

 

[PatsFan2]

What a stupid question that does nothing to discount my observation. How did that work out for him in 2006 when he tried to win a playoff game with zero NFL recievers? Or 2005 with no LBs, etc?

Being bare at one position is not going to even almost make you the worst team in football. It can and usually will prevent you from winning a title, though.

God forbid anybody say anything even remotely critical of Bill here. The koolaid drinkers will spring to his defense like somebody just insulted their mother. Even at the most benign comment. It's very cult like.[/QUOTE]

Great minds think alike dafoe couldn't agree more.

 

[Triumph]

I don't need to, thanks. I was pointing out the problem with your particular claim, not arguing that Cooks didn't have some weaknesses in his game. Your percentage argument was a poor one. Your pointing to Cooks struggles more specifically is a better way to go.

That bit of education for you is also free of charge.

Youre still not paying attention.

How you managed this one, but its new territory for you. Youre arguing against and agreeing in regards to the post that I made to guy who said that " Cooks 57% had to do with all the longer passes his way which are more difficult to complete"

They are, but Cooks struggled in other areas contributing to his mediocre catch rate which is below NE standards.

Thank you for your support.

 

[Deus Irae]

Youre still not paying attention.

How you managed this one, but its new territory for you. Youre arguing against and agreeing in regards to the post that I made to guy who said that " Cooks 57% had to do with all the longer passes his way which are more difficult to complete"

They are, but Cooks struggled in other areas contributing to his mediocre catch rate which is below NE standards.

Thank you for your support.

I'm paying attention just fine. It's really not my fault that you choose not to grasp the difference between noting that deeper ball receivers will have lower catch percentages and arguing that certain specific drops/incompletes lowered a particular player's catch percentage. Moss dropped/failed to catch some shorter passes during his time in N.E., too, in case you didn't know that.

 

[rochrist]

I don’t recall anyone saying they hated him, just that they were underwhelmed. If you asked me before last season if he would be closer to a Randy Moss type gamebreaker (not statswise before everyone loses their minds) or a Brandon Lloyd type stats by volume of targets I would’ve thought he would have been much closer to Moss.

He is closer to Moss. Brandon Lloyd played 12 seasons and exceeded 1000 yards exactly once. Cooks has done it 3 straight seasons before he turned 25.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Well, as most know I'm a total BB Fanboy/Apologist but I think with Cooks its was and interesting situation. Generically hes a WR1 but he wasn't a a rock star here. I think in this offense he was a valuable and important piece but not a critical one. Obviously BB felt the same way.

I feel pretty comfortable saying BB went into acquiring Cooks with eyes wide open and an open mind. If Cooks evolved into THE piece in this offense and put up transcendent numbers BB might have made an all-out effort to pay him close to market for a WR1- but he didn't. He had a helluva year but as BB saw the WR market develop, JE11s rehab, Gronk settling in, Tom performing well and the defensive needs and 8.5m in cap space to use for extensions (Shaq? TB12?) he made the deal and got his 1st rounder back.

I think there's also an element of people overstating Cooks' athletic abilities, at least to some extent. What was really eye-opening for me was when, immediately after the initial trade that brought him here, @patfanken pointed out that in all of his highlights, you'd never see him break a tackle. And... yeah, he was pretty much right. Add that to the fact that, as adept as he was at high-pointing the ball, he's still 5'9", and you have a receiver with very real limitations that I think preclude him from ever becoming the kind of WR he's going to be paid to be a year from now.

This tweet kinda echoes my own thoughts on him, thoughts that as recently as a couple days ago would get your roasted pretty hard here:



Cooks and Brady are both so good that they made it work--they were too good not to--but it was never a great fit. I'd take a WR who is either bigger or more agile any day, at the expense of Cooks' straight-line speed. The ideal deep threat in a Brady offense has size and hands first, with the ability to run a diverse set of routes that allow him to threaten the sidelines or the inside of the field. Cooks, for all his strengths, just isn't that guy. It's not a knock on Cooks, he did very well in New Orleans, he did very well here, and he'll do very well in LA. He's a hell of a player. But I am confident that the Pats can get 80% of his production for less than half of what he'll get in FA next year.

