Has Tim Tebow earned a roster spot on the Patriots?

[Suddyfan]

Kind of confused as to where you got the idea that I thought Tebow played well against the Pats in the playoffs. He did suck in that game, so did the rest of the team, including the defense.

With that said though, the Pats D did step up in the playoffs.

Against the Steelers, sure, they were banged up and Clark was missing. The Broncos were banged up as well and Tebow was missing his #2 receiver in Eric Decker. Polamalu was out there and was a non factor and got burned a few times. Harrison was another non factor. Most people on the planet didn't expect the Steeler D to completely fall apart simply because Ryan Clark didn't play.

I guess I just feel its inferred because you keep stating that 2011 defense wasn't atrocious. I see it as a way to deflect the true blame, which is on Tebow and the broncos for just a really bad bad game.

 

[Brock Samson]

Tebow had good stats overall and factored in the win immensely. He even threw a 50 yard bomb that would have sealed it before overtime that went through DT's hands.

It's the only way for a guy to bail out his hero who couldn't score for nearly 75% of the game. You lose 9/10 games in the NFL playing that way.

Brock you are like a parody of a Tebow hater parsing his stats LOL, now you have to go quarter by quarter because the overall stats do not fit your agenda.

Wait, you just ignored other data not fitting your agenda. Head explodes. :bricks:

So he had nothing to do with the win? tell that to the players and coaches on the video RALLYING around him

I didn't see any rallying until the end of the game, he was the one rallying before that (which speaks well of him). Still, Barber had more to do with that win than Tebow.

Tebow might be the worse NFL QB in history

I wouldn't even say he's that bad. But he still sucks and takes forever to get rid of the ball.

but he sure factored in that win against the Bears and nothing you say or do will change actual history.

Uhhh, Daniel Fells also factored in that win, what with his 0 receptions for 1 target. Factored in doesn't say much at all.

LOL - just saw that Caleb Hanie was the Bears starter in that game. How does that even go to overtime? LOL, help from above indeed.

 

[Demosthenes]

I guess I just feel its inferred because you keep stating that 2011 defense wasn't atrocious. I see it as a way to deflect the true blame, which is on Tebow and the broncos for just a really bad bad game.

Cool. I get where you could infer that. It's absolutely true that I don't think the Pats D was as bad as many of you all believe. Yes, they gave up yardage, but they were stingy in giving up points. A lot of that has to do with field position. Brady rarely goes 3 and out at the Pats 20, therefore, Mesko was rarely punting from his own end zone or deep in Pats territory. Therefore, opposing teams often found themselves having to drive the length of the field.

That said, they played a great game against Denver had a scheme that McCoy was unprepared for. My thought was that they played a 5-2, but someone around here thought it was a 4-3 under or over. What I do know is that for most the game, the Pats showed a 5 man front and they spent most the night in Denver's backfield.

IIRC, there was one play where Ninkovitch beat Orlando Franklin so badly that he was back at Tebow's drop point about the same time that Tebow got there. Didn't help that Tebow played poorly as well.

 

[Ironman44]

It's the only way for a guy to bail out his hero who couldn't score for nearly 75% of the game. You lose 9/10 games in the NFL playing that way.
Wait, you just ignored other data not fitting your agenda. Head explodes. :bricks:
I didn't see any rallying until the end of the game, he was the one rallying before that (which speaks well of him). Still, Barber had more to do with that win than Tebow.
I wouldn't even say he's that bad. But he still sucks and takes forever to get rid of the ball.

Uhhh, Daniel Fells also factored in that win, what with his 0 receptions for 1 target. Factored in doesn't say much at all.
LOL - just saw that Caleb Hanie was the Bears starter in that game. How does that even go to overtime? LOL, help from above indeed.

Here is my response

what actually happened
Tebow Soundtrack from Chicago Bears game 12-11-11 - YouTube

 

[Suddyfan]

Cool. I get where you could infer that. It's absolutely true that I don't think the Pats D was as bad as many of you all believe. Yes, they gave up yardage, but they were stingy in giving up points. A lot of that has to do with field position. Brady rarely goes 3 and out at the Pats 20, therefore, Mesko was rarely punting from his own end zone or deep in Pats territory. Therefore, opposing teams often found themselves having to drive the length of the field.

That said, they played a great game against Denver had a scheme that McCoy was unprepared for. My thought was that they played a 5-2, but someone around here thought it was a 4-3 under or over. What I do know is that for most the game, the Pats showed a 5 man front and they spent most the night in Denver's backfield.

IIRC, there was one play where Ninkovitch beat Orlando Franklin so badly that he was back at Tebow's drop point about the same time that Tebow got there. Didn't help that Tebow played poorly as well.

I agree that broncos game was bad on all accounts.

 

[SDI_Gator]

Cool. I get where you could infer that. It's absolutely true that I don't think the Pats D was as bad as many of you all believe. Yes, they gave up yardage, but they were stingy in giving up points. A lot of that has to do with field position. Brady rarely goes 3 and out at the Pats 20, therefore, Mesko was rarely punting from his own end zone or deep in Pats territory. Therefore, opposing teams often found themselves having to drive the length of the field.

