No GRONK: people may say it doesn't matter, but it matters

[Tuck]

I wouldn't say, Gronk's absence doesn't matter. I'd say this year's team is so damn deep and healthy relative to how they entered the playoffs last year that it just doesn't matter.

 

[mosslost]

You fell right in to what i was saying, i know the Pats can win against Miami on the road in the regular season with or without 87 because Brady is that good he makes you forget that he was there to start with. But the post season is a whole different animal, there is no let's rest Brady in the 4th scenario and i go right back to what i said - i believe in Marty and his ability so for the sake of our team let's hope he is that guy in January and (fingers crossed) Febrauary

there are at most three games left, 1 a layup, and frankly the second is a "should win" maybe not a blow out.. but a should win. Then you have one game for all the marbles. Nothing monumental at all about it. If fact, it is a guarantee that a Gronk-less team from somewhere is going to win this Super Bowl.

 

[English Patriot]

Not really monumental. The AFC is ****, Gronk or no Gronk. Someone is winning the SB this year without Gronk. The Pats have 2 home games, 1 is a total joke by your own admission.. then a one game championship. They alread did the 14-2 HFA thing. Winning this SB will be nice if they can do it, but monumental.. well that is a "monumental" stretch of hyperbole.

I won't tempt fate and call Pittsburgh or Kansas '****'. You don't know for sure if we get in a hole against either of those and that moment you may just need Gronk but don't have him, so you better pray someone can make the kind of play he does. The SB will be the cream of the crop on the NFC and you damn sure need someone to be Gronk level elite on offense to win that game.

 

[mosslost]

I wouldn't say, Gronk's absence doesn't matter. I'd say this years team is so damn deep and healthy relative to how they entered the playoffs last year that just it doesn't matter.

this years team with no Gronk, is way better off than last year's team at the end, with Gronk. Not even close.

 

[mosslost]

I won't tempt fate and call Pittsburgh or Kansas '****'. You don't know for sure if we get in a hole against either of those and that moment you may just need Gronk but don't have him, so you better pray someone can make the kind of play he does. The SB will be the cream of the crop on the NFC and you damn sure need someone to be Gronk level elite on offense to win that game.

it's football... it's 3 games.. We should win them.. Nothing monumental if they pull it off. Gronk or no Gronk, just a nice championship. They already have 4 you know.

 

[English Patriot]

I absolutely love Gronkowski. He is an incredible talent, and I believe he is the best non-QB in the entire NFL over everyone, including a healthy JJ Watt, Antonio Brown, or Julio Jones. That said, it was very eye opening when I heard a Las Vegas oddsmaker explain the impact of losing Gronkowski on the point spread. Would you like to know how much the line is adjusted with him out? 1 point. And beyond that, the Patriots Super Bowl chances dropped about 2-3% when he went out. So yes, he is an incredible player and a big loss for the team, but the reality from people who truly understand football - where you have 22 players on the field - is that any position outside of quarterback is really not going to massively change a team's chances of winning games. Absolutely, there are situations where I think Gronkowski would have made the difference - SB46 being the most memorable and painful - but let's remember that even in that game, and in many games, the Patriots were certainly capable of winning. In addition, there have been plenty of games where even with a healthy Gronkowski, they offense has struggled.

Just curious, what do you think the Texans record would have been this season had JJ Watt remained healthy? I'm guessing 9-7. And what would the spread by on Saturday for this game with a healthy Watt? Maybe a difference of a point at most?

JJ Watt is not Gronk and the only thing he can do is sack a QB or tackle a runner should he get by the opposing lineman. Taking away a number 1 option on offense in today's NFL is a WAY bigger loss.

Listen i got faith in Tom to what he does regardless, put a postman out there and he'll still get the ball to him but i don't think people should be thinking that just because our complimentary pieces look very good as opposed to years past that not having him is irrelevant.

 

[DaBronxPats14]

Yes losing Gronk is a always a big loss for us at anytime. He creates mismatches at TE that could not be duplicated but going into Playoffs this year we're more balanced on Offense with being stocked at receiver, have our three RBs healthy and a different kind of Blount that came into his own as a go to guy and clock killer. Bennett at TE solid and Ghost is out of his funk. I like our chances.

 

[English Patriot]

Agreed that this post season instead of murder via a Gronk dagger it's going to be murder via a committee of swiss army knives.

 

[mosslost]

JJ Watt is not Gronk and the only thing he can do is sack a QB or tackle a runner should he get by the opposing lineman. Taking away a number 1 option on offense in today's NFL is a WAY bigger loss.

Listen i got faith in Tom to what he does regardless, put a postman out there and he'll still get the ball to him but i don't think people should be thinking that just because our complimentary pieces look very good as opposed to years past that not having him is irrelevant.

We have had better teams in the past with no Gronk.

 

[mosslost]

Agreed that this post season instead of murder via a Gronk dagger it's going to be murder via a committee of swiss army knives.

You talk about Gronk like he has 6 rings.

 

[English Patriot]

You talk about Gronk like he has 6 rings.

And you talk about him as if every single team doesn't spend hours a week figuring how they are going to slow him down because they know they can't stop him. We have differing opinions, it's cool.

 

[bormio]

Very true but the notion that he goes down but it's ok we go on is very insulting to someone who is already in the conversation for best TE ever. At the very least we are in a better position to succeed this time round but like i said monumental if this team pulls it off.

It is not insulting, it is reality. The team does go on. If Brady got hurt, they would plug in JG and still try to win the SB. Certainly with less of a chance, but still that would be their goal.

