Antonio Cromartie agrees that Moss slacked off against Jets

[stavros27]

So Moss actually intentionally ran slower against the Jets and didn't try to catch anything despite all their trashtalk from last year from Revis, so he could bring the Patriots down? Yet suddenly last week when the Pats avoided using him on pass plays he decided to play hard each play knowing he wasn't getting the ball? How does that make any sense?

 

[emoney_33]

So Moss actually intentionally ran slower against the Jets and didn't try to catch anything despite all their trashtalk from last year from Revis, so he could bring the Patriots down? Yet suddenly last week when the Pats avoided using him on pass plays he decided to play hard each play knowing he wasn't getting the ball? How does that make any sense?

It doesn't, it never has and never will. Some people just do not like Moss and they will look for any possible way to talk negatively about him.

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

Watch the plays. Rather than blindly defending Moss, watch the plays. I did, the day after the game. Before studying the plays, I blamed Brady, afterward it was clear the fault belonged to Moss.

I watched the plays over and over and over. Cromartie is FAST, he had position and was with Moss from the SNAP on the first INT. Moss motioned to the slot behind Welker and ran off to the sideline but Cromartie was never, not for a second out of position. If you want to say this offense is NOT dependent on route adjustment then so be it, because you are basically arguing that Moss should have run straight down the sideline and blown past a guy who had position on him. Cromartie turned his hips almost immediately and was running in FRONT of Moss, I don't know if Moss was supposed to just throw him away or what, but that is at BEST on both Brady and Moss. Sure we can take the lazy media way out and say "Oh it was overthrown because Moss slowed down and didn't try". It's just too easy to dog the guy that doesn't defend himself.

The 2nd one, this one is even debatable it was 100% a terrible throw by Brady that Moss almost made an acrobatic highlight reel play on. Sure it hit his hand, but I'm not going to blame the guy for coming CLOSE to saving Brady's arse just because it touched his hand. And of course on the 1st INT Welker cut his route short but not a single person in the universe is accusing Welker of QUITTING or DOGGING it on that play. If Moss did the EXACT same thing that is ALL you would hear. The anti-Moss bias is BLATANTLY obvious to anyone who looks at things objectively.

And before someone accuses me again of having a bias for Moss, I've already said he screwed up. He should have caught the pass in the endzone, he should have caught the one over the middle, he screwed up a block and he got alligator arms. All valid criticisms.

I also watched the play where Moss played DB and knocked down a pass DIRECTLY to Cromartie but not a single person in the "Moss dogs it" crowd even ACKNOWLEDGES that play which was a sure INT that Moss and Moss ALONE broke up.

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

Then you just havent been watching.
In fact, he PURPOSELY loafs at times to play possum with the defender. Thats been Moss' unique ability, that he can kick it into gear when the ball comes his way and he lulls the DB to sleep by not running 100% when the ball isnt coming his way. Problem is this year he gave up giving 100% when the ball did come his way. Watch the Jets 2nd half. Hard to watch anything after that because Brady lost trust in him and barely threw him the ball after that.
Its all pretty clear if you try to be objective.

There's a difference between loafing and strategically tricking your opponent. Welker does not 100% full speed prior to his separation cut, that is not LOAFING it's strategy. I will concede that there MAY be times that Moss isn't running his fastest and a play comes his way unexpectedly. This may even be the case on the 1st INT in the Jets game, but there's no way to definitively tell when he's doing that. He literally looks exactly the same when he's running 100% vs. 85% speed. That's why it works so well, the DB is caught completely off guard.

PS: Do you think that any WR in the NFL runs 100% full speed on every snap playing almost every offensive snap?

 

[Yfz01]

Exactly every receiver ha dominated him this year except Moss am I to believe that Houshmanzadeh, Marshall, Welker, T.O., Hernandez are all faster than Moss because all have beaten him on straight Go routes. Which gives credence to what Cromartie is saying.

