Mike Lombardi on the Jamie Collins trade..

[luuked]

Ok so none of this makes any sense. If he was traded for not playing well, I could understand that, but all other point counter this argument.

For example:
Trade him now to get at least some compensation because he wanted too much money and Pats wouldn't pay...well why were the Pats even offering that money if he was playing poorly.

Trade him because he was freelancing...why not just bench him. Injuries happen, you may need him later in the year and you won't find a street free agent with his skills and defensive knowledge.

Trade him now to get something instead of nothing when he leaves...we could have just tagged him and traded him in the off-season. Plus he would have gotten us a compensatory pick if he left by himself anyways.

So you think you would have gotten more than a 3rd round pick for a franchise tagged (15m) player ? What if nobody bites and in addition you can't use the tag on Hightower as a result ?

I think the truth was somewhere in the middle. The Pats obviously valued him otherwise the 11m offer wouldn't have been made but given his inconsistencies they were definitely not gonna pay him much more than that. Its not all black and white..

 

[Tunescribe]

We may be third in points, but look at some of the QB's we've faced this year:

Tannehill
Tyrod twice
Brock Osweiler
Charlie Whitehurst
Landry Jones

We have not played world beaters at QB, to say the least.

The defense has been under-performing and yesterday's sloppiness vs. Buffalo was telltale. As undermanned as the Bills were offensively, they shouldn't have scored 25 points. BB moving Collins hopefully will be a real wake-up call to the defense.

 

[primetime]

True, the defense hasn't had to face any juggernaut offenses. But are there any juggernaut offenses in the AFC that we'd be likely to play in the postseason? Pittsburgh with Big Ben would come the closest, but I can't find it in me to be scared of playing them (a team we've owned for years) at home. Their defense is far more vulnerable than ours, and Brady would shred it again.

Other than that, I don't see any team that will be able to do much damage.

Steelers and Raiders. And in the Super Bowl, the Falcons or Cowboys. There's likely no path to the Super Bowl that doesn't go through at least one and possibly three of these teams.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

Having Lombardi defend the Collins trade is akin to having Donna Brazille on CNN defending Hillary.

 

[Joey007]

The defense has been under-performing and yesterday's sloppiness vs. Buffalo was telltale. As undermanned as the Bills were offensively, they shouldn't have scored 25 points. BB moving Collins hopefully will be a real wake-up call to the defense.

I do think it can help the defense play better as a collective whole. Sort of a wake up call, if you will.

 

[FourierSeries]

Raiders. And in the Super Bowl, the Falcons or Cowboys.

Raiders do have a good offense, but while I haven't seen much of them, in the limited amount of games I've seen, they do tend to stall out quite a bit and have a problem converting key 3rd downs. Their defense is well below average. Quite possibly a bottom 5 defense. That's not a team that's going to go far in the postseason, and I wouldn't mind having Brady square off against that defense in the Divisional round.

As far as the NFC, I'm not convinced that the Falcons and Cowboys have what it takes to go all the way, but who knows - the NFC has been weird this season. Their defenses certainly haven't been better than ours.

This is why I'm not worried about the defense yet. While I agree that it likely isn't as good as the PPG allowed suggests, we're clearly the most complete team in the league, and I like our odds against any team.

 

[long distance]

Having Lombardi defend the Collins trade is akin to having Donna Brazille on CNN defending Hillary.

He was a rare voice of reason discussing Pats D all year. He was on the team at the time Collins was supposed to grow up.

 

[Mack Herron]

 

[luuked]

This year below 7M remaining. Technically possible but very expensive. Then restructure or trade. Not a lot of dead cap after this year. Butlers tender around 4M.

The problem is a lot of teams reportedly interested despite the high contract. BB won't bid for that.
But he would be just what the doctor ordered for Pats young (and outside of Butler) inconsistent CB corp.

I understand that this year on its own was doable but I am not sure if a 12 game rental who is still not back to being the player that earned him that contract in the first place is worth it.

Haden is as much a victim of his contract as Joe Thomas.. from my point of view both of those contracts are (for different reasons) not tradable.. Thomas is too old for his contract and like I said earlier today's Haden is not worth the money unless 2014 Haden emerges again.

