Roster Projections, after preseason Game 3 at Detroit

[RobertWeathers]

This is worthless but what the hell..

QB (3) T.Brady, J.Garoppolo, J.Brissett
RB (5) M.Gillislee, J.Develin, D.Lewis, R.Burkhead, J.White
WR (5) B.Cooks, M.Mitchell, D.Amendola, A.Carr, C.Hogan
TE (2) R.Gronkowski, D.Allen
C (1) D.Andrews
G (3) S.Mason, J.Thuney, T.Karras
T (4) N.Solder, L.Waddle, C.Fleming, M.Cannon
DE (4) D.Wise, D.Rivers, G.Grissom, T.Flowers
DT (5) A.Branch, M.Brown, A.Butler, L.Guy, V.Valentine
ILB(4) D.Harris, H.Langi, E.Roberts, D.Hightower
OLB(3) K.VanNoy, S.McClellin, J.Freeny
CB (6) M.Butler, S.Gilmore, J.Jones, C.Jones, K.Moore, E.Rowe
SS (3) P.Chung, B.King, N.Ebner
FS (2) D.McCourty, D.Harmon
ST (3) S.Gostkowski, R.Allen, J.Cardona

I suspect there are 3 players that are on my list which will be gone as right now those 3 replacements are on another team.

I anticipate a handful of trades and signings prior to opening night

 

[ashley]

Alot of people's projections include Jordan Richards....I don't see it, he's just not that good.

I think everyone has Butler now making the team.

Going to be interesting to see how many WR's we keep now with Edelman gone for the year.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

• I hope Hogan can catch more passes this year, even though he's technically not being promoted (he was #2 last year, now he's #2 again).

Numerical designations like this are almost meaningless for Pats WRs.

 

[maineman209]

Are you saying that both Garcia and Rivers have to be on 53 man roster?

Actually, Miguel just tweeted about this very thing:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Before the 9/2 roster cutdowns all players with less than 4 accrued seasons are subject to waivers if placed on IR. <a href="Sara on Twitter">Sara on Twitter</a></p>&mdash; Cap Space=14,248,983 (@patscap) <a href="">August 27, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Pre-season officially ends Sept. 1st.
Official cutdown period begins Sept. 2nd.
All rosters must be down to 53 players by 4pm Sept. 3rd

So, the implication is that Rivers could be moved to IR Sept 2nd without passing through waivers, but moving Garcia (or any other non-vested veteran) to IR would have to wait until Sept. 4th - IF the Pats want to be able to bring him back from IR after 8 weeks. If the Pats DON'T want to bring Garcia back later in the season, they could move him to IR on the 2nd, along with Rivers.

 

[maineman209]

Numerical designations like this are almost meaningless for Pats WRs.

Agree. It's almost like saying that Branch is the #1 DL and Flowers is the #2.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Agree. It's almost like saying that Branch is the #1 DL and Flowers is the #2.

It's a little more meaningful for many positions, but it's not useful for the WRs or the RBs.

 

[maineman209]

Alot of people's projections include Jordan Richards....I don't see it, he's just not that good.

I think everyone has Butler now making the team.

Going to be interesting to see how many WR's we keep now with Edelman gone for the year.

Yeah, I'm pretty convinced that there's not much hope for Richards.

The problem I'm having is who backs up McCourty/Chung/Harmon? I'm definitely not counting on Ebner or King to fill in. For my projection, I went with Travis, but that's just as a placeholder. I really don't see him as being superior to Richards at this point.

I don't think that the Pats have a legit 4th safety currently on the roster - a guy who wouldn't be a disastrous downgrade if forced into service for an extended period due to injury. I think they probably have to trade for a guy or pick one up during cutdowns if they want an upgrade over the guys we have now, but I have no idea who that might be - or even if such a guy would be available.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

So, the implication is that Rivers could be moved to IR Sept 2nd without passing through waivers, but moving Garcia (or any other non-vested veteran) to IR would have to wait until Sept. 4th - IF the Pats want to be able to bring him back from IR after 8 weeks. If the Pats DON'T want to bring Garcia back later in the season, they could move him to IR on the 2nd, along with Rivers.