Hernandez never beat him on a go route. Terrell Owens hasn't played against Cromartie yet this season, don't know where you are getting that from. Houshmanzadeh did absolutely nothing in that game (one catch). Welker didn't beat him on a go route. Marshall & Anquan Boldin are the only ones you could argue.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

I watched the plays over and over and over. Cromartie is FAST, he had position and was with Moss from the SNAP on the first INT.

Just not true. Moss was within a step of Cromartie while Cromartie was turning his hips at the time Brady made the decision. It an insult to Randy Moss to say he went 100% and Cromartie could go from unturned hips to to turn and run and beat him by 3 steps.
Watch the TD then that route, you will see an entriely different speed from Moss.

Moss motioned to the slot behind Welker and ran off to the sideline but Cromartie was never, not for a second out of position. If you want to say this offense is NOT dependent on route adjustment then so be it, because you are basically arguing that Moss should have run straight down the sideline and blown past a guy who had position on him. Cromartie turned his hips almost immediately and was running in FRONT of Moss, I don't know if Moss was supposed to just throw him away or what, but that is at BEST on both Brady and Moss. Sure we can take the lazy media way out and say "Oh it was overthrown because Moss slowed down and didn't try". It's just too easy to dog the guy that doesn't defend himself.

I'm not taking any easy way or dogging anyone. I said this the day after the game, and in fact even gave Moss a pass that he may not have been expecting the ball, and recognizing he does play possum. None of that changes the fact that Brady threw the ball to where Moss should have been if he went all out, and he was 3 steps short of it.

The 2nd one, this one is even debatable it was 100% a terrible throw by Brady that Moss almost made an acrobatic highlight reel play on.

If he tried to use 2 hands its a catch. It oly looks acrobatic because he didnt attempt to get his other hand into it.

it hit his hand, but I'm not going to blame the guy for coming CLOSE to saving Brady's arse just because it touched his hand. And of course on the 1st INT Welker cut his route short but not a single person in the universe is accusing Welker of QUITTING or DOGGING it on that play.

I'm not accusing anyone of anything, I'm stating the facts of what happens. It appears you are too emotionally attached to Moss to evaluate what he did. Yes, Welker stopped short on that route. If he wasnt described by everyone as the best effort guy on the field, and had a storied history like Moss of taking plays off, and has his HC give up on him, I'd wonder about his effort too.

If Moss did the EXACT same thing that is ALL you would hear. The anti-Moss bias is BLATANTLY obvious to anyone who looks at things objectively.

See above.

And before someone accuses me again of having a bias for Moss, I've already said he screwed up. He should have caught the pass in the endzone, he should have caught the one over the middle, he screwed up a block and he got alligator arms. All valid criticisms.

I also watched the play where Moss played DB and knocked down a pass DIRECTLY to Cromartie but not a single person in the "Moss dogs it" crowd even ACKNOWLEDGES that play which was a sure INT that Moss and Moss ALONE broke up.

I have never been a Moss dogs it guy. I have pobably never criticized Moss before that game. I dont care what he did on all the other plays, he did not give 100% on those 2. That is the discussion, and an honest answer is he didnt.
I can accept that he wasn't prepared for the ball on the first one. I can accept that he doesnt use the extra gear until he needs it, and didnt think he needed it there. But to say he shouldnt have beaten Cronartie to that ball from the position they were in when the throw went up is simply completely flat out wrong.
And the 2nd Int was a completely catchable back shoulder throw that he treid to get cute on and one hand for the highlight reel.
That doesnt make him a loser, but it made him responsible for that devastating Int.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

There's a difference between loafing and strategically tricking your opponent. Welker does not 100% full speed prior to his separation cut, that is not LOAFING it's strategy. I will concede that there MAY be times that Moss isn't running his fastest and a play comes his way unexpectedly. This may even be the case on the 1st INT in the Jets game, but there's no way to definitively tell when he's doing that. He literally looks exactly the same when he's running 100% vs. 85% speed. That's why it works so well, the DB is caught completely off guard.