 

[mosslost]

And you talk about him as if every single team doesn't spend hours a week figuring how they are going to slow him down because they know they can't stop him. We have differing opinions, it's cool.

its not really my opinion. It will not be monumental if they win. It's three football games. They have a really good chance at the first two, and they could win the third one simply because they are a great team. They have won 4 other Super Bowls, 49 Super Bowls have been won by teams with no Gronk, soon to be 50. There is nothing "monumental" about it if they pull it off.

 

[TBR]

I absolutely love Gronkowski. He is an incredible talent, and I believe he is the best non-QB in the entire NFL over everyone, including a healthy JJ Watt, Antonio Brown, or Julio Jones. That said, it was very eye opening when I heard a Las Vegas oddsmaker explain the impact of losing Gronkowski on the point spread. Would you like to know how much the line is adjusted with him out? 1 point. And beyond that, the Patriots Super Bowl chances dropped about 2-3% when he went out. So yes, he is an incredible player and a big loss for the team, but the reality from people who truly understand football - where you have 22 players on the field - is that any position outside of quarterback is really not going to massively change a team's chances of winning games. Absolutely, there are situations where I think Gronkowski would have made the difference - SB46 being the most memorable and painful - but let's remember that even in that game, and in many games, the Patriots were certainly capable of winning. In addition, there have been plenty of games where even with a healthy Gronkowski, they offense has struggled.

Just curious, what do you think the Texans record would have been this season had JJ Watt remained healthy? I'm guessing 9-7. And what would the spread by on Saturday for this game with a healthy Watt? Maybe a difference of a point at most?

I wouldn't put much stock into Vegas point spreads & odds. They didn't alter them very much because they know people still love to bet the Pats. They set them to make money. They're not really meant to predict outcomes.

 

[archstanton543]

I

That's why i say i can't see the Pats getting any better on Offense from here on out instead it will be more of a 'can we survive and make it over the line' sort of Offense without Gronk.

The Pats can get better on offense as Danny Amendola will be back for the playoffs.

You're sweating it. Don't. They've been without a Gronk for most of the season and they won 14 games and their offense has been great all year (not to mention balanced between run and pass).

 

[Ring 6]

Is it possible that the excellence/greatness that our QB shows devalues just how important #87 is? You see a lot of people in New England media and the football media in general say it simply doesn't matter as long as #12 is being #12 on gameday. That may be true to a certain extent but take away any number 1 receiver from their team and see how good they are in the playoffs.

That's why i say i can't see the Pats getting any better on Offense from here on out instead it will be more of a 'can we survive and make it over the line' sort of Offense without Gronk. What i mean by that is, having 87 on the field elevates this offense to the point where on 3rd and 16 you almost expect to pick up 25 yards let alone the 16 even against the toughest of defense. However when you don't have him 3rd and 16 becomes more of 'this will take an oustanding effort to make this' kind of play. That's what we will be missing and especially as the calibre of opposing Defenses and pressure rises.

Go ask the #12 in Green Bay how difficult it's going to be in Dallas to get out of a a sticky 3rd and long this weekend without Jordy Nelson. People are overlooking this because we haven't had Gronk for a while now and because #12 is superhuman and doesn't miss a beat we assume everything is ok. But look at the plays in the big moments that Gronk made in the post season when we had him out there. We are all hoping it will be Bennett that could make the type of play that Gronk made before half time against Seattle for the TD in the SB for example but at this stage it is just hope even though he has that ability in him.

I will never ever doubt the greatest QB ever to find a way but even Brady pulling off another Super Bowl run without the biggest game changer there is in the NFL will be nothing short of monumental in my opinion because every team needs their go to guy to reach the promise land.

I'll let you in on a secret. No one else has a gronk either.

 

[Ring 6]

I absolutely love Gronkowski. He is an incredible talent, and I believe he is the best non-QB in the entire NFL over everyone, including a healthy JJ Watt, Antonio Brown, or Julio Jones. That said, it was very eye opening when I heard a Las Vegas oddsmaker explain the impact of losing Gronkowski on the point spread. Would you like to know how much the line is adjusted with him out? 1 point. And beyond that, the Patriots Super Bowl chances dropped about 2-3% when he went out. So yes, he is an incredible player and a big loss for the team, but the reality from people who truly understand football - where you have 22 players on the field - is that any position outside of quarterback is really not going to massively change a team's chances of winning games. Absolutely, there are situations where I think Gronkowski would have made the difference - SB46 being the most memorable and painful - but let's remember that even in that game, and in many games, the Patriots were certainly capable of winning. In addition, there have been plenty of games where even with a healthy Gronkowski, they offense has struggled.

Just curious, what do you think the Texans record would have been this season had JJ Watt remained healthy? I'm guessing 9-7. And what would the spread by on Saturday for this game with a healthy Watt? Maybe a difference of a point at most?

That's because they are still considered the best without him. If it were a mediocre team that lost gronk it would end their season.

 

[mosi]

Gronk is amazing and more importantly, Gronk and Brady are magic. Go back and watch last years AFCGC. Watch the Seattle game for that matter. Gronk, like Brady, is a once in a lifetime player (if your team is lucky!).

If the Pats can win this year without him, it will be a huge accomplishment. With him, I think they could win the Superbowl by 10+.

 

[bormio]

There is a valid point to the OP's position though - Gronk is a matchup that can still make big plays against great defenses when we are in a tight spot. Think of him matched up against a LB for the 2nd TD in SB49. Or the 2 huge first down catches on the final drive of that game - including the one for 20 yards after the Amendola penalty. Or the 2 unbelievable 4th down catches vs Denver (and was open on the 2 pt play). We have other great players, but we will miss his massive presence in big moments. Fortunately we will probably not being playing any great defenses.

 

[LightSkinSmurf]

I don't think anyone said having no gronk doesn't matter. Anyone who does is in the idiotic minority and should just be ignored.