Willie McGinest rips Wes Welker

[DaBruinz]

Re: Willie McGinest: Sign the contract Wes

Is the name calling really necessary?

For trolls who do nothing, yes. Don't like it? Leave.

 

[DaBruinz]

LOL.......welker should stick to foot comments for rex ryan.

at least willie knew how to show up in big games

Welker has never showed up in big games? Really???

BTW, Willie showed up in TWO big games.. The AFCCG against the Colts and the SB against the Rams.. Where was he otherwise?

 

[Lampshade]

Mind your own business, Willie. You could not be more off base if you tried.

 

[DW Toys]

The franchise tag is inherently unfair to the individual player. That's the whole point of the franchise tag, which is designed to put an artificial brake on the salaries of top players while keeping them from changing teams.



The Patriots reportedly offered 2 years, $16 million.



His ability to sit out and not sign the deal is clearly leverage.



At 9 this year and over 10 next year (franchise tag values), why would he want to sign a 3 year deal for 20 (actually around 20.7 as I recall)? Barring injury, he's essentially got either 20 guaranteed for 2 years or 9 guaranteed for one with complete and untagged free agency following that.



True, but the only people making the "overpay" argument are those who want Welker to be underpaid.



Welker caught 122 this past season, with Gronk setting TE records and getting 90 catches, and Hernandez grabbing 79 receptions. They may not be maxed out, but they're likely close, and they could both see fewer, rather than more, catches moving forward. Any likely cut into Welker's numbers would likely come from Lloyd getting more than the 51 catches that Branch had. So, unless the thought is that Lloyd is going to be putting up significantly more than 71 catches year in and year out, there are still going to be 100 catches, give or take, there for Welker.

Any more significant cuts into Welker's reception totals are more likely to come from a better WR4 option and from the RB reception numbers than from Gronk/Hernandez/Lloyd.

Seems to me we had another WR who made a distraction of his contract too. Then he came back and said it was the wrong thing he did. The Pats got along without Branch. I like Welker but this could be his swan song....If so, don't let the door hit you in the asse! We have three Slot receivers and let's see what the market is for Giselle's buddy Draft day? I say Trade for a real NFL player not a definate maybe. Seymour sung the same song and he was gone even though we had no replacement (and still do not) for him. What happened to the real Seymour pick? No one knows it was split more times than an Apple stock but no where near as profitable.

What is Spielman's phone number in Minn. to swap for Allen and everybody is happy? I know. I know .Makes too much sense.

I know one thing. I don't want Draft picks for Welker because BB is too afraid to use them on the top end of the Draft. He collects them like Pokemon Cards until he gets his Dream scenario, Round One all to himself. I'd rather have a body. How about Welker for Forte if everyone is aghast that Allen could come here(and it has been discussed by the Minn. reporters)? BB is an excellent coach, in fact best ever but send him to the Vineyard Draft day to sit on Five Rings and fish. He is a mediocre Drafter.

This nightmare is starting to sound like Branch so let's dump him now.

DW Toys

 

[patsinthesnow]

Welker just fired a salvo back at McGinest:

@williemcginest why did u ever leave the Pats and play for the Browns?​

Twitter/WesWelker

And Willie fires bacK:

Willie McGinest?@WillieMcGinestReply
Retweet

Favorite
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@WesWelker My point exactly. We're all expendable at Patriot Place

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Seems to me we had another WR who made a distraction of his contract too. Then he came back and said it was the wrong thing he did. The Pats got along without Branch. I like Welker but this could be his swan song....If so, don't let the door hit you in the asse! We have three Slot receivers and let's see what the market is for Giselle's buddy Draft day? I say Trade for a real NFL player not a definate maybe. Seymour sung the same song and he was gone even though we had no replacement (and still do not) for him. What happened to the real Seymour pick? No one knows it was split more times than an Apple stock but no where near as profitable.

What is Spielman's phone number in Minn. to swap for Allen and everybody is happy? I know. I know .Makes too much sense.

I know one thing. I don't want Draft picks for Welker because BB is too afraid to use them on the top end of the Draft. He collects them like Pokemon Cards until he gets his Dream scenario, Round One all to himself. I'd rather have a body. How about Welker for Forte if everyone is aghast that Allen could come here(and it has been discussed by the Minn. reporters)? BB is an excellent coach, in fact best ever but send him to the Vineyard Draft day to sit on Five Rings and fish. He is a mediocre Drafter.

This nightmare is starting to sound like Branch so let's dump him now.

DW Toys

Branch of course was actually under contract. Welker only wishes he was. And we really got along swimmingly without Branch.

The looney tunes are really coming out from under their rocks as draft day approaches. I even see posters accusing some of these numbskulls of being Mav or NEM, and that's never a good sign...

 

[Lampshade]

That's not your point, Willie, it's Welker's point. If everyone on the Pats is expendable why shouldn't Welker use the only leverage he'll ever have? Welker has gone about the whole thing in exactly the right way.

