Have the Pats really adopted a "Win Now" philosophy?

[Rob0729]

Rob, you're first mistake is thinking that the "radio" or media really believe what they say or just going for the continued mantra of trying to whip up an emotional frenzy.

I'm sure, if pressed, BB would say he's doing what he always does and that would be "doing what's best for the team". If we had pulled in Denver like transactions, then it would feel more like a change in philosophy and even that might be pushing it. or if we sign Jared Allen for that 9-10 per year, then this line of thinking might have more legs.

I know sports talk radio hosts go overboard with this stuff and I agree it is a mistake to listen to them, but many people on this board echo the sentiment.

 

[IllegalContact]

I would have to say no.......

cap wise, they've committed to revis what they would have committed to talib for this year, give or take

the rest of the signings have been typical middle of the road stuff.

the pats have plenty of free agents coming up after 2014, and they have plenty of cap space.

I say this with the notion of "win now" equating to "mortgaging the future" which is something they have not done. Revis could be a 1 year deal and if browner pans out, the secondary could still be fine.

 

[1960Pats]

But going after once in a generation players is not. Revis is a special player. Other than Julius Peppers, the Pats have never been in a position to go after a guy like that in free agency in their prime because HOF caliber players in their prime don't become free agents very often,

Any team that would let a player like that walk away in his prime needs to have it's head examined.

 

[RIpats88]

It just seems to me that they are doing more to get "over" the hump. I mean the biggest move last year was probably legarett Blount(which turned out to be a solid move)

 

[Jimke]

I'd like to see an upgrade at center and right guard before I declare a
"win now" philosophy. Maybe trade for the Tampa center after a salary
adjustment. Wendell was a turnstile last year.

 

[1960Pats]

I know sports talk radio hosts go overboard with this stuff and I agree it is a mistake to listen to them, but many people on this board echo the sentiment.

I look at talk radio the same way as I do pro wrestling. As long as people don't believe it's real then there's no problem. Some of it can be funny too.

 

[smg93]

Have you taken into account the record the Pats have had over the last decade and a half????

Of course they've always had a "win now" Philosophy.

 

[Froob]

Little OT (not directed at you Rob) but, I hate how people act like there's a cookie cutter build that you can use to predict Belichick's every move. Every year is a different situation with different players and different contracts. There's no he won't ever sign a corner or a wide out for 10+ mill. Depends entirely on what the other elite teams in the league have that we have to beat or how our team is currently built. Was great seeing the reactions here after many claimed there was noway we'd ever pay a guy like Revis.

 

[Ring 6]

But going after once in a generation players is not. Revis is a special player. Other than Julius Peppers, the Pats have never been in a position to go after a guy like that in free agency in their prime because HOF caliber players in their prime don't become free agents very often,

You cannot, as most people do, assess what 'The Patriot Way" is without recognizing that what they do is, and must be, different in seasons where they must resign their own, and in seasons when they do not, and of course with respect to the cap.

Whenever there is money available over and above signing their own, the Patriots are aggressive in trade and Free Agency. When they must dedicate most of the budget to keeping their own players, then they are cautious and frugal in Free Agency.
Every season is different, because the parameters of the cap, which of their own players are free, and where the needs are, is different.

 

[BradyFTW!]

All I have heard on the radio for the last week or so is how the Pats have adopted a win now philosophy and radically changed their approach to free agency. But have they really?

Take away Revis and everything they have done seems pretty consistent to previous years. Re-signing Edelman is consistent to what they do. Offer him a contract at what they perceive market value and let him shop himself to find out there is no big money out there. Browner and LaFell are both mid market free agents no different than Amendola last year. In other words, a guy with decent to big upside potential but not among the best guys at his position available.

Even Revis fits their model to a point. The Pats have always loved going after once in a generation talent on low risk one year moves. They did that with Moss and Dillon. The only difference is that Revis is still in his prime and didn't have massive down years coming to the Pats like Moss and Dillon. So he commanded a big contract to sign.

I would argue that take away Revis and people would be killing the Pats for bargain shopping in free agency just like I think if it wasn't for Welker leaving last year people would have loved the Amendola move around this time last year. But because of Revis, even Belichick bashers like Callahan and Felger are gushing over him for "going for it" and "realizing Brady's window is closing".

