Note to Ian

[pats1]

In this forum it counts no more than any other members - he's the mod of the Ladies Lounge.

I just took a quick spin through this whiny assed thread and guess what - 116 posts and the majority are by a handful of unhappy campers and pats1 wasting time trying to reason with them. With a smattering of interest at best from the remaining thousands of posters on this board, hundreds of whom are logged in at any given time even in this down period, a fairly large number of whom were expressing displeasure with the board not that long ago when it wasn't well structured or consistently moderated.

I also visit the draft forum regularly now, as I did last night, and amazingly I find everything I want to know right where I can efficiently peruse it without having to go searching for it through a sea of redundant or unrelated threads. Damn.

I think the answer for the vocal minority lies in Ray Clay's post.

Ian does just that. WE are all free to post on any board we choose, including those operated by entities other than himself. If you go join the NEM Nation and you can likely become a moderator to boot.

Ego and personality being what it is there will always be a certain amount of unhappy campers on any board. It's the nature of the beast as some folks just aren't happy unless they have something to be unhappy and ***** about. Or as BB says, it is what it is.

Thanks, Mo, as always.

(Shmessy told me to ignore this kind of stuff when I became a moderator. Should have listened! )

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Actually, I responded with a different opinion.

I generally keep to the draft forum and am not in the business of moving threads out of the main forum (unless it's obvious spam, etc.) But I sometimes see full-blown threads appear in the draft forum that surprise me, because they seem like items of general interest -- say a discussion of the Patriots' philosophy in prioritizing different positions.

Certainly, we're all individuals and will judge threads different ways. But my inclination would be to give some weight to where the original poster placed the thread on the assumption that he/she put it there for a reason, and only move it if it's inappropriate in that place. So, e.g., an unapologetic flame from a Jets troll would move to the visitors forum, and somebody looking for input on who the Bengals should choose in a mock draft should move to the draft forum. But a Jets fan who wants to discuss the difficulty of schedules in the AFC East or a post about whether the Pats still have draft needs on offense is a reasonable topic for the main forum, and deserves that broad-based audience.

Just one gal's opinion.

Posters often make threads in an effort to focus attention on their opinion. Just as many hijack threads for the same reason. We've seen a little less of that since the new sheriff came to town. I for one apprecate that.

I think it would be fine in a forum that self moderates well to have a couple of general interest draft threads going on the main board. Problem is this board balks at self moderation, so one or two would quickly become a couple of dozen mostly redundant threads.

This thread is just another example of the childish egos that inhabit a space Ian has generously provided us for free. None of the kiddies want to see it operate within a framework of rules that just might hint they can't do or say just whatever they want whenever and wherever they want. A hardcore few are positively rules adverse. You simply cannot please all the people all of the time, and pats1 seems to be the only mod who fully accepts that fact. Mods shouldn't spend time walking on eggshells worrying about bruising egos or upsetting applecarts. They should do what makes this place work best for the vast majority of members on a consistent basis most of the time.

What we really need is for Ian to get us some new more expansive smilies to cover all these emotions with fewer wasted keystrokes.

 

[Scott37]

Actually, I responded with a different opinion.

I generally keep to the draft forum and am not in the business of moving threads out of the main forum (unless it's obvious spam, etc.) But I sometimes see full-blown threads appear in the draft forum that surprise me, because they seem like items of general interest -- say a discussion of the Patriots' philosophy in prioritizing different positions.

Certainly, we're all individuals and will judge threads different ways. But my inclination would be to give some weight to where the original poster placed the thread on the assumption that he/she put it there for a reason, and only move it if it's inappropriate in that place. So, e.g., an unapologetic flame from a Jets troll would move to the visitors forum, and somebody looking for input on who the Bengals should choose in a mock draft should move to the draft forum. But a Jets fan who wants to discuss the difficulty of schedules in the AFC East or a post about whether the Pats still have draft needs on offense is a reasonable topic for the main forum, and deserves that broad-based audience.

Just one gal's opinion.

Well said...

 

[Deus Irae]

Posters often make threads in an effort to focus attention on their opinion. Just as many hijack threads for the same reason. We've seen a little less of that since the new sheriff came to town. I for one apprecate that.

I think it would be fine in a forum that self moderates well to have a couple of general interest draft threads going on the main board. Problem is this board balks at self moderation, so one or two would quickly become a couple of dozen mostly redundant threads.

