Florio: A 1st and 4th for Garoppolo? Not so fast...

[SuperStang83]

Draft picks are so ridiculously over-rated! Teams treat first rounders like they are gold, but lets face it many of these picks never even pan out! Should have traded that pick away for the proven player.

 

[Ring 6]

Mallett and O'Connell disprove that theory. The players I mentioned disprove the "We need a first round draft pick to replace JAG" theory.

Basically, we've got a lot of people posting silly ****, on both sides of this equation.

Yeah that was my point.

 

[heavyde050]

Any team that prefers one of those JAGs to giving up a first & forth rounder for JG deserves to continue to wallow in mediocrity. Half of the players taken in the first round end up being JAGs or worse & the odds of finding a starting caliber player in the fourth round are roughly 20%.

IMHO, the Pats would be foolish to trade JG when Brady is about to turn 40 anyway. Every other QB who has ever played in the NFL lost it very quickly right around Brady's age. JG gives the Pats another 10 year championship window. Trading JG limits that window to another year or two.

The Pats have plenty of cap space & should just use it to ensure they are strong at the only position that really matters in the NFL. As long as Belichick has an above average QB, the Pats will contend to win every year. JG more than meets that criteria.

I really hope the JG optimism is correct, but I highly doubt he will lead the Pats to another 10 year championship window.
The Pats are always contending mostly because of Brady (and obviously BB).
I am firmly in the camp of maximizing Brady's last couple of years as the Pats are much closer to a title this year and through 2018 with one QB and using the valuable backup to acquire more talent.
If Jimmy G will happily wait until Brady retires that is option 1, but I just don't see him waiting.

 

[nabwong]

Basically Florio is saying....

The pats are selling a slightly used 2013 Subaru wrx with 2000 miles on it. But wait. Why would you buy that if there are other used cars available like a pt cruiser (kap), a Yugo (cutler), a 2000 range Rover (Romo) and 2007 Saturn relay (Bradford). But wait, you can also buy new like a Chrysler 200, Mitsubishi mirage or dodge journey.

 

[Deus Irae]

Congrats on your consistently and still wrong opinion, too.

I'm not wrong, and the JAG replacement is already on the roster.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm not wrong, and the JAG replacement is already on the roster.

I think people feel the jimmy g "replacement" would have to be a future hall of famer not a back up QB.

 

[Deus Irae]

I think people feel the jimmy g "replacement" would have to be a future hall of famer not a back up QB.

Yeah, it's insane. Apparently, they think the Patriots would gladly trade away a guy they think is the next Brady, if it'll bring back a first and a fourth.

 

[heavyde050]

Yeah, it's insane. Apparently, they think the Patriots would gladly trade away a guy they think is the next Brady, if it'll bring back a first and a fourth.

How do we know the Pats think that Jimmy G is the next Brady?
That seems like wishful thinking....I am sure Jimmy G will be a good starter some day, possibly a Pro Bowler, but I just don't see him being Brady.
I hope I am wrong, but even Steve Young wasn't Montana.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

The only way the Patriots trade JAG, even bringing back a 1st and a 4th, is if they think Brissett is the heir apparent. Neither pick would then likely be used on QB, unless a QB happened to be a hugh value pick in the 4th round or so.

 

[Deus Irae]

How do we know the Pats think that Jimmy G is the next Brady?

We don't, which is part of the point.

That seems like wishful thinking....

Absolutely

I am sure Jimmy G will be a good starter some day, possibly a Pro Bowler

I'm not sure, though I could certainly see it happening, if what we saw wasn't a fluke.

but I just don't see him being Brady.

Indeed. Tough to think that the GOAT is going to follow precisely on the heels of the GOAT.

I hope I am wrong, but even Steve Young wasn't Montana.

If he's Steve Young to Brady's Montana, he's not going anywhere.

 

[fnordcircle]

The only way the Patriots trade JAG, even bringing back a 1st and a 4th, is if they think Brissett is the heir apparent. Neither pick would then likely be used on QB, unless a QB happened to be a hugh value pick in the 4th round or so.

Ok but what if Brady is still playing at this level next year? Why does Jimmy sign with us with the high potential of sitting behind Brady in 2018 or even further?

 

[Ring 6]

The only way the Patriots trade JAG, even bringing back a 1st and a 4th, is if they think Brissett is the heir apparent. Neither pick would then likely be used on QB, unless a QB happened to be a hugh value pick in the 4th round or so.

Why? They can't keep Jimmy g long enough for him to be the heir. Brissett is what he is and it's probably a huge uncertainty at this point but if he isn't the future keeping garopollo an extra year wouldn't matter either way.

 

[Deus Irae]

Ok but what if Brady is still playing at this level next year? Why does Jimmy sign with us with the high potential of sitting behind Brady in 2018 or even further?

Franchise tag and bite the bullet. They've got the cap space.

 

[heavyde050]

We don't, which is part of the point.



Absolutely



I'm not sure, though I could certainly see it happening, if what we saw wasn't a fluke.



