Butler & Saints working towards finalizing a deal (Thread now UFC Pats Fans Event)

[Ring 6]

Of course it would. If he signs the tender, he can't shop himself around, talk to teams without NE's permission, visit facilities, etc etc.

At this point in time, he gains absolutely nothing by signing the tender. He may do a sign-and-trade in the near future, but he gains nothing signing it today.

What are you talking about?if he signs the tender he is an RFA who can go get an offer sheet from any team willing to give up a 1.
The NFL does not do sign and trades.

If no team is willing to give up a 1 he is actually hurting himself because the patriots cannot discuss trades until the tender is signed.

It sounds like you think he gives up his RFA status if he signs the tender and that is not correct.

 

[XLIX]

I am not saying I agree with this approach, I am not saying I disagree with this approach. But the "legit reason" to take #32 is this:

BB may have to decide to between the #32 pick or 1 year of Malcolm Butler then losing him for nothing (other than entering him into the formula of compensatory picks). If those are indeed his only 2 options, and based on past behavior, it is entirely reasonable to think he may choose #32.

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

It's not about leverage
Simply this
I believe patriots are quite happy with status quo
Patriots do not have to do anything
If Saints want butler, onus is all on them to make it happen

I think smart think for Pats is to walk away and keep Butler
End of story

It's a win win situation for the pats in mt mind. Maybe the saints can offer us more than number 32.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

What are you talking about?if he signs the tender he is an RFA who can go get an offer sheet from any team willing to give up a 1.
The NFL does not do sign and trades.

If no team is willing to give up a 1 he is actually hurting himself because the patriots cannot discuss trades until the tender is signed.

It sounds like you think he gives up his RFA status if he signs the tender and that is not correct.

That's not correct.

He's an RFA now. Once he signs NE's tender is no longer an RFA but instead is a regular, under contract player who can no longer even (legally) whisper to any team other than NE without NE's permission. Signing your team's tender offer is signing a contract.

 

[Edelmania]

It looks like the Saints are asking for a favor from Belichick... but it'd be foolish for New England to accept anything less in value, or at make #11 the starting point for trade talks

Seriously.... why would New England just willingly give up their leverage and accept less?

Its not a favor... if NO is only willing to give up say 32, and NE values 32 more than 1 year of Butler then it makes sense. Its not a favor.

 

[IllegalContact]

I am not saying I agree with this approach, I am not saying I disagree with this approach. But the "legit reason" to take #32 is this:

BB may have to decide to between the #32 pick or 1 year of Malcolm Butler then losing him for nothing (other than entering him into the formula of compensatory picks). If those are indeed his only 2 options, and based on past behavior, it is entirely reasonable to think he may choose #32.

Draft picks are overrated for the current patriots

 

[Nunchucks]

I think belichick is perfectly happy to have butler play the season and then walk. Keeping him makes the team better.

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

Draft picks are overrated for the current patriots

I like this draft but having butler back would be better than any draft pick at number 32. That's how i feel about it.

 

[JMC00]

Check this out :



What a snarky little *****. We all know he has limited FA right, dumbass, but the RESTRICTED piece makes all the difference. What a little prick talking down to us like that.

Giradi is my most hated Boston mediot. Which is saying a lot Guy is just a smug prick His job is to hold the f**kng mic and ask Curran questions but because twitter is a thing he acts like he is important.

 

[XLIX]

What are you talking about?if he signs the tender he is an RFA who can go get an offer sheet from any team willing to give up a 1.

I do not believe this is correct. I would have to check the CBA to verify this. My impression has always been that if he actually signs the tender, he is then considered under contract with the Patriots, which limits his ability to talk freely with other teams, receive formal offer sheets, visit facilities, etc.

The NFL does not do sign and trades.

Yes we have already established several days ago that officially this is correct, but unofficially a sign-and-trade is what, for all intents and purposes, could happen (similar to the Welker trade).

If no team is willing to give up a 1 he is actually hurting himself because the patriots cannot discuss trades until the tender is signed.

Of course they can. You are not allowed to tender a player in bad faith for the purposes of restricting their movement, but NE and NO most certainly can discuss hypotheticals such as "would you take the #32 for Butler if we come to a separate contract agreement with him?"

 

[RobertWeathers]

Check this out :



What a snarky little *****. We all know he has limited FA right, dumbass, but the RESTRICTED piece makes all the difference. What a little prick talking down to us like that.

Giardi is really a jerk.

He's trying to be a Felger/Curren combo and he sucks at both

 

[slash83]

Only reason I want the Pats having a 1st rounder is to see Goddell announce them as SB Champs one more time, that ass hole.