That said, they played a great game against Denver had a scheme that McCoy was unprepared for. My thought was that they played a 5-2, but someone around here thought it was a 4-3 under or over. What I do know is that for most the game, the Pats showed a 5 man front and they spent most the night in Denver's backfield.

IIRC, there was one play where Ninkovitch beat Orlando Franklin so badly that he was back at Tebow's drop point about the same time that Tebow got there. Didn't help that Tebow played poorly as well.

Tebow and the Broncos as a whole played terribly that game. I remember watching that game thinking "WTF happened to this team in a week.."

The problem with Tebow is how people perceive what he has done. Brock Sampson here wanted to point out that Tebow went 3-16 in the first 3 1/2 quarters of the Bears game and got lucky that Marion went out of bounds and THEN coughed it up in OT. I see it as Tebow played very poorly against a solid D for most of the game and still rallied his team till the 4th when he turned it on and went 18-24 and led his team back into the game when all seemed lost. Never lost hope, always acts like he can win. That's why I want to see Tebow do well. Marion going out of bounds and giving up the ball was certainly a factor, but if Tebow doesn't start playing lights out in the 4th that never mattered at all.

 

[Ironman44]

Tebow and the Broncos as a whole played terribly that game. I remember watching that game thinking "WTF happened to this team in a week.."

The problem with Tebow is how people perceive what he has done. Brock Sampson here wanted to point out that Tebow went 3-16 in the first 3 1/2 quarters of the Bears game and got lucky that Marion went out of bounds and THEN coughed it up in OT. I see it as Tebow played very poorly against a solid D for most of the game and still rallied his team till the 4th when he turned it on and went 18-24 and led his team back into the game when all seemed lost. Never lost hope, always acts like he can win. That's why I want to see Tebow do well. Marion going out of bounds and giving up the ball was certainly a factor, but if Tebow doesn't start playing lights out in the 4th that never mattered at all.

Dear sir , this is not the thread to make well thought out reasonable and intelligent post...please move along.

 

[SDI_Gator]

Dear sir , this is not the thread to make well thought out reasonable and intelligent post...please move along.

i iz sory.. wont do agin...

 

[sb1]

Cool. I get where you could infer that. It's absolutely true that I don't think the Pats D was as bad as many of you all believe.

Any defense that lets Dan Orlovsky..the guy who was the starter on the 0-16 Lions team... have a career day against them...plus lets all those other QBs mentioned throw for big yardage... is really, really bad. They also ranked 15th in points allowed (per PFR.COM) so they weren't particularly stingy in that area either.

In the playoffs they played well against the Broncos but not so much against the Ravens, allowed what should have been the game losing drive...and they let the Giants control the ball at will for the Super Bowl.

You were not following this team then so you will have to take our word for it.

They stunk.

I must admit I'm a little surprised you are so focused on points... when just a few days ago you were talking about "sabermetrics" and needing to evaluate things outside of the box... and here you are eyes focused nicely inside that box

 

[Triumph]

Mallet may have a cannon but his accuracy hasn't improved and he constantly stares down receivers instead of going through his progressions. He still has room to improve, but I think we pick up another QB next year and try to move Mallet.

Tebow on the team doesnt help Mallet improve going forward. In camp, it appears that Tebow pushed Mallet, but once the season starts the media will be tripping over themselves to see Tebow come in if NE gets a lead. Id rather Mallet face first string defenses fighting to get the football back for their offense. He needs the experience.

All Tebow will be is a distraction.

 

[pats4life12]

Thanks for coming in and making such a dumb contribution.

She is only makeing sence why we still have him he is beyond me, he is a third sting QB who is not that good,the thread is getting old.

 

[sb1]

When evaluating quarterbacks, rings (and overall performances in big games) are a big factor. They are not the only factor but, like it or not, they are an important one.

Statistically speaking, Peyton Manning leads Tom Brady in every major category except rating, in which they are 0.9 apart. But why do so many, including me, consider Brady the superior quarterback? Because Brady is 17-7 in the playoffs with 3 Super Bowl Championships (and 2 one-and-done)versus Manning who is 9-11 with 1 Championship (and 8 one-and-done).

Whenever Tom Brady has been handed the ball with a couple minutes left in a Super Bowl needing a score, he has produced. Same thing happened to Manning, and he threw a pick-6.

I don't know about that last part...he certainly didn't do that in the last 2 SB's.

SB rings, like wins, are a team accomplishment. When a QB like Dilfer can "win" a ring, or when Big Ben can throw for a 22 passer rating and "win" a ring, or when a very young Tom Brady can go through the playoffs and win a ring despite throwing 1 TD pass for the entire postseason...that proves it beyond a shadow of a doubt.

 

[PatriotReign]

Cool. I get where you could infer that. It's absolutely true that I don't think the Pats D was as bad as many of you all believe. Yes, they gave up yardage, but they were stingy in giving up points. A lot of that has to do with field position. Brady rarely goes 3 and out at the Pats 20, therefore, Mesko was rarely punting from his own end zone or deep in Pats territory. Therefore, opposing teams often found themselves having to drive the length of the field.