Indeed. Tough to think that the GOAT is going to follow precisely on the heels of the GOAT.



If he's Steve Young to Brady's Montana, he's not going anywhere.

I agree with everything you posted above. I am just saying that unless I was watching a different QB, Jimmy G never gave me the sense he was Steve Young to Brady's Montana.
Jimmy has played well in his limited work in his career culminating in an amazing first quarter against Miami.
From what I have seen, it would not be worth passing on a potential high round draft pick that would increase the odds of the Pats going to the SB in 2017 and 2018.
I also wholeheartedly agree that the Pats shouldn't just trade Jimmy to get rid of him now, but if he can bring back a high first or two high seconds (this year and next), it would be tough to keep him.
I trust BB will do whatever is best for the Pats.

 

[heavyde050]

Franchise tag and bite the bullet. They've got the cap space.

Wouldn't that allocation of cap space go against the strong team building that has led to BB's success?(I don't know the answer)

 

[Deus Irae]

Wouldn't that allocation of cap space go against the strong team building that has led to BB's success?(I don't know the answer)

It'd be a big hit, but they're going to have something like $65m (just rounding) in cap space for 2017, and they obviously don't have to shell out big buck to keep Jamie Collins around. That should make the 2018 cap number more easily manageable, and that's when the tag would hit the books.

Brady's contract runs through 2019. The Patriots can use the tags to keep JAG through 2019, and could then, theoretically, move on from a "going on 43 years old" Brady. It's doable, if they really think this is (healthy) Montana followed by Young.

 

[heavyde050]

It'd be a big hit, but they're going to have something like $65m (just rounding) in cap space for 2017, and they obviously don't have to shell out big buck to keep Jamie Collins around. That should make the 2018 cap number more easily manageable, and that's when the tag would hit the books.

Thanks for providing that update - that makes the keeping Jimmy option more realistic (as long as it doesn't interfere with extensions for Butler or Hightower this year).

 

[luuked]

You realize bortles threw for 4428 yards and 35 TDS a year ago, his second in the league, and was the #1 pick in the same draft JG went in the Second right?

Well I don't think a talent challenged team is going to give up on the 1 overall whonlooked good for a rookie, terrific in year 2 and took a step back, as much due to everyone around him as him, in year 3 so they can trade their #1 pick to get a guy drafted 60 some pucks later because he played well for a game and a half during those same 3 years. There is 0 chance of that. Imo

Well we disagree I guess. Jville is dumping bortles so they can trade a 1 for Jimmy g and if that's what McDaniels wants they won't be hiring him.

I disagree with your assessment of bortles.

Please go and actually watch Bortles footage. His mechanics are the worst that the league has seen since Tebow. He regressed so badly after he refused to keep working in the offseason on them with House that he should have been benched after 8 games.





I am sorry but if the Jags don't try to get another potential franchise QB via draft/trade and just cross their fingers that Bortles can somehow get back to 2015 then they are the garbage franchise that everyone thinks they are. It doesn't matter if Bortles was a first round pick or a fifth round pick when he was drafted three years ago, you gotta be able to evaluate your team each year anew and he definitely doesn't look like a good QB.

Now whether they are comfortable giving up high picks for JG is a different question that I have no strong opinion about but dismissing the possibility because of Bortles is laughable..

 

[deroc5050]

What does any of this have to do with what I posted?



That would depend on the reason(s) for going 3-13 or 2-12, and the QB class in the following draft.

I thought you said BB never used a 1st on a QB, I was just making the obvious point that he hasn't had to use that kind of draft capital at the starting QB position.

After Tom retires or playing for someone else, if the Pats have a down year and there is a highly valued QB in college I could totally see BB using a high 1st on a QB.

 

[luuked]

Cutler? Seriously. Kaepernick? For real.

If healthy, Tony Romo could give you a year, but Garoppolo could give you 10+ years. Not all supply is equal. A bad team signing a bad free agent QB... becomes worse.

I still think that Cleveland does a deal with us, or wherever Josh McDaniels goes does a deal with us and that could be Chicago. Would be fitting for McDaniels to ditch Cutler twice.

Personally, I find it a bit weird that you and others here assume that JG will be a better/more consistent QB in this league than Cutler or Bradford.

JG has had 6 quarters of play and his weaknesses are not yet particularly known outside of NE. We still know nothing about him but fortunately for our front office he has mostly shown very positive things in the limited time he had on the field. But without a bigger sample size we have no clue if the 2 quarters against Miami were close to his ceiling or where his floor is once opponents have enough footage on him.

Despite being average QBs Cutler and Bradford has shown a longevity in this league that puts them into a select little group of QBs in the NFL. Are they elite ? Hell no.. but on some level the fact that they have repeatedly had starting jobs in a profession that only has 32 openings is something you gotta respect.

Again let me emphasize that I am not saying Cutler & co are better or whatever but we simply don't know enough about JG to say that he'd be an upgrade over e.g. Cutler over the course of an entire regular season.