Stephen Gostkowski Thoughts?

[patsinthesnow]

Is anyone else surprised BB hasn't brought in any competition to push Gost?

Last year, he was 19th in FG PCT with 82.9%, which is skewed as it is because he only attempted two 50+ yard kicks.

This year, he's been missing FGs left and right in training camp, and started the preseason out 1 for 3.

Some argue that he is invaluable on kickoffs. Last year he was 3rd in the league with 59 kickoff returns and 4th with 52 touchbacks. Of course he'd have more touchbacks than others, we scored the 3rd most points in NFL history. Gostkowski was 17th in kickoff touchback % with 44.72%. It's a myth that he's great at touchbacks, everyone is with the new rules.

Some may argue he has an elite leg. His career long in 7 seasons is only 53 yards.

I'm not trying to hate on the guy, but is anyone else surprised we haven't tried to push him?

 

[Kid~Brady]

I agree.

Something isn't right with him, he used to be a very reliable kicker. Now, I hold my breath when he kicks field goals now. I think BB needs to do something about it.

Where's Nate Kaeding?

 

[sb1]

Is anyone else surprised BB hasn't brought in any competition to push Gost?

Last year, he was 19th in FG PCT with 82.9%, which is skewed as it is because he only attempted two 50+ yard kicks.

This year, he's been missing FGs left and right in training camp, and started the preseason out 1 for 3.

Some argue that he is invaluable on kickoffs. Last year he was 3rd in the league with 59 kickoff returns and 4th with 52 touchbacks. Of course he'd have more touchbacks than others, we scored the 3rd most points in NFL history. Gostkowski was 17th in kickoff touchback % with 44.72%. It's a myth that he's great at touchbacks, everyone is with the new rules.

Some may argue he has an elite leg. His career long in 7 seasons is only 53 yards.

I'm not trying to hate on the guy, but is anyone else surprised we haven't tried to push him?

Agreed.

I think it's interesting they brought in competition for Mesko and not Ghost. Hopefully Ghost is not going to be a problem this year.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Some argue that he is invaluable on kickoffs. Last year he was 3rd in the league with 59 kickoff returns and 4th with 52 touchbacks. Of course he'd have more touchbacks than others, we scored the 3rd most points in NFL history. Gostkowski was 17th in kickoff touchback % with 44.72%. It's a myth that he's great at touchbacks, everyone is with the new rules.

Two possible explanations:

(1) When you're down 20-30 points late in a game, you're more likely to try to make a play.

(2) The Pats had the best KO coverage in the league last year. Often times, the Pats could do BETTER by having the opponents try to return a KO than by getting a touchback.

 

[PatsFan2]

Is anyone else surprised BB hasn't brought in any competition to push Gost?

Last year, he was 19th in FG PCT with 82.9%, which is skewed as it is because he only attempted two 50+ yard kicks.

This year, he's been missing FGs left and right in training camp, and started the preseason out 1 for 3.

Some argue that he is invaluable on kickoffs. Last year he was 3rd in the league with 59 kickoff returns and 4th with 52 touchbacks. Of course he'd have more touchbacks than others, we scored the 3rd most points in NFL history. Gostkowski was 17th in kickoff touchback % with 44.72%. It's a myth that he's great at touchbacks, everyone is with the new rules.

Some may argue he has an elite leg. His career long in 7 seasons is only 53 yards.

I'm not trying to hate on the guy, but is anyone else surprised we haven't tried to push him?

Ghost is the FG kicker on a Team that scores alot of TD's not his fault. But If he were on another team that relies heavily on FG's, I wonder how good or how clutch he would be. I woudn't want him to be a position to win it for us at the distance of 40 or more yards out. He's not Adam Automatic from those distances with the game on the line. I would rather Ghost kick Pats he looks comfortable kicking those.

 

[BTTA]

Two possible explanations:

(1) When you're down 20-30 points late in a game, you're more likely to try to make a play.

(2) The Pats had the best KO coverage in the league last year. Often times, the Pats could do BETTER by having the opponents try to return a KO than by getting a touchback.

Agree that the KO statistics have many variables and are thus very hard to compare, team to team.

The FG stats though are a bit alarming; when he joined the team, he seemed to be all set to be one of the best in the league, for years. Now, it appears he's very average. The Pats don't settle for average very often. So the original question wondering about the lack of camp competition seems appropriate.

Unless someone can point out that the FG stats of the past couple of years aren't in fact a bit alarming.

 

[shmessy]

Ghost is the FG kicker on a Team that scores alot of TD's not his fault. But If he were on another team that relies heavily on FG's, I wonder how good or how clutch he would be. I woudn't want him to be a position to win it for us at the distance of 40 or more yards out. He's not Adam Automatic from those distances with the game on the line. I would rather Ghost kick Pats he looks comfortable kicking those.

Funny you bring up "Adam Automatic".

I'm more than happy that they chose to let AV go when they did and brought Ghost in at that time.

Ghost has been far better over the past 7 seasons (84.2% vs 83.8% - - anyone want to compare the relative conditions in the fall/winter of Gillette Stadium versus the RCA Dome?). Last year "Adam Automatic" was 78.8%.

People should think of that (comparing players at the SAME time during different parts of their career) when they look at the Amendola/Welker situation also. Will Amendola be as good as the 2007-2012 Welker? No. Will he be as good as the 2013-2018 Welker? I like his chances.

 

[patsinthesnow]

I'm more than happy that they chose to let AV go when they did and brought Ghost in at that time.

Ghost has been far better over that period of time. Last year "Adam Automatic" was 78.8% and he plays in a dome.

