The Time For Signing JAGs & Camp Fodder

[mgteich]

We have reached the time for signing JAGs and camp fodder. We need a 90 man roster, and we need competition for the bottom of the roster positions. We also need insurance against injuries.

Sure, we could still have a couple of players who could significant contributors (Smith, a DE, a RB and Austin) come to mind.

However, almost all of the players free agents brought in will be WTF choices if one is looking for major contributors.

After all, these players are competing with guys like those below for roster spots:
Bolden
Develin
Williams
Kline
Barker
Cave
Bequette
Beauharnais
White
Wilson
Wilson
Ebner
Davis

 

[borg]

Still dreaming of Ebner one day be our ballz to the wallz safety........don't wake me up from my fantasy

 

[PatsDeb]

A reaction to the Chung signing, I take it?

 

[BobDigital]

I honestly don't mind the Chung signing. Chung being your 53rd guy is not ideal but it doesn't prevent you from winning a championship.

As said he is camp fodder that is competing with Wilson & Wilson.

Still need to draft a safety those as we need a solid 3rd. I like Harmon okay but we need someone else at least as good.

 

[Shockt327]

Aren't JAGs usually brought in after the draft? I thought that's how it went...

 

[mgteich]

Yes, this is a direct reaction to the Chung signing, and a pre-emptive reaction to future JAG signings.

A reaction to the Chung signing, I take it?

 

[Deus Irae]

Yes, this is a direct reaction to the Chung signing, and a pre-emptive reaction to future JAG signings.

If they sign 'another' Chung, you'll get another similar reaction. It's not about Chung being a JAG, it's specifically about Chung being Chung. It's Cunningham, but moreso.

 

[Coach42]

If they sign 'another' Chung, you'll get another similar reaction. It's not about Chung being a JAG, it's specifically about Chung being Chung. It's Cunningham, but moreso.

Why not the same reaction then for the Ventrone brothers or others who have been released and resigned a hundred times? The overreaction to the Chung signing is laughable.

 

[mgteich]

OK, to be fair, your comments are in a somewhat different category. You are very specific in which signings you dislike. Many others simply dislike the signing of almost all JAG's.

You didn't like the Adrian Wilson signing at all. Have you changed your mind about his play after another injury and one more year?

Have you changed you mind with regard to Tavon Wilson being more than a special teamer. Ebner?

Absent moving a corner to safety (and even with), it seems that we need some bottom of the roster competition at safety. I don't think that either of us would be upset with the drafting of a safety in the first round, if a top one is available.

I am fine with Chung competing for the #4 or #5 safety spots with Ebner and Tavon Wilson. Apparently you are not.

If they sign 'another' Chung, you'll get another similar reaction. It's not about Chung being a JAG, it's specifically about Chung being Chung. It's Cunningham, but moreso.

 

[Deus Irae]

Why not the same reaction then for the Ventrone brothers or others who have been released and resigned a hundred times? The overreaction to the Chung signing is laughable.

1.) It's not an overreaction

2.) If you can't figure it out from the history, I don't know what to tell you.


For goodness' sakes, this place had a Patrick Chung/Chuck Norris thread of significant size

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/233280-patrick-chungisms.html

Breathless posting about Chung being equated to Mayo

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/254657-belichick-puts-chung-same-breath-mayo.html

crazy overreaction to some early positives

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/630211-chung-word-wow.html

etc...

all the way down to the bitter end, and now we get this Phoenix play.

 

[Brady6]

We have reached the time for signing JAGs and camp fodder. We need a 90 man roster, and we need competition for the bottom of the roster positions. We also need insurance against injuries.

Sure, we could still have a couple of players who could significant contributors (Smith, a DE, a RB and Austin) come to mind.

However, almost all of the players free agents brought in will be WTF choices if one is looking for major contributors.

After all, these players are competing with guys like those below for roster spots:
Bolden
Develin
Williams
Kline
Barker
Cave
Bequette
Beauharnais
White
Wilson
Wilson
Ebner
Davis

JAG stands for just another guy correct, how exactly do you determine who is just another guy? A camp fodder is livestock, how exactly do you determine who is a camp fodder? What is the difference between a JAG and a camp fodder?

Is the future Hall a Famer Adrian Wilson just another guy or livestock?

 

[Deus Irae]

OK, to be fair, your comments are in a somewhat different category. You are very specific in which signings you dislike. Many others simply dislike the signing of almost all JAG's.

You didn't like the Adrian Wilson signing at all. Have you changed your mind about his play after another injury and one more year?

I think it's safe to say that most people will at least question whether or not he'll be of real use after aging another year, missing the year to injury in general, and dealing with an Achilles injury in particular. I would certainly be among that group of people.

Have you changed you mind with regard to Tavon Wilson being more than a special teamer. Ebner?

No, and I think last year made it clear that, to that point at least, BB was in agreement with me on that. Is it possible that they'll show a huge jump in play? Sure. I'm not expecting it, and I doubt I'm in any kind of extreme minority on that one.

Absent moving a corner to safety (and even with), it seems that we need some bottom of the roster competition at safety. I don't think that either of us would be upset with the drafting of a safety in the first round, if a top one is available.

On this (more the 2nd sentence than the 1st), we agree.

I am fine with Chung competing for the #4 or #5 safety spots with Ebner and Tavon Wilson. Apparently you are not.

He wasn't good enough for that role 2 years ago. Why is he good enough now? If it's salary, then it's really not about play.

 

[Coach42]

1.) It's not an overreaction

2.) If you can't figure it out from the history, I don't know what to tell you.


