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Mike Lombardi on the Jamie Collins trade..

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So why dont wait the FA and get a 3rd for him? Just to bury him in Cleveland?

If they are going to be big time players that make sense because some big time FA would match JC money, but if its not the case i think there is a lot more behind this move...
You may very well not get the 3rd anyway. This guaranteed you did.
 
Interesting chart, yardage each year when linebacker on/off field. 15,16 =2015,2016

 
I would love to hear Mayo's take on JC's play this season.
 
You may very well not get the 3rd anyway. This guaranteed you did.

You need Alex Mack to stay healthy for the rest of the season and play 80% of the snaps, if so they will get a comp #3 for him. I trust Bill, but this look like he was trying to punish Collins and sending a message to the rest of the players. I really think they could get at leat a #2 for him if they were willing to send him to a rival contender, Browns paid way less beacuse he will retire irrelevant there.
 
True, the defense hasn't had to face any juggernaut offenses. But are there any juggernaut offenses in the AFC that we'd be likely to play in the postseason? Pittsburgh with Big Ben would come the closest, but I can't find it in me to be scared of playing them (a team we've owned for years) at home. Their defense is far more vulnerable than ours, and Brady would shred it again.

Other than that, I don't see any team that will be able to do much damage.

OAK has scored a lot of points but their D sucks. Plus the postseason includes the SB and there's a couple of teams in the NFC that could give us problems.
 
Given what transpired, it seems likely that the Pats concluded that they were actually better off WITHOUT Collins through the remainder of the year. A bit shocking to a layman fan like me, but what do I know?

That said, I suspect it must have been very frustrating for the Pats Coaching Staff to jettison such a great athlete, a rare skill set, and a guy that helped them win a Ring.

This has to be a bad day at the office for the staff and probably one of those "teaching moments" that young coaches will never forget.
 
I just hope a move is made tomorrow before the deadline, vey thin at LB and besides Butler the other corners are really starting to concern me.

It is today, the same day you posted. Just a few hours away at this point (4PM).

I think BB's suggestion that there may be more trades made is just keeping the door open, and/or part of the message he sent to the team with the Collins trade. They are 7-1 heading into the bye, being heralded as the best team in the league by just about everyone, with Brady playing some of his best ball, and points against very good. But the coaches know they aren't nearly good enough at this point and want to create some urgency and healthy anxiety in the team.

Will it work? We'll never know, because we can't compare what will happen without him to a future with him.
 
It is today, the same day you posted. Just a few hours away at this point (4PM).

I think BB's suggestion that there may be more trades made is just keeping the door open, and/or part of the message he sent to the team with the Collins trade. They are 7-1 heading into the bye, being heralded as the best team in the league by just about everyone, with Brady playing some of his best ball, and points against very good. But the coaches know they aren't nearly good enough at this point and want to create some urgency and healthy anxiety in the team.

Will it work? We'll never know, because we can't compare what will happen without him to a future with him.

I work nights cut me some slack.
 
Given what transpired, it seems likely that the Pats concluded that they were actually better off WITHOUT Collins through the remainder of the year. A bit shocking to a layman fan like me, but what do I know?

That said, I suspect it must have been very frustrating for the Pats Coaching Staff to jettison such a great athlete, a rare skill set, and a guy that helped them win a Ring.

This has to be a bad day at the office for the staff and probably one of those "teaching moments" that young coaches will never forget.

As a coach and FO leader it has to be the worst scenario possible.

You scout the player. You draft the player. You teach the player your way and program. You invest time and energy in him. You win with the player. Hes likable. When playing at his potential, he is an all-pro with 5-7 more great seasons ahead of him.

Its just a shame.
 
not sure if quoted earlier in thread....per lombardi:

“Well, I think Collins has played poorly all season,” Lombardi said. “He’s going to be a free agent at the end of the year. (The Patriots) had no interest in really signing him for next year, and the way he played through the first eight games, he was getting demoted within each game.” Collins was on the field for just 62 percent of the Patriots’ defensive snaps against the Buffalo Bills on Sunday. And while the Browns and head coach Hue Jackson appear very happy with the trade, Lombardi thinks Collins will fall flat in Cleveland. “He’s not going to play any harder for the Browns. He’s not going to do anything,” Lombardi told Simmons. “He just did not play well. I watched the (Patriots-Bills) game tape this morning, and their defense just sticks on blocks. It’s not very good. They’re not playing with any physicality or emotion, and when they play against a good team, they are going to have trouble.”