This thread is just another example of the childish egos that inhabit a space Ian has generously provided us for free. None of the kiddies want to see it operate within a framework of rules that just might hint they can't do or say just whatever they want whenever and wherever they want. A hardcore few are positively rules adverse. You simply cannot please all the people all of the time, and pats1 seems to be the only mod who fully accepts that fact. Mods shouldn't spend time walking on eggshells worrying about bruising egos or upsetting applecarts. They should do what makes this place work best for the vast majority of members on a consistent basis most of the time.

What we really need is for Ian to get us some new more expansive smilies to cover all these emotions with fewer wasted keystrokes.

Nonsense. Other than the "NEM" situation, this board is far more rigidly patrolled than other boards. It's not about 'self-moderation', it's about removing the most topical Patriots conversation off of the main board. That's moronic. And it's not just peasants such as myself who are stating a disagreement with the Pats1, it's other mods as well.

Topics about ex-players jerseys are not "Patriots" topics, yet they are on the main board. Topics about the "greatest Super Bowl ever" are not "Patriots" topics.

Nor are the following topics:

DeMulling back with Colts after 2 years
Corey Dillon to visit Tennessee
NFL Network On Demand
What happened to Keegs?
Ricky Williams to be Reinstated???
Chargers' Turner being pursued by Bills, Cowboys, Titans, Jets


Yet, somehow, these are all still on the main board, on the first page. The hypocrisy is undeniable.

 

[patchick]

This thread is just another example of the childish egos that inhabit a space Ian has generously provided us for free. None of the kiddies want to see it operate within a framework of rules that just might hint they can't do or say just whatever they want whenever and wherever they want. A hardcore few are positively rules adverse. You simply cannot please all the people all of the time, and pats1 seems to be the only mod who fully accepts that fact. Mods shouldn't spend time walking on eggshells worrying about bruising egos or upsetting applecarts. They should do what makes this place work best for the vast majority of members on a consistent basis most of the time.

OK Mo, we all have our priorities and things that bother us about the board. Yours appears to be disorder. Mine is users who respond to differing opinions by turning the discussion away from the topic and onto attacks on the character of the people they disagree with. Since this thread is pleasing neither of us, I'll sign off now.

 

[Kdo5]

Nonsense. Other than the "NEM" situation, this board is far more rigidly patrolled than other boards. It's not about 'self-moderation', it's about removing the most topical Patriots conversation off of the main board. That's moronic. And it's not just peasants such as myself who are stating a disagreement with the Pats1, it's other mods as well.

Topics about ex-players jerseys are not "Patriots" topics, yet they are on the main board. Topics about the "greatest Super Bowl ever" are not "Patriots" topics.

Nor are the following topics:

DeMulling back with Colts after 2 years
Corey Dillon to visit Tennessee
NFL Network On Demand
What happened to Keegs?
Ricky Williams to be Reinstated???
Chargers' Turner being pursued by Bills, Cowboys, Titans, Jets


Yet, somehow, these are all still on the main board, on the first page. The hypocrisy is undeniable.

Good point with that. Most of those topics belong in the Visiting Locker room. All thats in that forum is spam so why not make something of it.

 

[pats1]

Nonsense. Other than the "NEM" situation, this board is far more rigidly patrolled than other boards.

No, not at all. Ask Ian. We're very liberal.

It's not about 'self-moderation', it's about removing the most topical Patriots conversation off of the main board. That's moronic.

You're completely missing the point, and naively viewing it as "moving relevant discussion off the main board."

And it's not just peasants such as myself who are stating a disagreement with the Pats1, it's other mods as well.

People disagree! Gosh, never knew that.

Topics about ex-players jerseys are not "Patriots" topics, yet they are on the main board. Topics about the "greatest Super Bowl ever" are not "Patriots" topics.

Nor are the following topics:

DeMulling back with Colts after 2 years
Corey Dillon to visit Tennessee
NFL Network On Demand
What happened to Keegs?
Ricky Williams to be Reinstated???
Chargers' Turner being pursued by Bills, Cowboys, Titans, Jets

Yet, somehow, these are all still on the main board, on the first page. The hypocrisy is undeniable.

Again, it's not that black-and-white. There's no other sub-forum for that NFL discussion.

The ONLY thing you are advocating from this post is the following:

-A main Patriots forum
-No draft forum
-A general NFL sub-forum
-A forum issues sub-forum

 

[Willie55]

Nonsense. Other than the "NEM" situation, this board is far more rigidly patrolled than other boards. It's not about 'self-moderation', it's about removing the most topical Patriots conversation off of the main board. That's moronic. And it's not just peasants such as myself who are stating a disagreement with the Pats1, it's other mods as well.