I honestly don't think McGinest knows what his own point is.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

And Willie fires bacK:

Willie is even dumber than I'd imagined. Probably wasn't expecting that tweet, either. So if we're all expendable why do they even bother to pay us...we should all just pay for free and be thankful for the opportunity, eh Willie?

When the NFLN is through with him he should apply to the NFLPA.

 

[Sciz]

If everyone on the Pats is expendable why shouldn't Welker use the only leverage he'll ever have?

Because the most likely outcome of Welker skipping mandatory camp is that he'll play the season under the tag tender, but without the benefit of that camp stuff that he skips.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Seems to me we had another WR who made a distraction of his contract too. Then he came back and said it was the wrong thing he did. The Pats got along without Branch. I like Welker but this could be his swan song....If so, don't let the door hit you in the asse! We have three Slot receivers and let's see what the market is for Giselle's buddy Draft day? I say Trade for a real NFL player not a definate maybe. Seymour sung the same song and he was gone even though we had no replacement (and still do not) for him. What happened to the real Seymour pick? No one knows it was split more times than an Apple stock but no where near as profitable.

What is Spielman's phone number in Minn. to swap for Allen and everybody is happy? I know. I know .Makes too much sense.

I know one thing. I don't want Draft picks for Welker because BB is too afraid to use them on the top end of the Draft. He collects them like Pokemon Cards until he gets his Dream scenario, Round One all to himself. I'd rather have a body. How about Welker for Forte if everyone is aghast that Allen could come here(and it has been discussed by the Minn. reporters)? BB is an excellent coach, in fact best ever but send him to the Vineyard Draft day to sit on Five Rings and fish. He is a mediocre Drafter.

This nightmare is starting to sound like Branch so let's dump him now.

DW Toys

"What happened to the real Seymour pick? No one knows........"

Huh?

Solder got drafted.

Are really that dumb or do just play a complete fool on patsfans.com?

Even NEM and maverick weren't this god awful stupid.

 

[Gronkandez]

Seems to me we had another WR who made a distraction of his contract too. Then he came back and said it was the wrong thing he did. The Pats got along without Branch. I like Welker but this could be his swan song....If so, don't let the door hit you in the asse! We have three Slot receivers and let's see what the market is for Giselle's buddy Draft day? I say Trade for a real NFL player not a definate maybe. Seymour sung the same song and he was gone even though we had no replacement (and still do not) for him. What happened to the real Seymour pick? No one knows it was split more times than an Apple stock but no where near as profitable.

What is Spielman's phone number in Minn. to swap for Allen and everybody is happy? I know. I know .Makes too much sense.

I know one thing. I don't want Draft picks for Welker because BB is too afraid to use them on the top end of the Draft. He collects them like Pokemon Cards until he gets his Dream scenario, Round One all to himself. I'd rather have a body. How about Welker for Forte if everyone is aghast that Allen could come here(and it has been discussed by the Minn. reporters)? BB is an excellent coach, in fact best ever but send him to the Vineyard Draft day to sit on Five Rings and fish. He is a mediocre Drafter.

This nightmare is starting to sound like Branch so let's dump him now.

DW Toys

Are you being sarcastic? Trade for Welker for Forte and give him a huge contract??!?
The Seymour pick was directly used on Solder. It wasn't 'split' at all.

His boat is in Nantucket not the Vineyard (important detail)

 

[ctpatsfan77]

As I said I really do like Welker, but his price tag want and term at 31 rots. Here is a deal I propose to get everyone on the forum crazy but if you look at it, it makes sense.
TRADE WELKER TO THE VIKINGS FOR JARED ALLEN. Both are Pro Bowlers. Both are of the same age. Both Teams have sufficient replacements in place to take their spots. The Vikes desperately need a WR to go with Harvin. Are they both slots? Thought about that too but why not move one or the other around. Harvin has the migraine issue as well.

There's a better chance of the Patriots drafting YOU this weekend.

 

[Lampshade]

Because the most likely outcome of Welker skipping mandatory camp is that he'll play the season under the tag tender, but without the benefit of that camp stuff that he skips.

Then surely the Pats should be doing their best to get him under contract.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

That's not your point, Willie, it's Welker's point. If everyone on the Pats is expendable why shouldn't Welker use the only leverage he'll ever have? Welker has gone about the whole thing in exactly the right way.

I honestly don't think McGinest knows what his own point is.

Willie knows exactly what his point is.

Willie, Rodney, and Tedy have their current careers based on the Patriots commentary.

I don't remember Willie warranting a PFT story on Browns commentary.

What is fascinating is how quickly patsfans.com became entangled into a very minor story.

 

[Deus Irae]

And Willie fires bacK:

Willie doesn't seem to know the first rule of holes.

 

[JimJohns]

Re: Willie McGinest: Sign the contract Wes

For trolls who do nothing, yes. Don't like it? Leave.