That said, they played a great game against Denver had a scheme that McCoy was unprepared for. My thought was that they played a 5-2, but someone around here thought it was a 4-3 under or over. What I do know is that for most the game, the Pats showed a 5 man front and they spent most the night in Denver's backfield.

IIRC, there was one play where Ninkovitch beat Orlando Franklin so badly that he was back at Tebow's drop point about the same time that Tebow got there. Didn't help that Tebow played poorly as well.

Like I said in an earlier post the D surrendered two go ahead drives when the game was on the line. They were fortunate to beat Baltimore, and their luck ran out against the Giants.

Also in that Superbowl the defense couldn't get off the field and allowed the giants nearly 2:1 in time of possession. The defense that year was putrid.

 

[Brock Samson]

Marion going out of bounds and giving up the ball was certainly a factor, but if Tebow doesn't start playing lights out in the 4th that never mattered at all.

Doesn't matter much because while it's nice for 1 game over a season or over a career you are a complete and utter detriment to your team if you play like crap for most of the game.

Advanced NFL Stats: Win Probability

It crap like this that only reinforces the idea that while Tebow looks terrible for 95% of his snaps and good for like 5% of them there are more meaningful reasons as to why the guy is not an NFL quarterback.

So based on his situational 2010 stats he throws pretty well for attempts 21-30 based on QB rating even though his completion percentage is crap. He also throws well in the 2nd half but win probability aside he also sucked in the last 2 minutes of the game. Very similar in 2011.

So while you can cherry pick a 4th quarter comeback that was basically handed to him by a terrible and lazy running back, it's pretty clear to anybody who's honest with himself that Tebow is a detriment to his team as a starting quarterback if he doesn't play well before the 4th quarter, which he certainly does not.

 

[PatriotReign]

Tebow on the team doesnt help Mallet improve going forward. In camp, it appears that Tebow pushed Mallet, but once the season starts the media will be tripping over themselves to see Tebow come in if NE gets a lead. Id rather Mallet face first string defenses fighting to get the football back for their offense. He needs the experience.

All Tebow will be is a distraction.

That's unlikely because unless Brady gets injured no other QB's will see the field this season. Even in blowouts he plays late into the game and I don't see that changing anytime soon.

 

[larryo]

Has there ever been a study about people obsessed about arguing online? A reality show would be boring but a study would be fascinating.

 

[wizwor]

I really do not think BB brings guys in to screw with the media (or the fans). It's entirely plausible that BB and JM see Tebow as a project. The last time the Pats carried an extra QB, that worked out OK.

The big difference is that no one knew that kid was on the team. This guy is in the spotlight. Another difference was that TFB was just a football player. There was nothing about him to like or dislike. This guy is a lightning rod because he has character -- something apparently offensive to half of this country and most of Massachusetts.

It's too bad 'fans' of the team cannot hope that one of its players is successful, but I'll bet Tim Tebow will turn the other cheek.

Here's to hoping that Tebow will someday mature into a suitable replacement for the GOAT -- just because he wears the laundry.

Whats hilarious is you guys all debating this. He is going to be on the final roster book it, and no matter what you guys complain about its going to happen.

Also you will be surprised how they will use him to win throughout the season then all of you guys will be tuggin his junk Tebow fans.

Facts:
1. Tebow will make the team
2. Tebow will be #2 backup sometimes this season
3. Tebow will be the successor to Brady and have much success

The reason you all debate it is because you know deep down its true and you hate it.

 

[SDI_Gator]

Has there ever been a study about people obsessed about arguing online? A reality show would be boring but a study would be fascinating.

No it wouldn't. Quit making stuff up!

 

[Demosthenes]

Any defense that lets Dan Orlovsky..the guy who was the starter on the 0-16 Lions team... have a career day against them...plus lets all those other QBs mentioned throw for big yardage... is really, really bad. They also ranked 15th in points allowed (per PFR.COM) so they weren't particularly stingy in that area either.

In the playoffs they played well against the Broncos but not so much against the Ravens, allowed what should have been the game losing drive...and they let the Giants control the ball at will for the Super Bowl.

You were not following this team then so you will have to take our word for it.

They stunk.

I must admit I'm a little surprised you are so focused on points... when just a few days ago you were talking about "sabermetrics" and needing to evaluate things outside of the box... and here you are eyes focused nicely inside that box

My eyes aren't focused "inside the box" when looking at points. Why ? Because most do what you apparently do and rank defenses by yards allowed

Simple fact. The team with the most points at the end of the game wins, the team with fewer points loses. You can't say the same thing about total yards. Its often the case that the team with the most yards actually loses the game.

 

[SDI_Gator]

My eyes aren't focused "inside the box" when looking at points. Why ? Because most do what you apparently do and rank defenses by yards allowed

Simple fact. The team with the most points at the end of the game wins, the team with fewer points loses. You can't say the same thing about total yards. Its often the case that the team with the most yards actually loses the game.

Especially if Tebow is involved..


sorry, had to.. couldn't stop myself.