NFL investigating Saints for placing bounties on players(merged X2)

[The Gr8est]

It took a car ride home while listening to a Jax station with a known "Pats fan" agreeing with a caller that taping walkthroughs was worse than Bountygate. That's the problem. Every Pats fan knows our side. It's the ones that need the broadcast money that keep fueling spygate. We have no leg. No help. Nothing.

The Saints battle will become our battle once again. Because it will be ignored. And that is why I will remain angry that neither Bill or Robert spoke honestly about the league-wide effect spygate had when it all came out. If I can say one thing about the NFL now, class is a forgotten concept.

Would have been nice if someone could have called and asked them if taping walk-throughs is so bad, then why did the Denver Broncos get off so lightly?

I don't know why they want to discuss taping walk-throughs when discussing the Pats though, since it's never been shown that they did.

 

[jcdavey]

Of those comparing the two events, many fans who dislike the Pats play the 'NFL covered up; therefore it must have been bad' line in their logic.

Looks like those on the other side of the fence have a counter-argument now.

NFL Network pulls plug on Vikings-Saints replay | ProFootballTalk

A replay of the 2009 Vikings-Saints NFC title game had been set for Monday at 3:00 p.m. ET on NFL Network. And NFL Network yanked it.

Let’s repeat that. NFLN yanked the game.

Correct or not, it creates the impression that the league has some concern about showing the game again. Which creates the impression that the league should be concerned.

And that creates the impression that the league fears the outcome of Super Bowl XLIV has been tainted, because it creates the impression that the league perhaps thinks that the Saints won a berth in the game via improper methods.​

i see it as pulling a game that has come under huge recent scrutiny and is now a black eye for the nfl

i don't think they're covering anything up , it's just shameful now

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

i see it as pulling a game that has come under huge recent scrutiny and is now a black eye for the nfl

i don't think they're covering anything up , it's just shameful now

Does NFLN ever rebroadcast the worst game ever, the Steelers SB win over the Seahags? Worst. Officiating. Evah.

 

[jcdavey]

Does NFLN ever rebroadcast the worst game ever, the Steelers SB win over the Seahags? Worst. Officiating. Evah.

i would hope they don't

or that meaningless sd at denver hochuli game

or even the pats at denver playoff game

they should never rebroadcast games so horribly reffed

 

[NJPatsfan26]

Of those comparing the two events, many fans who dislike the Pats play the 'NFL covered up; therefore it must have been bad' line in their logic.

Looks like those on the other side of the fence have a counter-argument now.

NFL Network pulls plug on Vikings-Saints replay | ProFootballTalk

A replay of the 2009 Vikings-Saints NFC title game had been set for Monday at 3:00 p.m. ET on NFL Network. And NFL Network yanked it.

Let’s repeat that. NFLN yanked the game.

Correct or not, it creates the impression that the league has some concern about showing the game again. Which creates the impression that the league should be concerned.

And that creates the impression that the league fears the outcome of Super Bowl XLIV has been tainted, because it creates the impression that the league perhaps thinks that the Saints won a berth in the game via improper methods.​

Lets then put a giant * next to their season!!

 

[Hardboiled]

I have a funny feeling after Williams mia culpa a few days ago. It seemed staged and my first thought was he was instructed to do that and it will be contrasted to BB's post spygate lack of apology (according to Goodell). Like the rest of you, I'll be interested to see the punishment.

 

[jmt57]

It took a car ride home while listening to a Jax station with a known "Pats fan" agreeing with a caller that taping walkthroughs was worse than Bountygate. That's the problem. Every Pats fan knows our side. It's the ones that need the broadcast money that keep fueling spygate. We have no leg. No help. Nothing.

The Saints battle will become our battle once again. Because it will be ignored. And that is why I will remain angry that neither Bill or Robert spoke honestly about the league-wide effect spygate had when it all came out. If I can say one thing about the NFL now, class is a forgotten concept.

Of all the various inaccuracies regarding ***gate, that may perhaps be the most frustrating one, and also one that best exemplifies how much misinformation there is in the minds of the public. The 'they were caught filming practices' line is believed to be an actual fact by a huge percentage of not just fans, but even members of the media. For example, I recall a senior sportswriter a year or two ago using that very same line in an article for for either the Washington Post or Washington Times. Even after repeated comments and emails with links and other references to prove the mistake he made, he still refused to admit that he was wrong or edit the article, adamantly maintaining that his statement was correct.