 

[jefmblrd]

I liked Cooks but if reports that they couldn't get a contract done are true, then shipping him out for a number one is a good deal.

 

[203Pat]

He is closer to Moss. Brandon Lloyd played 12 seasons and exceeded 1000 yards exactly once. Cooks has done it 3 straight seasons before he turned 25.

I’m talking about his season with us not careers.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Well, the draft certainly became more interesting.

 

[Soliel]

I feel better about this trade now. I get accused quite often of over reacting to things. Of course, when people say that, I usually scream insults and go into a tirade.

I really hoped cooks would be kept. The rumor about him not doing a deal after saying he wanted to be pats for life, that and reading some posts about the reasoning helped me see it’s for the best.

Now it’s time for a “cooks is a bum” thread?

 

[MrNathanDrake]

If anything, this trade just makes me miss Amendola more.


Cooks wasnt going to be worth the money he will inevitably get. Easily 15+ Million. He's not a true #1 WR and he isn't dominant.

He disappeared in December. He choked the 2 times he touched the ball in the SB. Good WR but not worth 15+ Million.

 

[Brady6]

B6 with all do respect it seemed like anything or anybody was fetching a First Round pick. Jimmy should have fetched a First Rounder or at the very least Two Second Rounders on Potential alone. It's a business BB should have trade his @ss to Cleveland for a haul.

Jimmy was worth that during the draft last season. When you are at mid-season and it is clear you’re going to have to pay him max money his value goes down. At the time of the trade the 49ers first round pick was #1 or #2 overall. They were not going to trade that for Garoppolo.

 

[PatsFan2]

I think there's also an element of people overstating Cooks' athletic abilities, at least to some extent. What was really eye-opening for me was when, immediately after the initial trade that brought him here, @patfanken pointed out that in all of his highlights, you'd never see him break a tackle. And... yeah, he was pretty much right. Add that to the fact that, as adept as he was at high-pointing the ball, he's still 5'9", and you have a receiver with very real limitations that I think preclude him from ever becoming the kind of WR he's going to be paid to be a year from now.

This tweet kinda echoes my own thoughts on him, thoughts that as recently as a couple days ago would get your roasted pretty hard here:



Cooks and Brady are both so good that they made it work--they were too good not to--but it was never a great fit. I'd take a WR who is either bigger or more agile any day, at the expense of Cooks' straight-line speed. The ideal deep threat in a Brady offense has size and hands first, with the ability to run a diverse set of routes that allow him to threaten the sidelines or the inside of the field. Cooks, for all his strengths, just isn't that guy. It's not a knock on Cooks, he did very well in New Orleans, he did very well here, and he'll do very well in LA. He's a hell of a player. But I am confident that the Pats can get 80% of his production for less than half of what he'll get in FA next year.

That tweet is not news to some here only to the BB apologists the flaws in Cooks game could be clearly seen. But some of them and I wont list names too much to list would tell you even before the trade that Cooks is a better WR than OBJ.

 

[Triumph]

I'm paying attention just fine. It's really not my fault that you choose not to grasp the difference between noting that deeper ball receivers will have lower catch percentages and arguing that certain specific drops/incompletes lowered a particular player's catch percentage. Moss dropped/failed to catch some shorter passes during his time in N.E., too, in case you didn't know that.

You still dont get it.

I never disputed that long pass attempts are not low percentage completions. Youre confused and all mixed up. Cooks low percentage rate was not solely because of deep balls.

I dont have time to show you, but more articles are coming out in regards to keeping Hogan and letting Cooks go. Exactly what I have saying. We learn today that Brady is not sad to see Cooks leave. But, you keep rambling on incoherently about deep passes and more drops as justification that Cooks was wronged.