Oh, the irony, the only one inciting flames and trolling here is you. Time to grow up DaBruinz.

 

[Boomer B]

Welker has never showed up in big games? Really???

BTW, Willie showed up in TWO big games.. The AFCCG against the Colts and the SB against the Rams.. Where was he otherwise?

Please don't post nonsense like this.

Willie is the all time NFL leader in playoff sacks. He averaged more then a sack a game in the playoffs. He had 4.5 sacks in one game against the Jags in the playoffs. He had at least 1 sack in 10 out of his 13 career playoff games.

Willie went to far with his comments on Wes, but lets not act like he wasn't a very big part of those championship teams.

 

[IllegalContact]

Welker has never showed up in big games? Really???

BTW, Willie showed up in TWO big games.. The AFCCG against the Colts and the SB against the Rams.. Where was he otherwise?

sacks in 9 consecutive playoff games....

 

[IllegalContact]

Branch of course was actually under contract. Welker only wishes he was. And we really got along swimmingly without Branch.

The looney tunes are really coming out from under their rocks as draft day approaches. I even see posters accusing some of these numbskulls of being Mav or NEM, and that's never a good sign...

LOL.......swimmingly.......probably have one more ring if he had stayed.....


but swimmingly

 

[patfanken]

THIS is the post you should have written in the first place, instead of a smarmy remark.....but I dgress

The franchise tag is inherently unfair to the individual player. That's the whole point of the franchise tag, which is designed to put an artificial brake on the salaries of top players while keeping them from changing teams.

It is NOT inherently unfair to offer to pay a man full value (the average of the top 5 salaries of a player in his position) for a year of his service. While it might not be the best deal a player can get, it certainly isn't akin to him being screwed. As Wes himself so eloquently said (paraphrase) "I can't hate that they will pay me 50% of what it took me 5 years to make, for one"

The Patriots reportedly offered 2 years, $16 million.

I never heard that, but its in the ball park. I think $18 for 2 with a $10MM signing bonus and the rest guaranteed except for injury, is about right. But I think Wes want it longer and a bit more money

His ability to sit out and not sign the deal is clearly leverage.

Not to the Pats. Has it ever worked before. It got Branch moved out of town. It cost Mankins a year of his career and playing half a season for less than $300,000.

Again, its kind of moot until July. Him missing OTAs is meanless. BU if it turns ugly by then, I'd just let him go and try and let his agent work out a deal like we did Branch. Its not like we are WR poor like we were in 2006

At 9 this year and over 10 next year (franchise tag values), why would he want to sign a 3 year deal for 20 (actually around 20.7 as I recall)? Barring injury, he's essentially got either 20 guaranteed for 2 years or 9 guaranteed for one with complete and untagged free agency following that.

Personally I have no problems paying Welker 20MM over the next 2 years, its paying him significant money beyond that time that concerns me....and the Pats. OTOH I'd do a 3 year deal for $20MM that has incentives in the 2nd and 3rd years that could raise it 30MM if his production remains similar to the average of his first 5 years. Is that fair enough for you

True, but the only people making the "overpay" argument are those who want Welker to be underpaid.

That remark is both gratuitous and untrue. It is a simple recognition that skills eventually erode. And teams that overpay older players for PAST results cost their teams in the future. The Pats have done a great job of NOT doing that.

I'd be willing to pay Welker over $10MM/yr for every year he has over 90 receptions and 1000 yds, but I do not want to pay him that kind of money when his product slides below that due to an erosion of skills or the injuries that crop up more as a player gets older. ESPECIALLY one of Welker's stature. A contract that recognizes that reality can have any numbers you want for the press

Welker caught 122 this past season, with Gronk setting TE records and getting 90 catches, and Hernandez grabbing 79 receptions. They may not be maxed out, but they're likely close, and they could both see fewer, rather than more, catches moving forward. Any likely cut into Welker's numbers would likely come from Lloyd getting more than the 51 catches that Branch had. So, unless the thought is that Lloyd is going to be putting up significantly more than 71 catches year in and year out, there are still going to be 100 catches, give or take, there for Welker.

Why do you think an improving Gronk and Hernandez would be capped in their receptions? Neither have even reached their primes.

You are correct with LLoyd who is going to get more looks from Brady than Branch got, and I figure the Pats are going to run the ball about 5-10 times more a game. Plus last season Brady threw for the 2nd most yds in NFL history. Its unlikely he'll equal that number this year 4800 yds is a more reasonable expectation.

The point being that Welker had a career year in 2011. Its not fair to expect the same results this year, just as it would be unfair to expect Brady to be close to 50 TDs just because he did it before. So for all those reasons, its reasonable to expect Welker's production to be less than the 122 catches he had last season.

Any more significant cuts into Welker's reception totals are more likely to come from a better WR4 option and from the RB reception numbers than from Gronk/Hernandez/Lloyd.

I don't entirely agree, but they are good points as well. In fact I wish Brady had used his RBs more last season