 

[jcdavey]

i'll be dissapointed if the saints aren't fined 1 mill, stripped of some first round draft pick (2013) and at least one pick this upcoming draft, and player suspensions and williams lifetime nfl ban. also i feel the saints owner should fire his GM at the least....i mean now everyone in the sports world knows his employee lied to him......


i could see him firing payton too

 

[MoLewisrocks]

No, the latest is Benson is supporting Loomis and Payton 110%... I think the bs about him ordering Loomis to end the program was just that. I think he's old school NO thru and thru and they all just figured they caught a pass when the original informant changed his tune and the evidence didn't exist to persue the matter. Heck, now idiots like Sharper are talking about snitches and that they know who told and it will come out... Florio has a point, the NFL Network better talk to their employees. It's really pathetic how so many former players are trying to rationalize how this is nothing and is being blown all out of proportion. Same guys crying about their post career health benefits... Same guys who pushed for less OTA's and padded practices are now rationalizing that this is all part of the fabric of the game. Hypocritical morons...

 

[jmt57]

i'll be dissapointed if the saints aren't fined 1 mill, stripped of some first round draft pick (2013) and at least one pick this upcoming draft, and player suspensions and williams lifetime nfl ban. also i feel the saints owner should fire his GM at the least....i mean now everyone in the sports world knows his employee lied to him......


i could see him firing payton too

Interesting that supposedly Benson is saying he is backing Loomis and Payton "110%", though since the quote comes only from "a team official" that is "on condition of anonymity because the investigation was still ongoing", that doesn't really say anything at all.

AP source: Saints owner backing GM, head coach | nola.com

 

[NJPatsfan26]

Interesting that supposedly Benson is saying he is backing Loomis and Payton "110%", though since the quote comes only from "a team official" that is "on condition of anonymity because the investigation was still ongoing", that doesn't really say anything at all.

AP source: Saints owner backing GM, head coach | nola.com

So then they condone this type of behavior ? Going after someones career for a cash prize? Really??

 

[Patriot Missile]

So then they condone this type of behavior ? Going after someones career for a cash prize? Really??

Don't blow this up any more than it needs to be. You sound like Felger.

It basically means they are in this together and he will stand by his staff in the aftermath of the events that have transpired.

 

[NJPatsfan26]

Don't blow this up any more than it needs to be. You sound like Felger.

It basically means they are in this together and he will stand by his staff in the aftermath of the events that have transpired.

I understand team unity and all but this kinda goes beyond that.

What do you think a fair punishment would be then?

 

[Jackson 2]

Of all the various inaccuracies regarding ***gate, that may perhaps be the most frustrating one, and also one that best exemplifies how much misinformation there is in the minds of the public. The 'they were caught filming practices' line is believed to be an actual fact by a huge percentage of not just fans, but even members of the media. For example, I recall a senior sportswriter a year or two ago using that very same line in an article for for either the Washington Post or Washington Times. Even after repeated comments and emails with links and other references to prove the mistake he made, he still refused to admit that he was wrong or edit the article, adamantly maintaining that his statement was correct.

You're correct. Just before the SB, I heard Francessa on WFAN theorizing that Mike Martz might hold a grudge against BB and the Pats because the Pats video-taped the Rams pre-SB walk-through. And just this past Friday, I heard Mut and Merloni on WEEI offer the opinion that the Rams were particularly victimized by the Pats' taping program. In speaking with fans from other parts of the country about the taping scandal, often they mention NE's taping of other teams' practices as an accepted fact.

 

[Patriot Missile]

I understand team unity and all but this kinda goes beyond that.

What do you think a fair punishment would be then?

What I think is fair is irrelevant. The punishment will be handed out whether I agree with it or not. To be honest I don't think players maliciously try to hurt each other for some bounty although the Kurt Warner interception hit was quite excessive.

I think this will be the example of examples and the team will forfeit this years 2nd and next years 1st as well as suspensions and fines as others have mentioned.