PS: Do you think that any WR in the NFL runs 100% full speed on every snap playing almost every offensive snap?

If there wasnt a question of effort why did Bill Belichick banish Moss from the team?
His coach gave up on him. Are you seriously going to tell me he would give up on a Moss giving it his all? Or that a 90-some pick has any value close to a committed Moss? Thats just ludicrous.
Moss is no idiot. He wanted an extension, wasnt going to get it, so acted like the Raider Randy to get his ticket out of town.
I dont care if he breaks hiTD record in Minn, he was not going to help this team this year, apparently out of spite.
If he gave full effort in the Jets game, why did Brady pretty much ignore him ever since then because he doesnt trust him.

 

[Patspsycho]

Yet suddenly last week when the Pats avoided using him on pass plays he decided to play hard each play knowing he wasn't getting the ball? How does that make any sense?

Couldn't be further from the truth.

 

[Ilikehappyppl]

Here is something of relevance. You are exactly like a big percentage of Jets fan, its why we laugh at them so much. They are haters who don't know their arse from their elbow. They don't ever respect what a player has done in his career. Hell they don't even respect players that had record breaking seasons with them when they move to another team.

You see thats what you just did in your previous post. Learn to have a bit of respect for great players unless they are Jets of course then its ok.

There are too many of these haters today, they were spoiled rotten by the run of Superbowls and the unbeaten regular season. They never had to sit in a freezing cold Foxboro Stadium just hoping their team didn't get embarrassed.

I'm not a R.Moss fan dude, I'm a Pat's fan!

I have a question for you? How many SB's did we win with Randy??? Oh that right 0 how about playoff wins? what 3??? lmfao in just one year!

I have respect for ppl that deserve it twit, respect is earned not given....

I've been a Pat's fan since 1988 bud, sry too burst your bubble. I know you think you know things but you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground.

This is why I can't stand Boston but love this team! Some fans here are out of there mind when it comes to certain topics, its sad really.

 

[stavros27]

Couldn't be further from the truth.

...explain please?

 

[LuthierJr]

Who give flying **** what Cro-magnun-martie thinks or says. What did he come up for air in between impregnating the trashy half of America to spew forth this pearl?

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

Just not true. Moss was within a step of Cromartie while Cromartie was turning his hips at the time Brady made the decision. It an insult to Randy Moss to say he went 100% and Cromartie could go from unturned hips to to turn and run and beat him by 3 steps.
Watch the TD then that route, you will see an entriely different speed from Moss.

Do you have a link that shows Cromartie TURNING his hips as the ball is thrown. Everyone replay I've watched shows Cromartie turning and running a step ahead of Moss the entire time. Moss was a step behind when the ball was thrown. Once again, if you KNOW this offense is based on reading coverage and route adjustment why would you expect Moss to run through a guy who has position on him.

I'm not taking any easy way or dogging anyone. I said this the day after the game, and in fact even gave Moss a pass that he may not have been expecting the ball, and recognizing he does play possum. None of that changes the fact that Brady threw the ball to where Moss should have been if he went all out, and he was 3 steps short of it.

Of course you are taking the easy way out. You continue to demand that Brady's throw was PERFECT while Moss just stopped trying. It's not the case and your analysis is a lazy simplification of the offense.

If he tried to use 2 hands its a catch. It oly looks acrobatic because he didnt attempt to get his other hand into it.

You are 100% wrong, he played Cromartie using his momentum and stopping guiding him to stumble to the side while leaping for a poorly thrown inside ball. You can nitpick all you want, but that is 100% a terrible throw by Brady. The fact that you are even trying to put that one on Moss just proves that you have some sort of bias watching that play.

I'm not accusing anyone of anything, I'm stating the facts of what happens. It appears you are too emotionally attached to Moss to evaluate what he did.