Topics about ex-players jerseys are not "Patriots" topics, yet they are on the main board. Topics about the "greatest Super Bowl ever" are not "Patriots" topics.

Nor are the following topics:

DeMulling back with Colts after 2 years
Corey Dillon to visit Tennessee
NFL Network On Demand
What happened to Keegs?
Ricky Williams to be Reinstated???
Chargers' Turner being pursued by Bills, Cowboys, Titans, Jets


Yet, somehow, these are all still on the main board, on the first page. The hypocrisy is undeniable.

Exactly (although the Keegs thread should stay ). If its Patriots related it should stay on the main board.

Rules are guidelines. They are not set in cement. Discretion is needed. If all rules were enforced without discretion we'd all be in jail.

 

[Deus Irae]

Again, it's not that black-and-white. There's no other sub-forum for that NFL discussion.

The ONLY thing you are advocating from this post is the following:

-A main Patriots forum
-No draft forum
-A general NFL sub-forum
-A forum issues sub-forum

My whole point is that it's "not that black-and-white", yet you are treating draft threads as if it is. Again, even other moderators of this board don't agree with you. You are being heavy handed. You are singling out the 'draft' information when there are other threads that could legitimately be moved to different forums or deleted under your theories. The reality is that this is a slow time in the league and removing viable posts from the main board while leaving on the "jersey" gems makes the board look ridiculous. If you were actually moderating every thread with the same 'zeal' you are using for the draft threads, there would be at least 5-10 more threads off the main board just from the front page, and there'd be even more threads on the first page of the main board that had gone more than 24 hours without any comment.

And, I'm pretty sure that I've stated that I thought the draft forum had a purpose, so you are misconstruing my words, either deliberately or mistakenly.

P.S. I don't mean to pick on the "Jersey" topic, it's just the first one I noted for purposes of comparison.

 

[pats1]

Good point with that. Most of those topics belong in the Visiting Locker room. All thats in that forum is spam so why not make something of it.

Shh...we need a place to move all the trolls' threads (An asylum that is made out to be an active forum - it's only for we don't have to read them )

 

[pats1]

My whole point is that it's "not that black-and-white", yet you are treating draft threads as if it is. Again, even other moderators of this board don't agree with you. You are being heavy handed. You are singling out the 'draft' information when there are other threads that could legitimately be moved to different forums or deleted under your theories. The reality is that this is a slow time in the league and removing viable posts from the main board while leaving on the "jersey" gems makes the board look ridiculous. If you were actually moderating every thread with the same 'zeal' you are using for the draft threads, there would be at least 5-10 more threads off the main board just from the front page, and there'd be even more threads on the first page of the main board that had gone more than 24 hours without any comment.

And, I'm pretty sure that I've stated that I thought the draft forum had a purpose, so you are misconstruing my words, either deliberately or mistakenly.

P.S. I don't mean to pick on the "Jersey" topic, it's just the first one I noted for purposes of comparison.

There's nowhere to move the general NFL threads. If there were, I would.

Again folks, you're blaming me for the lack of offseason news (that doesn't have to do with the draft). That's ridiculous.

 

[Deus Irae]

There's nowhere to move the general NFL threads. If there were, I would.

Again folks, you're blaming me for the lack of offseason news (that doesn't have to do with the draft). That's ridiculous.

Nobody is blaming you for the lack of offseason news. We're 'blaming' you for your insistence that the upcoming draft is not sufficiently "Patriots" related offseason news to be left on the main board. Stop with the persecution complex already. You're making an administrative decision that overrides all the other moderators, is foolish in it's implementation and is being selectively enforced. Again, DeMulling is Colts related, isn't it? Why did you not immediately move that to the visiting locker room? How about the Ricky Williams (Dolphins) thread, or the Turner (Chargers) thread?

 

[pats1]

Nobody is blaming you for the lack of offseason news. We're 'blaming' you for your insistence that the upcoming draft is not sufficiently "Patriots" related offseason news to be left on the main board. Stop with the persecution complex already.

There is a separate draft forum for it!

ou're making an administrative decision that overrides all the other moderators, is foolish in it's implementation and is being selectively enforced. Again, DeMulling is Colts related, isn't it? Why did you not immediately move that to the visiting locker room?

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/private.php?do=newpm

Type "Ian" in the username box.

 

[Willie55]

There's nowhere to move the general NFL threads. If there were, I would.