I just don't know if I see it that way. If Belichick was in that mode, he would make a run at Jared Allen or DeMarcus Ware before he was signed. I don't think he will touch Allen and his price tag. I just think arguably the greatest CB in the league and possibly all time fell on his lap and it was too good to pass up.

I like what the Pats have done in free agency thus far, but I still think they are doing what they always do.

What do you expect to hear on the radio? Those guys don't know anything.

No, the Patriots haven't adopted a win-now mentality, at least not to the extent that they're sacrificing the future to strengthen the present. Every single deal that they've made, as you noted, is consistent with their philosophy of balancing short-term production with long-term flexibility. Even the Browner deal, which looked rich from the raw numbers, comes with almost zero guaranteed dollars and a ton of playing time based bonuses. I'd be willing to bet that the LaFell contract is structured in pretty much the same way. And who knows, given the amount of money that he signed for, I really doubt that it was the salary numbers that made Woodyard choose Tennessee over New England. It probably came down to guaranteed money.

Even the Revis contract is far from the future-mortgaging type of deal that "win-now" entails. Yes, his salary is spread over two years, but that's more an acknowledgement of the fact that the expanding cap and the dramatically better cap situation next offseason (thanks, Hernandez) makes that a viable option.

There are plenty of examples of win now philosophy that can be pointed to around the league at this very moment. Denver and New Orleans are two prominent examples. The Patriots are a whole other animal. Yes, they're building a roster that can win now, but not at the expense of 3-4 years from now. They're more or less building on a "win always" philosophy.

 

[The Brandon Five]

I think the philosophy has been pretty consistent: just win. Win now, win later, win every game.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

it's good to see BB going after his trade-mark "double-tap" on positions.

2007=WR We got Moss & Welker (though we all knew Brady needed receiving weapons badly)
2008=LB Mayo and Crable
2009=WE don't talk about 2009
2010=TE Gronk and Hernandez (sorry about bringing that up)
2011=RB Ridley & Vereen
2012=DE Chandler Jones and Jake Bequette
2013=DB Revis & Brandon Browner

 

[40yrpatsfan]

You cannot, as most people do, assess what 'The Patriot Way" is without recognizing that what they do is, and must be, different in seasons where they must resign their own, and in seasons when they do not, and of course with respect to the cap.

Whenever there is money available over and above signing their own, the Patriots are aggressive in trade and Free Agency. When they must dedicate most of the budget to keeping their own players, then they are cautious and frugal in Free Agency.
Every season is different, because the parameters of the cap, which of their own players are free, and where the needs are, is different.

Good point, and also influenced by what specific players are available.

There's no change in BB's philosophy, it's the talking heads looking for something controversial to drum up, together with media & fan ignorance of the difference between salary and cap. Revis makes $12m this year but his cap hit is only about $7m, with the other $5m moved to next year when Hernandez' cap hit come off the books. While it would have been nice to sign him to a longer term, it works for us this year without any major downstream damage.

 

[Brady6]

All I have heard on the radio for the last week or so is how the Pats have adopted a win now philosophy and radically changed their approach to free agency. But have they really?

Take away Revis and everything they have done seems pretty consistent to previous years. Re-signing Edelman is consistent to what they do. Offer him a contract at what they perceive market value and let him shop himself to find out there is no big money out there. Browner and LaFell are both mid market free agents no different than Amendola last year. In other words, a guy with decent to big upside potential but not among the best guys at his position available.

Even Revis fits their model to a point. The Pats have always loved going after once in a generation talent on low risk one year moves. They did that with Moss and Dillon. The only difference is that Revis is still in his prime and didn't have massive down years coming to the Pats like Moss and Dillon. So he commanded a big contract to sign.

I would argue that take away Revis and people would be killing the Pats for bargain shopping in free agency just like I think if it wasn't for Welker leaving last year people would have loved the Amendola move around this time last year. But because of Revis, even Belichick bashers like Callahan and Felger are gushing over him for "going for it" and "realizing Brady's window is closing".

I just don't know if I see it that way. If Belichick was in that mode, he would make a run at Jared Allen or DeMarcus Ware before he was signed. I don't think he will touch Allen and his price tag. I just think arguably the greatest CB in the league and possibly all time fell on his lap and it was too good to pass up.

I like what the Pats have done in free agency thus far, but I still think they are doing what they always do.

I do not understand why it is viewed as win now philosophy at all.