Right I'm "emotionally" attached to a friggin entertainment figure. I'm grounded in real life, sports is entertainment, I call it like I see it. You certainly are NOT stating facts. Stop pretending to have superhuman ability to determine effort, and decision making process based on TV feed. The 2nd INT was and will always be a terrible throw by Brady, it's really not debatable.

Yes, Welker stopped short on that route. If he wasnt described by everyone as the best effort guy on the field, and had a storied history like Moss of taking plays off, and has his HC give up on him, I'd wonder about his effort too.

Thank you for admitting to your bias.

I have never been a Moss dogs it guy. I have pobably never criticized Moss before that game. I dont care what he did on all the other plays, he did not give 100% on those 2. That is the discussion, and an honest answer is he didnt.

I disagree but the anti-Moss bias will never leave.

I can accept that he wasn't prepared for the ball on the first one. I can accept that he doesnt use the extra gear until he needs it, and didnt think he needed it there. But to say he shouldnt have beaten Cronartie to that ball from the position they were in when the throw went up is simply completely flat out wrong.

No it isn't flat out wrong at all. Once again, if you leave room for READING coverage then you leave room for Moss doing the RIGHT thing in his mind. Just like Welker did the RIGHT thing in his mind when he sat in the wrong place. Not saying Moss definitely played it right or that it was impossible for him to beat Cromartie. What I am saying is that the play is more likely to be a case of Brady and Moss just reading things differently, an innocent mishap that happens to Brady and every receiver he's ever played with and will continue to from time to time. Moss however is the ONLY one that is ever accused of GIVING UP on plays like that. It's lazy.

And the 2nd Int was a completely catchable back shoulder throw that he treid to get cute on and one hand for the highlight reel.
That doesnt make him a loser, but it made him responsible for that devastating Int.

Now I know for a fact you have not re-watched it, at least not recently. It was thrown inside and Moss had to use his talent to get in a position to even make a play on the ball. If that ball is thrown to the outside shoulder, since Cromartie is on the inside, that is a likely completion and highly unlikely to be an INT.

Keep ignoring the broken up sure INT terrible throw in your quest to absolve Brady of all imperfections.

If there wasnt a question of effort why did Bill Belichick banish Moss from the team?
His coach gave up on him. Are you seriously going to tell me he would give up on a Moss giving it his all? Or that a 90-some pick has any value close to a committed Moss? Thats just ludicrous.
Moss is no idiot. He wanted an extension, wasnt going to get it, so acted like the Raider Randy to get his ticket out of town.
I dont care if he breaks hiTD record in Minn, he was not going to help this team this year, apparently out of spite.
If he gave full effort in the Jets game, why did Brady pretty much ignore him ever since then because he doesnt trust him.

How can you expect to have any discussion whatsoever when you continue to believe you have any idea of what goes on behind the scenes?

The offense is clearly changing to ball control and away from quick strikes. Moss' greatest abilities are for quick strikes. A 3rd round pick is not dirt, he clearly had conversations in private with BB voicing his displeasure of his uncertain future, BB clearly has a mutual respect with Moss, Moss' value to the team is clearly not what it what is in past years, and I'm sure there are many more factors we will NEVER know.

When BB says it was a difficult decision and a COMBINATION of factors led to the decision, along with his high respect for Moss, his happiness to have had a chance to COACH HIM, he's not LYING. He's not dancing around some hidden effort malcontent issue.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

Do you have a link that shows Cromartie TURNING his hips as the ball is thrown. Everyone replay I've watched shows Cromartie turning and running a step ahead of Moss the entire time. Moss was a step behind when the ball was thrown.

Watch the game film. Moss is actually out of the picture when the ball goes in the air, but when Brady starts the throwing motion Moss is about even with Cromartie, and Cromartie is still turning his hips. There is no way in the world any player in the league can overcome that disadvantage to beat Randy Moss to the ball by 3 steps if Moss is going 100%

Once again, if you KNOW this offense is based on reading coverage and route adjustment why would you expect Moss to run through a guy who has position on him.