 

[long distance]

Don't think he'll tell anything more than ”we just try to do what's best for the team“ but still ..

 

[BritPat]

This is ****ing nuts.

 

[RxJock1120]

So you think you would have gotten more than a 3rd round pick for a franchise tagged (15m) player ? What if nobody bites and in addition you can't use the tag on Hightower as a result ?

I think the truth was somewhere in the middle. The Pats obviously valued him otherwise the 11m offer wouldn't have been made but given his inconsistencies they were definitely not gonna pay him much more than that. Its not all black and white..

Nope, I dont think we would have gotten more than a 3rd rounder for a franchise player with 15M per year salary. But a 5th Rd, maybe...either via trade or compensation pick. And in my opinion a 2 round jump ain't worth giving up a pro-bowl LB, mid-season, with Brady in the twilight of his career.

Look, no one on this planet can legitimately argue with BB, certainly not me nor anyone on this board, but is that the whole point of message boards??? To discuss your opinions on coaching and team moves???

 

[BritPat]

30 minutes later and this isn't getting any better. Hopefully the FO has something lined up, because right now this seems absolutely mental. Good Lord.

 

[PatsDeb]

The defense has been under-performing and yesterday's sloppiness vs. Buffalo was telltale. As undermanned as the Bills were offensively, they shouldn't have scored 25 points. BB moving Collins hopefully will be a real wake-up call to the defense.

If not a wake-up call then a retooling. I must admit that the only thing I was feeling unsettled about yesterday was the fact that the Bills, with all their injuries, managed to score 25 points on us.

I must admire BB. He waits until the bye to pull this off so that not only is the team out of town, but the fans have time to digest and adjust too before the team takes the field again. He's banking on all of us (team and fans) forgetting about this by the time the Pats take the field against the Seahawks.

 

[The Scrizz]

Re: the freelancing et al... Is it just me or is this an indictment on the lack of player leadership on D? Who is the leader on that side of the ball? Sometimes you need players policing themselves. Just don't see this happening on the old Seymour-Rodney days.

 

[Huckleberry1]

so the solution is trading arguably the best defensive player??? if lombardi thinks the defense is weak with collins, it's clearly worse without jamie! what if something happens to hightower?? we're screwed.

i dont understand this move at all. sure, trust BB but this move makes 0 sense.

Hightower and Butler are their best defensive players, with McCourty and Chung right behind them. Collins has unreal athletic ability but only plays up to it in spurts. I have had the feeling for a long time that he wanted too pass rusher money and wasn't going to be happy unless he got it, and he wasn't going to get it here. They offered him 11 a year, which is fair for his production, and he clearly wanted much more. I would have rather seen them get Thomas or Haden in return but get why they moved him if he wasn't taking coaching.

 

[long distance]

Re: the freelancing et al... Is it just me or is this an indictment on the lack of player leadership on D? Who is the leader on that side of the ball? Sometimes you need players policing themselves. Just don't see this happening on the old Seymour-Rodney days.

Re freelancing first line of leadership is MP.

 

[Christian]

They should've made him into a pass rusher. They should have let him pass rush...let Roberts and Hightower be on field at same time. He would've been dynamic as a pass rusher. Let him rush the passer, play out the season, and then go on his merry way. That way, he would've gotten the money he wanted, and we would've gotten the compensatory pick anyway.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Had to be strictly performance and/or behavior related. A 3rd rounder wed probably get just by letting him sign somewhere else in march (in one thread there was a tweet that he TURNED DOWN 11m a year). So hes essentially gone for nothing but getting the 3rd a year earlier, And whatever cap savings come from it this year. Bb feels the team is better off without him, thats saying alot. Just gotta put your faith in bb on this one.

 

[RIpats88]

so the solution is trading arguably the best defensive player??? if lombardi thinks the defense is weak with collins, it's clearly worse without jamie! what if something happens to hightower?? we're screwed.

i dont understand this move at all. sure, trust BB but this move makes 0 sense.

I think Lombardi's point is production>> potential. collins has potential to be the best defensive player...he clearly has not been though on the field...