Do you buy into the narrative of Joe Montana's "unblemished Super Bowl record" vs. Brady?

[Ring 6]

I agree. The argument that the Montana backers make is to say that Montana's Super Bowl performances are superior to Brady's.

Bradys career, regular season and playoffs is better.
It is ridiculous to compare 4 games out of each career, that both people won and say the guy who had better stats in those 4 wins had the better career.
I get that this is all they have to latch on to, but it really is nothing.

 

[Ring 6]

One of the dumbest arguments ever.

I heard bozo Mike Francessa say Bill Belichick can NEVER surpass Tom Landry as a coach because Bill has lost 2 SBs and Tom NEVUH lost a SB. He also uses Super Bowl net points as criteria.

Yes, he believes going 2-0 in the SB is more impressive than 4-2.

Landry lost super bowls.

 

[Brick27]

One thing I do like about this small minded argument and reasoning is that it essentially elements Manning from the GOAT discussion.

Speaking of Manning.. What HOF level of QB did Joe Montana consistently have to battle out to win his conference the vast majority of his career who was the caliber of QB Manning was? I believe Brady spent 14 years doing it. Montana was the only HOF QB on the NFC roster of all 7 of his pro bowl seasons with the 49ers.

 

[RobertWeathers]

One thing I do like about this small minded argument and reasoning is that it essentially elements Manning from the GOAT discussion.

Speaking of Manning.. What HOF level of QB did Joe Montana consistently have to battle out to win his conference the vast majority of his career who was the caliber of QB Manning was? I believe Brady spent 14 years doing it. Montana was the only HOF QB on the NFC roster of all 7 of his pro bowl seasons with the 49ers.

Steve Young

In all seriousness I think Young pushed Joe when he might have needed a push.

To answer your question, really no one. In the early 80s you had Danny White and Joe Theisman. Then you had Phil Simms and Jim Everett but there really wasn't a contemporary to speak.

 

[lurker1965]

Yes, let's reward Montana for going 1 and done in the playoffs when SF did not make the SB!!

Do you know how bad an argument must be for arguing against it by AGREEING with it?

 

[Soul_Survivor88]

Yes, let's reward Montana for going 1 and done in the playoffs when SF did not make the SB!!

Do you know how bad an argument must be for arguing against it by AGREEING with it?

I just think it's a pretty amazing stat line, and it gives Montana a Jordan-esque aura of perfection that whether real or imagined, continues to elude athletes today

 

[lurker1965]

Montana's record is a direct result of the no-cap era. Put Montana in today's rosters, and he would have made *maybe* 1 SB.

Although I kinda agree, I can't 100%. Without a magic wand or whatever we can never prove or disprove that.

 

[Brick27]

Steve Young

In all seriousness I think Young pushed Joe when he might have needed a push.

To answer your question, really no one. In the early 80s you had Danny White and Joe Theisman. Then you had Phil Simms and Jim Everett but there really wasn't a contemporary to speak.

Haha didn't think of Steve

I think only Aikman (89-92) and Favre (91-92) are the two HOF QBs who were in the NFC when Joe was on the 49ers. Not saying there weren't some decent non-hall of fame QBs at the time, but not quite the depth the AFC had with Elway, Marino, Kelly, Fouts, Moon, etc over that span

 

[lurker1965]

I just think it's a pretty amazing stat line, and it gives Montana a Jordan-esque aura of perfection that whether real or imagined, continues to elude athletes today

I agree it looks nice. However that does not mean I have to turn off my brain.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Haha didn't think of Steve

I think only Aikman (89-92) and Favre (91-92) are the two HOF QBs who were in the NFC when Joe was on the 49ers. Not saying there weren't some decent non-hall of fame QBs at the time, but not quite the depth the AFC had with Elway, Marino, Kelly, Fouts, Moon, etc over that span

Well for Aikman and Favre, Joe was either hurt (1991) or playing in KC (1992). Joe never really needed to duel it out with those guys.

 

[aluminum seats]

Landry lost super bowls.

He actually made the comparison to Knoll. (Doesn't make the argument any less lame/desperate.)

 

[patfanken]

The "4-0 in the Super Bowls!" argument is just a subset of the "Big game" argument. My problem with it is that it conveniently ignores the big games that you have to win in order to get there. A great example, IMO, is applying it to Peyton's playoff career. He goes from a choking dog, who was the master of the one-and-done, to a guy who went 2-2 in Super Bowls.

....and interesting enough, but even in the 2 Superbowls that he won, he played horribly. In fact IIRC, his QB rating in those two game are among the worst in SB history for a winning QB (or a losing one for that matter.