What? Moss' route was to go deep. Are you telling me that because the db is about even with him while turning his hips AT THE 35 YARD LINE that Moss should give up and not run hard?

Of course you are taking the easy way out. You continue to demand that Brady's throw was PERFECT while Moss just stopped trying. It's not the case and your analysis is a lazy simplification of the offense.

Where did I say Brady's throw was perfect? Or even good?
I correctly stated that Moss did not go 100%. That really isn't disputable. If you want to say he didnt expect the ball so didn't go hard, I could accept that as I qualified my analysis with that possibility the day after the game
But to say Moss went all out on that is the real lazy simplificaiton.

You are 100% wrong, he played Cromartie using his momentum and stopping guiding him to stumble to the side while leaping for a poorly thrown inside ball. You can nitpick all you want, but that is 100% a terrible throw by Brady. The fact that you are even trying to put that one on Moss just proves that you have some sort of bias watching that play.

It was a back shoulder throw. Cromartie wasnt even a factor in the play until Moss tried to one hand it and tipped it. Cromartie ran past the point of the throw. Moss could easily have gotten 2 hands on the ball and didn't.
You really should go back and watch the play.

Right I'm "emotionally" attached to a friggin entertainment figure. I'm grounded in real life, sports is entertainment, I call it like I see it. You certainly are NOT stating facts. Stop pretending to have superhuman ability to determine effort, and decision making process based on TV feed.

Its not hard to see whether or not a player gives full effort when they make a lame one handed effort when they should use 2 hands, that is taught in pee wee football.
Show me other times when a db gained ground on Moss while turning their hips and I will reconsider, but I dont think you will find it.

The 2nd INT was and will always be a terrible throw by Brady, it's really not debatable.

It was a back shoulder throw. Go back and look at it. The defender had no shot at it, until Moss f-ed up the catch. Back shoulder throws look like underthrows unless you know what you are looking at.

Thank you for admitting to your bias.

No bias at all here, just a recognition of the facts. Are you saying Welker dogs it? Please tell me that you think Moss gives more effort on the field than Welker.

I disagree but the anti-Moss bias will never leave.

I have no AntiMoss bias. I am anti what he has done this year, which is abandon his team. I have been proMoss for the rest of his time here. When the player changes his level of effort and my opinion of him changes that is not a bias.

No it isn't flat out wrong at all. Once again, if you leave room for READING coverage then you leave room for Moss doing the RIGHT thing in his mind.

He ran a deep route. He just didnt run it with full effort. Are you saying go deep but run slower than you could is a valid sight adustment?

Just like Welker did the RIGHT thing in his mind when he sat in the wrong place. Not saying Moss definitely played it right or that it was impossible for him to beat Cromartie. What I am saying is that the play is more likely to be a case of Brady and Moss just reading things differently, an innocent mishap that happens to Brady and every receiver he's ever played with and will continue to from time to time. Moss however is the ONLY one that is ever accused of GIVING UP on plays like that. It's lazy.

How is it a miscommunication that Brady threw a deep ball, and Moss ran a deep route, but Moss did not run at top speed? They saw the same thing, they both expected the same route. Moss either didnt care or didnt think he would get the ball so he ran it slow.
The only possible miscommunication is that Brady expected Moss to go all out and Moss decided to loaf. Again, in a vaccum, I can understand loafing on a deep route to set up another play. But given that he had position and would have outrun Cromartie if he tried to and the fact that Belichick just essentially gave him away, its hard to believe this was an exception.



[quoe]Now I know for a fact you have not re-watched it, at least not recently. It was thrown inside and Moss had to use his talent to get in a position to even make a play on the ball.

I havent only watched it, I studied it. Use his talent? He STOPPED. 95% of the WRs in the NFL make that. 5% try to get cute and 1 hand it.