People should think of that (comparing players at the same time during different parts of their career) when they look at the Amendola/Welker situation also. Will Amendola be as good as the 2007-2012 Welker? No. Will he be as good as the 2013-2018 Welker? I like his chances.

Gostkowski: 40-49 yards: 9-13 50+: 2-2

Vinatieri: 40-49 yards: 9-10 50+: 4-7

I take Adam.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Unless someone can point out that the FG stats of the past couple of years aren't in fact a bit alarming.

Even with two "down" seasons, he's still just one kick outside of the top 10 all time in career %age.

And, needless to say, for whatever reason, the Patriots felt all they needed to bring in was a camp leg, and even he got the boot pretty quickly.

 

[shmessy]

Gostkowski: 40-49 yards: 9-13 50+: 2-2

Vinatieri: 40-49 yards: 9-10 50+: 4-7

I take Adam.

The year in which you compare? 82.9% Ghost 78.8% Vinatieri.

Since we let Vinny go? 84.2% Open ended Gillette Stadium vs. 83.8% RCA Dome 72% and 0 mph wind. (Odd that someone with the postername "Patsinthesnow" would not be cognizant of that relevant difference).

To each his own, I guess.

I prefer my team wins.

 

[chasa]

Ghost should take notice of what bill just did to the WR core, and make 95% of his kicks this year, or Bill should maybe get a new kicker.

 

[patsinthesnow]

The year in which you compare? 82.9% Ghost 78.8% Vinatieri.

Since we let Vinny go? 84.2% Open ended Gillette Stadium vs. 83.8% RCA Dome 72% and 0 mph wind. (Odd that someone with the postername "Patsinthesnow" would not be cognizant of that relevant difference).

To each his own, I guess.

I prefer my team wins.

Of course Gost's kick percentage is better, he's only attempted 10 50+ kicks in 7 years.

The total career % thing is a farce. Adam's career % from 40-49 yards: 82.5%, Gost: 70%.

Is Greg Zurlein a bad kicker because his 2012 % was 74.8? Of course not, he went 7-7 from 40-49 yards. He attempted 13 50+ yard kicks, really hurting his percentage.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Ghost should take notice of what bill just did to the WR core, and make 95% of his kicks this year, or Bill should maybe get a new kicker.

If the Pats ask Gostkowski to kick 20 50-yarders this year, they're not going to expect him to make 95% of them. . . .

One last thought to add here: unlike, say, running backs, many kickers get BETTER with age: most kickers who play 10+ years have their best seasons in their 30s or even their 40s.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Two possible explanations:

(1) When you're down 20-30 points late in a game, you're more likely to try to make a play.

(2) The Pats had the best KO coverage in the league last year. Often times, the Pats could do BETTER by having the opponents try to return a KO than by getting a touchback.

Good point on #2 CT, you got me there.

CT, you're a huge Gost fan. You've had that signature since I can remember. Even you can admit he's been an average kicker for awhile now. I'm not asking to cut the guy, just bring in some competition, every position has it, even LS and P.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Good point on #2 CT, you got me there.

CT, you're a huge Gost fan. You've had that signature since I can remember. Even you can admit he's been an average kicker for awhile now. I'm not asking to cut the guy, just bring in some competition, every position has it, even LS and P.

I've about given up on trying to understand the way BB thinks regarding kickers.

Seriously, though, it's worth pointing out that BB has NEVER felt it necessary to have serious competition for Gostkowski on the roster, and the extension he got in 2010 actually stunned me.

 

[Claremonster]

BB does need to address the kicking problem...I've said it numerous times already.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

I think for this season he deserves to be the starter. 3 main reasons:

1. Economics - I believe not much can be gained capwise from cutting him/replacing him this season.

2. He's been solid enough over the course of his career to allow him a chance to bounce back from a couple meh seasons.

3. He's been very reliable in the playoffs.

Next year however #1 will be a different story, I expect/hope for strong competition if he has another unspectacular season. He IS being paid like an elite kicker and I don't think he's lived up to his contract the last 2 years - FG% in the lower half of the league both seasons and a strong but not impenetrable kickoff game, you really shouldn't be paying him higher than somewhere around the league average for kickers if that keeps up.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Next year however #1 will be a different story, I expect/hope for strong competition if he has another unspectacular season. He IS being paid like an elite kicker and I don't think he's lived up to his contract the last 2 years - FG% in the lower half of the league both seasons and a strong but not impenetrable kickoff game, you really shouldn't be paying him higher than somewhere around the league average for kickers if that keeps up.

I give him a pass for 2011 because of the quad tear and the lockout. I agree last year was a bit shaky, but he still led the league in scoring in any case.

And, as I said before, I don't get BB's thinking on kickers in any case.

 

[Jimke]

Did Mesko hold on all three kicks? They had been trying out Allen in
some practice sessions.

 

[shmessy]

Of course Gost's kick percentage is better, he's only attempted 10 50+ kicks in 7 years.

The total career % thing is a farce. Adam's career % from 40-49 yards: 82.5%, Gost: 70%.

Is Greg Zurlein a bad kicker because his 2012 % was 74.8? Of course not, he went 7-7 from 40-49 yards. He attempted 13 50+ yard kicks, really hurting his percentage.

Wow. And you bring up ANOTHER DOME KICKER.

FG percentages are the most important thing. You play to WIN the game.

If you are going to base your point on length of attempt and then completely ignore 72 degree zero mph wind dome versus open end Northeast stadium, then you, sir, are doing the very definition of "cherry picking".

OF COURSE a HC will choose to attempt more 50+ yard kicks in a dome than outdoors in the northeast - - this should not be a revelation.

Obviously, you are trying to make a Strato-Matic Football argument based completely on PARTS of statistics without actually understanding the sport is played by humanoids on a planet called earth that has weather for outdoor games.