It always infuriates me when Manning is included in any "best QB" debate or even when he is considered in Brady and Montana's league. I find what Montana accomplished to be remarkable regardless of the fact he played before the cap or FA era. He DESERVES to be in the conversation. But Brady's long term success puts him beyond the rest of his peers. His results for the last 3 seasons (including this one) are historic, a put him in a league of his own, and the gap will only continue to grow as he plays into 2017, 18, and 19.

 

[scout]

Brady at least waited till the Super Bowl to lose to the Giants. Montana is 1-3 against the NYG in the playoffs including 2 one and dones. [/QUOTE
Also, Brady's playoff record is 22-9 while Montana's is 16-7. I'd take the 22-9.

 

[titletownpats]

-Brady has 7 More playoff wins and better winning %
-Brady never lost playoff game 49-3
-4-2 is better than 4-0 in superbowls and Montana never faced a defense statistically better than 14 Seahawks.
-16-7 Montana postseason record and Brady is 22-9
-Brady has played in 10 AFC championships in 14 healthy years and Montana played in 7
-Brady played with salary cap
-Way less offensive talent than Montana. Montana had Jerry Rice GOAT wide receiver . Brady had Edelman and Givens=7th round picks
Troy Brown, Welker, Dola= not drafted and only had Moss for 2 seasons

Montana was clutch? In 81 super bowl year, 6tds and 4 picks in the post season. In 84 SB year, 7tds and 5 picks. 2 super bowl years Montana threw under 20 Tds. 81 season- 19 Td's 12 picks. In 88 season 18 Td's and 10 picks. Wasn't a passing league? Marino threw 48 tds in 1984.

SB Defenses with best CB of that era
81- #2 scoring defense
84- #1 scoring defense
88- #3 yardage defense
89- #3 scoring defense

Deflategate? Jerry Rice used stick em and offensive lineman used illegal silicone.

 

[RobertWeathers]

-Brady has 7 More playoff wins and better winning %
-Brady never lost playoff game 49-3 or 3 playoff games in a row.

Joe got knocked out of that game when it was 21-3 and TB12 lost Sb42, vs BAL in 2009 and NYJ in 2010. Thats 3 losses in a row.

I really don't see the need to crap on Montana.

 

[titletownpats]

Joe got knocked out of that game when it was 21-3 and TB12 lost Sb42, vs BAL in 2009 and NYJ in 2010. Thats 3 losses in a row.

I really don't see the need to crap on Montana.

Thanks for correcting me on the 3 in a row. Can't believe I made that mistake because the Baltimore and Jets playoff losses were the worst games I've been to at the blade.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Thanks for correcting me on the 3 in a row.

No thanks necessary.Not trying to be a smarty pants.

Can't believe I made that mistake because the Baltimore and Jets playoff losses were the worst games I've been to at the blade.

I was at the BAL game. I was in my seat for 2 seconds and Ray Rice scored. What a miserable game.

 

[NE_Zealot]

The NYFL's twitter account claimed Brady to be the GOAT, case closed.

In all seriousness, two legendary QBs that are neck and neck. Comparing different eras is apples to oranges. Montana was the best of his contemporaries, Brady smokes everyone in his generation.

Arguing who is the best is just that, an argument. Although I have to ride with TB12. Only arguments I'll make is that it is better to make it to additional SBs, win or lose. Also comparing ONLY SB performances is ludicrous. Brady's longevity and consistent regular season excellence are why he is the best.

I'm sure Joe said "You know what? I'm 4-0 in the big spot, I'm going to tank from now on so I can't possibly lose a super bowl."

 

[deroc5050]

Honestly judging QB's on Super Bowl wins/appearances in general is short sighted. Football is a team game. was Brady a better player in 2001 vs 2007, 2010, 2011,2012, 2013? How healthy is your team going into the playoffs?

 

[JMC00]

People talk about Montana's SB performance and act as if Brady doesn't come close

Let's take a look at their stat lines in their SB wins

1st SB

Montana 14/22 157 1 TD
Brady 16/27 145 1 TD

2nd SB

Montana 24/35 331 3 TD
Brady 32/48 354 3 TD 1 INT

3rd SB

Montana 23/36 357 2 TD
Brady 23/32 236 2 TD

The difference in yardage is because Montana threw for 97 yards on the GW drive because they were down with under 3 minutes to play and started at the 8 yard line and had a holding call during the drive. Whereas Pats were up 10 with 4 minutes to play and Belichick opted to play conservative.

4th SB

Montana 22/29 297 5 TD
Brady 37/50 328 4 TD 2 INT

So outside of Brady's 3 INTs. There isn't that much difference in their SB win performances.