{quote] If that ball is thrown to the outside shoulder, since Cromartie is on the inside, that is a likely completion and highly unlikely to be an INT.

Cromartie overran the play. He wasnt even a factor until the ball was tipped.

Keep ignoring the broken up sure INT terrible throw in your quest to absolve Brady of all imperfections.

I'm not absolving Bradyof anything, I am talking about Moss.
So what, if Brady made a bad throw that day, it disproves Moss was loafing on 2 critical ones?

How can you expect to have any discussion whatsoever when you continue to believe you have any idea of what goes on behind the scenes?

Isnt it obvious?
What reason other than Moss' effort and attiude could you possibly think would lead to trading him for nothing?

The offense is clearly changing to ball control and away from quick strikes. Moss' greatest abilities are for quick strikes.

Its changing because Moss gve up on the team.
Are you truly saying Moss is useless to the offense and it is better throwing to Brandon Tate, Julian Edelman and Taylor Price.
Come on.

A 3rd round pick is not dirt,

It is compared to randy Moss of 2007-2009

he clearly had conversations in private with BB voicing his displeasure of his uncertain future,

So

BB clearly has a mutual respect with Moss, Moss' value to the team is clearly not what it what is in past years, and I'm sure there are many more factors we will NEVER know.

His value is less only because he wouldnt give 100%.
Or are you saying BB decided that he should make his team worse so Randy could be happy, you know, out of respect.
If keeping Moss happy is more important than winning, why not just give him a new contract?

When BB says it was a difficult decision and a COMBINATION of factors led to the decision, along with his high respect for Moss, his happiness to have had a chance to COACH HIM, he's not LYING. He's not dancing around some hidden effort malcontent issue.

BB is never going to talk about internal things.
Moss was becoming a cancer who was tanking it on the field.
If no one made an offer he was going to be cut.
The only other explanations are:
BB all of a sudden decided his best WR is no longer needed
BB all of a sudden lost his mind
BB put Randy Moss' being happy ahead of the Patriots winning.
Randy Moss has lost his skills.
None of those are close to reasonable.

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

Watch the game film. Moss is actually out of the picture when the ball goes in the air, but when Brady starts the throwing motion Moss is about even with Cromartie, and Cromartie is still turning his hips. There is no way in the world any player in the league can overcome that disadvantage to beat Randy Moss to the ball by 3 steps if Moss is going 100%

Yeah that's the game film I've watched countless times, Cromartie turns his hips right away and is in position from the get go, always a step ahead in the TV feed. No clue what on earth you are watching.

Cromartie overran the play. He wasnt even a factor until the ball was tipped.

You definitely need to watch it again because you'd see Cromartie stumbling BECAUSE of how Moss played him and then stopped while using Cromartie's momentum to shift him out of the way. Honestly, based on your comments of the plays I'm not sure you've rewatched them for 2 weeks.

I'm not absolving Bradyof anything, I am talking about Moss.
So what, if Brady made a bad throw that day, it disproves Moss was loafing on 2 critical ones?

You're accusing Moss of quitting because you assume Brady made perfect decisions on throws, and you never care to even acknowledge Moss breaking up a sure INT on a terrible throw. It's quite funny.

Isnt it obvious?
What reason other than Moss' effort and attiude could you possibly think would lead to trading him for nothing?

Asking this question over and over and over isn't going to make it any less foolish. 3rd round picks are definitely not "nothing" btw.

Its changing because Moss gve up on the team.
Are you truly saying Moss is useless to the offense and it is better throwing to Brandon Tate, Julian Edelman and Taylor Price.
Come on.

When did I say it was useless? It's been changing since week 1, why on earth would BB play Moss 4 games almost every snap if he was "quitting". Fact is he wasn't, but you have an anti-Moss bias and use his media-driven PAST as proof of your present accusations.