Again folks, you're blaming me for the lack of offseason news (that doesn't have to do with the draft). That's ridiculous.

Move them to the visiting locker room and leave the room for the Pats stuff.

Who the hell cares that Rick DeMulling re-signed with the Colts. That has no business on the Pats main forum.

 

[Willie55]

Nobody is blaming you for the lack of offseason news. We're 'blaming' you for your insistence that the upcoming draft is not sufficiently "Patriots" related offseason news to be left on the main board. Stop with the persecution complex already. You're making an administrative decision that overrides all the other moderators, is foolish in it's implementation and is being selectively enforced. Again, DeMulling is Colts related, isn't it? Why did you not immediately move that to the visiting locker room? How about the Ricky Williams (Dolphins) thread, or the Turner (Chargers) thread?

Pats1 is the one that originally posted the DeMulling signing.

 

[pats1]

Move them to the visiting locker room and leave the room for the Pats stuff.

Who the hell cares that Rick DeMulling re-signed with the Colts. That has no business on the Pats main forum.

Please list all the general NFL threads that aren't "ROFLcopter Pats suxors" that were moved to the interleague/visiting locker room in the past few years.

The list will be short.

 

[Willie55]

Please list all the general NFL threads that aren't "ROFLcopter Pats suxors" that were moved to the interleague/visiting locker room in the past few years.

The list will be short.

You asked where to move them, I gave you a suggestion. Its more logical to move that stuff there than move Pats related draft material and training camp reports.

 

[Deus Irae]

There is a separate draft forum for it!

There's a separate forum for "visiting team" stuff, too. You are simply choosing not to use it. Again, your discretion, but you feel free to use the draft forum at the drop of a hat while leaving Rick Demulling on the main board. It's fascinating to watch you making these contortions to explain your uneven actions, by the way.

 

[Deus Irae]

Pats1 is the one that originally posted the DeMulling signing.

Yes, it's always interesting to watch people hoisted by their own petard.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Nonsense. Other than the "NEM" situation, this board is far more rigidly patrolled than other boards. It's not about 'self-moderation', it's about removing the most topical Patriots conversation off of the main board. That's moronic. And it's not just peasants such as myself who are stating a disagreement with the Pats1, it's other mods as well.

Topics about ex-players jerseys are not "Patriots" topics, yet they are on the main board. Topics about the "greatest Super Bowl ever" are not "Patriots" topics.

Nor are the following topics:

DeMulling back with Colts after 2 years
Corey Dillon to visit Tennessee
NFL Network On Demand
What happened to Keegs?
Ricky Williams to be Reinstated???
Chargers' Turner being pursued by Bills, Cowboys, Titans, Jets


Yet, somehow, these are all still on the main board, on the first page. The hypocrisy is undeniable.

So I guess you are calling Ian a moron for deciding to sub divide his message board as he did.

Threads about ex-players jersey's aren't my cup of tea, but they are certainly patriot's related. I'm not into the light hearted posts as a rule, but I understand there are many levels of fan interests.

Threads started by Pat's fans (or visitors who don't behave like trolls) that deal with 2007 opponents we will face in the regular season and may likely face in the post season absolutely belong on this forum and are not even OT in that respect. As pats1 has tried to explain to you several times now, there is not a general NFL forum, just a visitors locker room designed for smack talking trolls and those who love sparing with them.

If pats1 were denying you or scott37 or seymour 93 or willie55 or anybody else the ability to post draft related topics on this or any other forum you might not be looking like such an ass right about now. You are free to post them anywhere you want. And he is empowered to move them to the forum where they NOW belong under a restructured forum design IAN implemented if he's logged in and so inclined. Where any of you could also post them with just a click of your mouse if you actually cared more about partaking in draft discussion than geting more attention for your threads by posting them on the main board. Or just weighting in on someone elses hissy fit in an effort to buck the system.

Just as scott could and should have PM'ed Ian with his concerns if he weren't hoping this thread would morph into a referendum that would force Ian into choosing to publicly side with him as opposed to his most recently appointed mod.

As for discretion, much like with NFL refs all that breeds is confusion and distrust. Ian has tried to be discrete and urged us to self-moderate in the past and self absorbed people just took advantage of him forever. This is just a message board, not life and death as some may have imbued it. It works best for most of us when it's enjoyment by the majority is not marred by the contentiousness of a very small minority intent on instigating or perpetuating pissing matches with each other or the management.

BTW the main forum seems to be holding it's own this AM even without a single draft thread gracing it.