Read more at: Ex-Patriots Assistant Blasts Jamie Collins In Justifying Sudden Trade
 
Why would the Browns trade away Joe Haden for 8 games of Collins ? They have enough cap space to eat up his contract even if he never reverts back to being the 2014 version of himself. He is not old and doesn't seem to be a terrible distraction.

On the flipside, whats the point of a half season rental who has not played up to his level in over a year ? Unless you'd want to have Haden over Butler or think that BB would actually keep two CBs with 10m+ salaries which given history is just not happening.

You and others often come at trades with those fantasy arguments that are based on so many assumptions that its ridiculous.

Also, finally, BB is the coach of the New England Patriots and not the Tom Brady Patriots. It is about the team not about one player as there is life after Brady.

You're focusing way too hard on a fantasy trade that has so little to do with my point at hand.

The point is, if you're going to dump Collins, a Pro Bowl calliber LB, mid season on a defense that could use more help, not less, then you need to get a player in return that will help the team win a Super Bowl this season.

A 4th in 2018 does very little to help this team win a Super Bowl in 2016, especially when you're essentially just dumping your 2nd round picked All-Pro LB and thinning your depth further.

Every big trade Bill has made, I initially was shocked, but saw the value in the move, one way or another.

Unfortunately there's no way I can see the positive in just dumping Collins for a mid-tier pick, rather then keep him on the team for the duration of the season and letting him walk for a similar, if not better, comp pick. Doesn't make sense, any way you slice it.

If we lose in the postseason because of the defense, or Roberts and Hightower go down with an injury, you won't be singing the same tune about "more than life after Brady" and that this move being "for the team". You'll be pissed we gave away one of our best Linebackers to the Browns for a crapshoot pick two seasons down the line.
 
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So why dont wait the FA and get a 3rd for him? Just to bury him in Cleveland?

If they are going to be big time players that make sense because some big time FA would match JC money, but if its not the case i think there is a lot more behind this move...

Because when he's freelancing and missing assignments that result in big plays and arguing with coaches and getting benched, then he's lost his premium value on the field and is taking up a roster spot that they can use for someone who does their job. Plus, if that situation remained, he'd likely eventually not be the positive locker room presence he's been up until now. So better to cut bait, and make sure he's on a team we have nothing to fear from, and which might even be able to pull off a win against someone we compete against since we've played them already but, for example, the Bills haven't.

And the compensation pick thing has been discussed ad nauseum. It was by no means guaranteed we'd get a pick, never mind a 3rd.
 
not sure if quoted earlier in thread....per lombardi:

I honestly get and understand what it is he's saying, just don't see how its going to get better without any additions.
 
I honestly get and understand what it is he's saying, just don't see how its going to get better without any additions.

continuity..........if someone is not 'doing their job', then it is a liability

I think van noy stands a good chance of stepping up....people are forgetting that the pats picked up this dude
 
Apparently Lombardi is going in on Collins on WEEI...



 
Watch collins sign with the Broncos in the offseason.
 
Apparently Lombardi is going in on Collins on WEEI...





I agree - it seems like attitude is the biggest problem with collins. If he doesn't get his money, he shows it on the field.
 
Because when he's freelancing and missing assignments that result in big plays and arguing with coaches and getting benched, then he's lost his premium value on the field and is taking up a roster spot that they can use for someone who does their job. Plus, if that situation remained, he'd likely eventually not be the positive locker room presence he's been up until now. So better to cut bait, and make sure he's on a team we have nothing to fear from, and which might even be able to pull off a win against someone we compete against since we've played them already but, for example, the Bills haven't.

And the compensation pick thing has been discussed ad nauseum. It was by no means guaranteed we'd get a pick, never mind a 3rd.

So we agree, the first goal was to punish him + ship him to worst team possible...
 
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