Brandon Browner – 29 years old
Darrelle Revis – 28 years old
Brandon LaFell – 27 years old
Julian Edelman – 27 years old
Michael Hoomanawanui – 25 years old

Every player we signed was under age 30. That is not win now that is win for the next 3-5 years.

 

[AzPatsFan]

The Chicken little crowd like myself have been clammoring for an approach like this for years. Brady's window is probably Three year Tops at a semi-high level he's not Elite anymore. Baring injuries we are the Favorites in the AFC. I would like to see them win one more. I love the make up of this Defense.

Unlike others you HAVE noticed that the Pats have a Top Ten Defense with ZERO additional changes. The Pats were the second highest scoring Team despite the rookie WRs, and the injuries. The LAST thing we need are new TEs equivalent to Hoomanawanui. Good block, No speed, Can catch, but Can't get open, etc. Draft and convert a big WR, who is tough and wil fight for a contested catch. Ignore his lack of great TE blocking. We have Gronk and Hooman for that.

The Pats lost the AFCCG because of injuries everywhere, and playing on the road in Denver, and the terrible interior Offensive line play. Same as 2011.

FIX the damn interior Offensive line. That is JOB #1, #2, and #3!

Thankfully there are lots of good OLs coming out this year. Draft a couple of lower rated tackles (due to height) and move them inside to G and C.


Guys like Zack Smith, Joel Bitonio, Xavier SuaFilo, and Rich Westerberg.

 

[mgteich]

Yes, we are a top 10 defense, assuming no front seven injuries.

Yes, we need help in the interior of the OL. This is not a real secret since we have 2 free agent OL's.

HOWEVER, unless you are fine with Bequette (#3 & rotational TE) and Beauharnais (#4 LB), we have a major depth issue in the defensive front seven. Buchanan is our DE backup pass-rusher (with Carter gone).

The need for front seven depth was underlined last year when we had 2 injuries among the DE/OLB's and 2 injuries among the DT's. Belichick survived with people of the streets. We have the depth at DT (although a young addition is needed, likely in the early part of the draft).

We do not have the depth at DE or LB.

Unlike others you HAVE noticed that the Pats have a Top Ten Defense with ZERO additional changes. The Pats were the second highest scoring Team despite the rookie WRs, and the injuries. The LAST thing we need are new TEs equivalent to Hoomanawanui. Good block, No speed, Can catch, but Can't get open, etc. Draft and convert a big WR, who is tough and wil fight for a contested catch. Ignore his lack of great TE blocking. We have Gronk and Hooman for that.

The Pats lost the AFCCG because of injuries everywhere, and playing on the road in Denver, and the terrible interior Offensive line play. Same as 2011.

FIX the damn interior Offensive line. That is JOB #1, #2, and #3!

Thankfully there are lots of good OLs coming out this year. Draft a couple of lower rated tackles (due to height) and move them inside to G and C.


Guys like Zack Smith, Joel Bitonio, Xavier SuaFilo, and Rich Westerberg.

 

[dex13]

since Kraft took over, I've always thought that the philosophy was to win. Win today, win tomorrow, etc....so I really don't think anything's changed. We've actually seen this a few times. The pats get beat in a big game and BB basically scraps the previous team ideas and reloads with a new concept. It always seems to come in bunches every few years.

For a while, it was the 3-4 solid D. Then he started to switch to a 4-3 with a lot of subs. Added some high profile WRs then went with the double TE and now a smothering and fast secondary. Kinda reminds me of the team philosophy when Harrison and Bruschi were roaming the center of the field.

 

[everlong]

The interesting thing for me is this draft is loaded with good WR and CB prospects, best in years. In itself that's not proof of a win now philosophy but I do think they recognize the need to get that 4th ring now and not wait on prospects to develop. Personally I think it's probably a win now without flushing tomorrow down the crapper philosophy vs Elway is saying tomorrow be dammed.

 

[dex13]

The interesting thing for me is this draft is loaded with good WR and CB prospects, best in years. In itself that's not proof of a win now philosophy but I do think they recognize the need to get that 4th ring now and not wait on prospects to develop. Personally I think it's probably a win now without flushing tomorrow down the crapper philosophy vs Elway is saying tomorrow be dammed.

well prospects are considered prospects for a reason...and lets not overlook the fact that BB's best CB pick is actually much better as a safety. What I really like about this FA is it allows BB to play to his drafting strength...drafting lineman and linebackers. He seems to do much better with this.