For goodness' sakes, this place had a Patrick Chung/Chuck Norris thread of significant size

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/233280-patrick-chungisms.html

Breathless posting about Chung being equated to Mayo

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/254657-belichick-puts-chung-same-breath-mayo.html

crazy overreaction to some early positives

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/630211-chung-word-wow.html

etc...

all the way down to the bitter end, and now we get this Phoenix play.

Fans overacted to some early results in Chungs career. He regresses, is released, and one year later resigns for likely short money 20 some odd days into free agency. This causes out and out outrage. You're right, I can't figure it out.

 

[Deus Irae]

Fans overacted to some early results in Chungs career. He regresses, is released, and one year later resigns for likely short money 20 some odd days into free agency. This causes out and out outrage. You're right, I can't figure it out.

What outrage? People are flummoxed because he sucked, but was brought back when far better safeties were allowed to go off the board after Gregory was cut loose. Those people include some of the biggest homers on the board.


As usual, a few of you, among the usual suspects, take every question about something remotely Patriots as if it's an attempt to literally destroy the world. I've got a newsflash for you, though. Sometimes people say a player sucks because a player sucks, and not because he was a Patriots signee.

 

[Coach42]

What outrage? People are flummoxed because he sucked, but was brought back when far better safeties were allowed to go off the board after Gregory was cut loose. Those people include some of the biggest homers on the board.


As usual, a few of you, among the usual suspects, take every question about something remotely Patriots as if it's an attempt to literally destroy the world. I've got a newsflash for you, though. Sometimes people say a player sucks because a player sucks, and not because he was a Patriots signee.

Weird, another overreaction. All I ever said was big "big deal". Outrage is a 17 page thread about a 5th or 6th safety.

 

[mgteich]

It was about salary 2 years ago.

Now it is about competing for the bottom two roster spots. His competition is Tavon Wilson and Ebner. Some would even say that Adrian Wilson is unlikely to make the team, in which case, he would be even more likely to make the squad.

As we both agree, we need more options.

Personally, I would not be surprised to see Gregory come back and compete with Adrian Wilson for the #3 roster spot.

He wasn't good enough for that role 2 years ago. Why is he good enough now? If it's salary, then it's really not about play.

 

[DaBruinz]

Adrian Wilson has been released.

Patrick Chung has been signed.

You can tell who is Camp Fodder, typically, by their signing bonus, or lack there of. For example, Patrick Chung got a whopping 60K signing bonus. He's camp fodder. Meaning that he's there to see if he can outplay Ebner or Tavon Wilson. Or possibly provide another player since the Pats lost one of their better special teamers in Fletcher.

There are several other players that MG missed:

Kendbrell Thompkins
Marcus Forston
Justin Green
Mark Harrison
Jonas Gray
Chris Barker
Ja'Gared Davis (assuming that MG mean Kannoris Davis)
Jordan Devey
Reggie Dunn
R.J. Mattes
Greg Orton
Joe Vellano
D.J. Williams

The Pats have 8 draft picks and 64 signed, leaving 18 spots. I wouldn't be surprised to see only 1 or 2 more "JAG" signings and the rest be UDFA signings since this is such a deep draft and a lot of good talent is expected to hit the UDFA "wire".

 

[supafly]

It was about salary 2 years ago.

Now it is about competing for the bottom two roster spots. His competition is Tavon Wilson and Ebner. Some would even say that Adrian Wilson is unlikely to make the team, in which case, he would be even more likely to make the squad.

As we both agree, we need more options.

Personally, I would not be surprised to see Gregory come back and compete with Adrian Wilson for the #3 roster spot.

At the moment, it's really Devin McCourty and no one, as far as players who have the capacity to actually start. Harmon is a nice guy to have for depth and his rookie season left some of us wondering if he couldn't be a fine candidate for a year 2 leap, but pinning our hopes on him is something altogether different.

Even if we agree that Harmon has clearly won the S2 job opposite DMcC, we'd still need another safety to add to the mix via the draft.

It's a position of obvious need for a round 1-3 (maybe round 4) selection, at least in my opinion.

I'd like to see someone drafted decently high to compete with Harmon, with the loser of the battle being our real S3. Then we pray like hell that nothing happens to McCourty, unless the story and rumor about the possibility of Logan Ryan moving there is real. If that's the case, it's a better position, but I still wouldn't mind a draft pick myself. It could make the difference between spending a 3rd rounder and a 6th, however.

 

[mgteich]

I listed Barker.

I didn't miss the rest of your list. I just don't think that JAG free agents will be brought in to compete with any of these many longshots for roster spots.

While JAG's may be brought in at WR, I don't see any really competing for a roster spot, other than Austin, who I would NOT consider a JAG. I do think that Thompkins is competing for a roster spot, but that is not relevant to this discussion of JAG's.

I don't know why you would limit free agent signings to 1 or 2. The cost is quite minimal and we need the competition, especially at DE, LB and RB. I see a minimum of signings at three positions, probably more than 3.

There are several other players that MG missed:

Kendbrell Thompkins
Marcus Forston
Justin Green
Mark Harrison
Jonas Gray
Chris Barker
Ja'Gared Davis (assuming that MG mean Kannoris Davis)
Jordan Devey
Reggie Dunn
R.J. Mattes
Greg Orton
Joe Vellano
D.J. Williams

The Pats have 8 draft picks and 64 signed, leaving 18 spots. I wouldn't be surprised to see only 1 or 2 more "JAG" signings and the rest be UDFA signings since this is such a deep draft and a lot of good talent is expected to hit the UDFA "wire".