IMO this needs to change, so teams don't have to either expose rookies to waivers or hope that veterans remain on the shadow roster. I'd allow teams to put players on IR within 72 hours of the cutdown deadline and still allow DTR.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Alot of people's projections include Jordan Richards....I don't see it, he's just not that good.

I think everyone has Butler now making the team.

Going to be interesting to see how many WR's we keep now with Edelman gone for the year.

Richards has plateaued. Hes gone.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Yeah, I'm pretty convinced that there's not much hope for Richards.

The problem I'm having is who backs up McCourty/Chung/Harmon? I'm definitely not counting on Ebner or King to fill in. For my projection, I went with Travis, but that's just as a placeholder. I really don't see him as being superior to Richards at this point.

I don't think that the Pats have a legit 4th safety currently on the roster - a guy who wouldn't be a disastrous downgrade if forced into service for an extended period due to injury. I think they probably have to trade for a guy or pick one up during cutdowns if they want an upgrade over the guys we have now, but I have no idea who that might be - or even if such a guy would be available.

Ebner saw increased time backing up Chung last year. If he is not the answer then someone outside the org is.

 

[jah]

Slater, Garcia, McLellin and Lengel haven't practiced in weeks. Any or all of them could be headed for IR.

I'd say that Rivers is definitely headed to IR. Can't do it yet, though, without exposing him to waiver claims. Could send Edelman to IR now, though. As a vested vet, he's not subject to waiver claims.

Only reason I have Edelman off my 53 is because the team officially announced he's out for the season. Technically there's still a chance that Rivers plays this season because no official word has been given, so I'm just hedging my bets by keeping him on my projection.

Who do you put on the team if McClellin goes to IR? Has to be some outside edge player, I assume.

 

[kennyb]

Cuts:
Grissom
Cy jones
Richards
Fleming
Lengel
Freeney

Makes it:
Langi
Butler
Hollister te
Crosson-dwich
Waddle
Foster
Carr

4 udfa! "4 inches from your chest pyle! 4 inches!".

Ir to return: garcia, slater

A clean break from disastrous picks of the past

 

[jah]

At LEAST Carr, Hollister & Moore NEVER make it to the PS.

Hollister and Moore really haven't shown that much. Carr could very well sneak through too.

 

[patchick]

One more shot in the dark...

Assumptions: Rivers to IR before cutdowns, Garcia after cutdowns. Another TE is added after Garcia is IR'ed.
Hardest cut: Brandon King.

QB (3) T.Brady, J.Garoppolo, J.Brissett
RB (5) M.Gillislee, R.Burkhead, J.White, J.Develin, D.Lewis
WR (5) B.Cooks, C.Hogan, M.Mitchell, D.Amendola, A.Carr,
TE (2) R.Gronkowski, D.Allen
C (1) D.Andrews
G (4) S.Mason, J.Thuney, T.Karras, C. Croston
T (4) N.Solder, M.Cannon, C.Fleming, A. Garcia
DL (8) D.Wise, G.Grissom, T.Flowers, A.Branch, M.Brown, A.Butler, L.Guy, V.Valentine
LB (6) D.Hightower, D.Harris, H.Langi, E.Roberts, K.VanNoy, S.McClellin
CB (6) M.Butler, S.Gilmore, E.Rowe, J.Jones, C.Jones, K.Moore,
SS (3) P.Chung, N.Ebner, D. Travis
FS (2) D.McCourty, D.Harmon
ST (4) S.Gostkowski, R.Allen, J.Cardona, M. Slater

 

[SlowGettingUp]

So, the implication is that Rivers could be moved to IR Sept 2nd without passing through waivers

You mean Edelman? Rivers is another rookie.

A few years ago Belichick grabbed Ballard off of waived/injured so it definitely isn't safe to IR a good rookie prior to cut-down.

 

[maineman209]

You mean Edelman? Rivers is another rookie.