This was blown way out of proportion just like 07. But of course just like in 07 the Saints were aware and regardless of how petty it is, it has become public knowledge and a pr disaster for the NFL and a example will be set. Both teams weren't the only teams doing it but both teams will be the example that the NFL isn't $%^&ing around with integrity or safety.Although it all comes down to money and the NFL protecting itself and it's billions. To be honest the NFL is more afraid of the lawsuits then the players who may have been possibly hurt by this.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

You're correct. Just before the SB, I heard Francessa on WFAN theorizing that Mike Martz might hold a grudge against BB and the Pats because the Pats video-taped the Rams pre-SB walk-through. And just this past Friday, I heard Mut and Merloni on WEEI offer the opinion that the Rams were particularly victimized by the Pats' taping program. In speaking with fans from other parts of the country about the taping scandal, often they mention NE's taping of other teams' practices as an accepted fact.

This complete distortion of a modern (internet era) event should serve to illustrate how badly we understand what really happened in past events.

And also, how strongly people cling to a demonstrably wrong viewpoint even after they are presented with facts that discredit it.

And lastly how utterly ignorant of their subject matter media authorities really are.

Pathetic.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

What I think is fair is irrelevant. The punishment will be handed out whether I agree with it or not. To be honest I don't think players maliciously try to hurt each other for some bounty although the Kurt Warner interception hit was quite excessive.

I think this will be the example of examples and the team will forfeit this years 2nd and next years 1st as well as suspensions and fines as others have mentioned.

This was blown way out of proportion just like 07. But of course just like in 07 the Saints were aware and regardless of how petty it is, it has become public knowledge and a pr disaster for the NFL and a example will be set. Both teams weren't the only teams doing it but both teams will be the example that the NFL isn't $%^&ing around with integrity or safety.Although it all comes down to money and the NFL protecting itself and it's billions. To be honest the NFL is more afraid of the lawsuits then the players who may have been possibly hurt by this.

This is not being blown way out of proportion just like 07. As far as we know this is the only team since Buddy Ryan left the league who has had a pay for play bounty system run by the DC and contributed to by coaches and sleezy outsiders. And documentation of players and others posting bounties up to $10K on specific players being carted off the field.

Everyone has some form of the pay for play violation going on, but it's comparative peanuts and it's player run and it encourages solid play and isn't at least directly an incentive to injure someone who is trying to earn his living too. They all need to knock it off, and maybe this will be the time they do and no better example of why you don't continue it than Greg Williams perversion of it in his tenure with NO. The irony of your last contention is it's the same players who are protesting any punishment for this violation who will be suing the NFL for not adequately providing for and insuring their long term health and safety...

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Furthermore to this, the NFL Constitution and Bylaws is available online at
http://static.nfl.com/static/content//public/static/html/careers/pdf/co_.pdf

Under Section 9.1 C, article 14, it states which information gathering equipment can and can't be used during the playing of the game.
Ray Anderson's memo was meant to clarify the location of videotaping devices, because the rulebook only states that devices that might aid the team during the playing of the game are prohibited.

On a completely random note, I find it highly amusing that Article 13, just before this, says:

"No member, nor any stockholder, director, officer, partner, or employee [of the NFL], or person holding an interest therein, nor any officer or employee of the League shall . . .

Dispense beer or other beverage in NFL stadia except by pouring into cups."

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Everyone has some form of the pay for play violation going on, but it's comparative peanuts and it's player run and it encourages solid play and isn't at least directly an incentive to injure someone who is trying to earn his living too.

FWIW, it's not clear to me, based on the By-laws, that something like a "First interception of the season pool," funded solely by players, would be a violation of the rules. As near as I can tell, the Saints are in hot water for four reasons:

(1) At least one coach (Williams) was involved in administering the bounties.
(2) Outsiders apparently pledged/actually contributed money, creating salary cap violations.
(3) The program awarded money for injuring players (a specific violation of the memo sent to all players and teams).
(4) People with responsibility lied to Goodell.

Thought experiment: Let's assume that instead of what actually happened, the story that broke was that in 2009, the entire Saints defense had been pooling money to award $1,000 for each TO that season. No coaches or outsiders were involved, and no money awarded for injuries. I think the players might have been fined $5,000-$10,000 each, and that would have been the last we'd hear of it.

 

[Steve102]

Am I in the minority when I say we, as fans, probably don't want the curtain peeled back to far on this? I don't feel this is an isolated incident, but merely another team dumb enough to get caught.

I think there's a great deal about the NFL (PED's, bounties, tampering, surveillance) that we don't want to know and are happy to be ignorant of. I question how much of the game Goodell really wants to clean up. I think when it makes the league look bad in the court of public opinion, they react.