 

[fnordcircle]

Only reason I want the Pats having a 1st rounder is to see Goddell announce them as SB Champs one more time, that ass hole.

This is so petty and silly.

I love it. Count me in.

 

[farn]

While I hope Butler suits up for the Patriots this year - it's a bit silly to say with certainty that he will be better than a draft pick. Truth : we can't be sure. After beating Seattle in the big game, I'd never imagined Jones for a third & fourth (after NE traded down from a 2nd) would yield anything close to his production.

Thuney & Mitchell, though neither was near all pro in 2016, were both very solid contributors to a SB run. Both played key roles in key spots in the big game a few months ago.

We'll see what transpires. Some (Lombardi) think Butler plays for NE in 2017. I think he plays for the Saints. We'll see. I'm open to either, because at this point it's silly to argue w BB. He isn't always right. But he's right almost all the time. And his success is beyond reproach.

 

[fnordcircle]

I'd just really like to see what our defense would be like with both Gilmore and Butler. Plus after losing Adam I really want Butler to be a Patriot for life. You only get so many Superbowl heroes in a lifetime.

I don't fault Butler at all and I'm sure this is an emotionally charged issue for him. But I do wish he'd consider what his life will be like after his NFL career is over.

In New England he'll be immortal. In New Orleans he'll be a guy who played for the Saints. In New England he'll have endorsement opportunities until he dies. I hope he's factoring that into his choices no matter how hot he might be about it all right now.

 

[Mack Herron]

Sounds like BB really doesn't want to trade MB.

That isn't the right question. The question is the value BB places on Butler. All I can say is it's somewhere between $3.9M (or what was offered last year) and the Gilmore deal. Or whatever the market is in draft picks, which is also unknown.

 

[JarOfMayo51]

You can't franchise everyone. They may quite likely have bigger fish to fry with that tag.

Nate Solder would be a likely candidate for the tag if they can't work something out and don't have a viable replacement for him yet

Potential candidates:
Jimmy Garoppolo QB 25 NE TBD $870,975 UFA
Nate Solder LT 28 NE TBD $10,031,000 UFA
Malcolm Butler CB 27 NE TBD $3,910,000 UFA

Kony Ealy DE 25 NE TBD $886,707 UFA (Highly, highly unlikely)

Rest of 2018 free agents per spotrac.com:
Julian Edelman WR 30 NE $4,250,000 UFA
Danny Amendola WR 31 NE $4,050,000 UFA
Rob Ninkovich DE 33 NE $3,500,000 UFA
Rex Burkhead RB 26 NE $3,150,000 UFA
Matthew Slater WR 31 NE $1,800,000 UFA
Cameron Fleming T 24 NE $1,797,000 UFA
Dion Lewis RB 26 NE $1,300,000 UFA
Kyle Van Noy OLB 25 NE $1,275,524 UFA
Nate Ebner FS 27 NE $1,200,000 UFA
LaAdrian Waddle RT 25 NE $1,200,000 UFA
Robert Housler TE 29 NE $775,000 UFA
James White RB 25 NE $654,272 UFA

 

[TomPatriot]

NO will give back the 32. NE wants the 11. There's an obvious compromise - NE gets the 32 plus other lesser picks/players and I'd bet that's what they are haggling over. MB probably isn't playing in NE in 2017, but he doesn't necessarily have to play for NO either. NE can match any offer sheet and try to trade him. My guess is neither team wants that.

At the end of the day, maybe Goodell makes the decision as to which No.1 goes to NE. No one wants that either. Knowing that clown, Butler will have to sit out a year and both Saints 1s will be forfeited because . . . "integrity."

 

[long distance]

1. Giving Butler long-term contract that will satisfy him + whatever satisfies BB in trade was always a long-shot. Calling it 50/50 is optimistic even for MB camp. The only way this can get done is if someone/or both parties give something up. How realistic is that is up to speculations. That's what Lombardi was talking about. If Butler gives up part of his “satisfaction“ then NO must still count on two things NE gives up: matching a possibly good long-term deal and the #11 pick. That's way beyond respect SP and BB have for each other unless its part of gentlemen's agreement from Cooks trade. And how realistic is that?

I think for the moment it is indeed more reasonable to believe Butler will stay.

2. We can know one thing though: BB will not waste one moment speculating on Butler's behaviour. If he decides to keep him he'll simply expect Butler to give the team 100%. When he sees on the field proof of the contrary - he'll trade him for whatever he can get at that moment in time like he did w JC and others before.

 

[Keyser Söze]

#11 would make it sting a lot less