A few years ago Belichick grabbed Ballard off of waived/injured so it definitely isn't safe to IR a good rookie prior to cut-down.

The Pats claimed Ballard off waivers from the Giants in mid-June, 2012. Coughlin took a lot of heat for not waiting until cutdowns at the end of the pre-season to make that move.

DURING cutdowns, after the pre-season officially ends on Sept. 1st, it's apparently still possible to move a non-vested player like Rivers to IR without exposing them to waivers. However, a player must be on a team's 53-man roster AFTER cutdowns to be eligible to return to the team after 8 weeks.

 

[maineman209]

Only reason I have Edelman off my 53 is because the team officially announced he's out for the season. Technically there's still a chance that Rivers plays this season because no official word has been given, so I'm just hedging my bets by keeping him on my projection.

Who do you put on the team if McClellin goes to IR? Has to be some outside edge player, I assume.

I don't know that I do replace McLellin immediately. I'm considering Langi as a DE/OLB crossover.

Here's how I projected the front seven (numbers by group are pretty close to 2016):

(3) DT: Branch, Brown, Valentine
... Hamilton, Kilgo, Augusta WAIVED

(5) DL-edge: Flowers, Wise, A. Butler(DE/DT), Guy(DE/DT) ............... (+ Langi ST)
... Rivers > IR
... Keionta Davis > RESERVE/NFI
... Kidder, Grissom WAIVED

(5) LB: HT (OLB/DE), Van Noy (OLB/DE), Harris(ILB), Roberts (ILB).............. (+ Freeny OR Bates ST)
... McLellin -> IR-RETURN(2), Freeny temporarily released (veteran, not subject to waiver claims)
... Ellis WAIVED

 

[maineman209]

Ebner saw increased time backing up Chung last year. If he is not the answer then someone outside the org is.

Ebner had 18 total snaps on the defense in 2016.

Unless Travis has shown way more to the coaches than we've seen in pre-season games, I'd agree that it's someone not currently on the roster.

 

[patsbrasilpatriotas]

Neither Garcia nor Rivers can be sent to IR now without passing through waivers.

Players that a team may want to have return from IR during the season must be on the 53 after cutdowns.

In years past, when there were two cutdowns a week apart, a player could be sent to season-ending IR without having to pass through waivers during that week, IIRC. With only the one cutdown period this year, I don't know whether or not that special dispensation still applies.

If it does, Rivers could be sent to IR without being on the 53, since it's pretty clear his injury is season-ending. However, if the Pats want to bring Garcia back for the second half of the season, he will have to be on the 53 through the end of cutdowns and then sent to IR the next day.

However, the Pats have a couple-three roster-end veterans who they could cut for a day (e.g., Bolden, Freeny) and bring back the next in order to manage those transactions. Veterans aren't subject to waiver claims.

Actually, Miguel just tweeted about this very thing:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Before the 9/2 roster cutdowns all players with less than 4 accrued seasons are subject to waivers if placed on IR. <a href="Sara on Twitter">Sara on Twitter</a></p>&mdash; Cap Space=14,248,983 (@patscap) <a href="">August 27, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Pre-season officially ends Sept. 1st.
Official cutdown period begins Sept. 2nd.
All rosters must be down to 53 players by 4pm Sept. 3rd

So, the implication is that Rivers could be moved to IR Sept 2nd without passing through waivers, but moving Garcia (or any other non-vested veteran) to IR would have to wait until Sept. 4th - IF the Pats want to be able to bring him back from IR after 8 weeks. If the Pats DON'T want to bring Garcia back later in the season, they could move him to IR on the 2nd, along with Rivers.

Now I get it, Thank You. So i was wrong but the result IMO will be the same. They will place both (Garcia and Rivers) on the IR list. They will carry only 8 OL IMO, and Fleming will be our emergency backup. Croston can play as a G so he will win tha battle against Waddle. The others are well known. Do you know if Garcia can practice if he's on IR?

 

[maineman209]

Richards has plateaued. Hes gone.

If by "plateaued", you mean "face-planted".