It is compared to randy Moss of 2007-2009

Yes let's ignore all other context

His value is less only because he wouldnt give 100%.

You keep saying it but it's still not true.

Or are you saying BB decided that he should make his team worse so Randy could be happy, you know, out of respect.
If keeping Moss happy is more important than winning, why not just give him a new contract?

Never even hinted at such an argument... It is actually YOU who is claiming that keeping Moss happy was more important than winning, considering he played most snaps for 4 weeks, if he was QUITTING on the team there's no reason to play him. Any lies you want to make up for a reason to trade him would be reasons to NOT PLAY him. You don't play a guy as much as Moss played and then all of a sudden trade him if he's QUIT on the team. Again, you throw ALL logic out the window when it comes to your anti-Moss bias. You are not the only one though, it's OK.

BB is never going to talk about internal things.
Moss was becoming a cancer who was tanking it on the field.
If no one made an offer he was going to be cut.
The only other explanations are:
BB all of a sudden decided his best WR is no longer needed
BB all of a sudden lost his mind
BB put Randy Moss' being happy ahead of the Patriots winning.
Randy Moss has lost his skills.
None of those are close to reasonable.

Once again you are closed minded and decide that a 3rd rounder is equivalent to cutting him and that only YOUR reasons are valid reasons. Whatever, this is stupid arguing with people who use 0 logic to attack a guy. Just ridiculous. Yup BB is lying when he talks about Moss so highly

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

Yeah that's the game film I've watched countless times, Cromartie turns his hips right away and is in position from the get go, always a step ahead in the TV feed. No clue what on earth you are watching.



You definitely need to watch it again because you'd see Cromartie stumbling BECAUSE of how Moss played him and then stopped while using Cromartie's momentum to shift him out of the way. Honestly, based on your comments of the plays I'm not sure you've rewatched them for 2 weeks.



You're accusing Moss of quitting because you assume Brady made perfect decisions on throws, and you never care to even acknowledge Moss breaking up a sure INT on a terrible throw. It's quite funny.





Asking this question over and over and over isn't going to make it any less foolish. 3rd round picks are definitely not "nothing" btw.



When did I say it was useless? It's been changing since week 1, why on earth would BB play Moss 4 games almost every snap if he was "quitting". Fact is he wasn't, but you have an anti-Moss bias and use his media-driven PAST as proof of your present accusations.




Yes let's ignore all other context





You keep saying it but it's still not true.



Never even hinted at such an argument... It is actually YOU who is claiming that keeping Moss happy was more important than winning, considering he played most snaps for 4 weeks, if he was QUITTING on the team there's no reason to play him. Any lies you want to make up for a reason to trade him would be reasons to NOT PLAY him. You don't play a guy as much as Moss played and then all of a sudden trade him if he's QUIT on the team. Again, you throw ALL logic out the window when it comes to your anti-Moss bias. You are not the only one though, it's OK.



Once again you are closed minded and decide that a 3rd rounder is equivalent to cutting him and that only YOUR reasons are valid reasons. Whatever, this is stupid arguing with people who use 0 logic to attack a guy. Just ridiculous. Yup BB is lying when he talks about Moss so highly

It is pointless to continue because we will never agree. You see what you want to see, so how can we have a reasonable discussion.

I will just chalk it up to you conclude that Bill Belichick thinks Moss gave his all, the players who said he dogged it, and ONLY say it about him are liars, and that BB thinks a late 3rd round pick in 2011 has more value to his frnachise that a top 5 WR giving 100% effort.

 

[Yfz01]

^ Vontae Davis said Moss went hard on every play. That was in his final game as a Patriot player. Do you think he's lying?

 

[stavros27]

Really..wouldn't posting a copy of the video of the plays be the smoking gun in this silly argument?

 

[PatsFan24]

AC is a tough matchup for RM. I they are both tall, athletic, fast, and have great jumping ability. I am not surprised that RM had problems against him. Remember back to the SD AFCCG in 07, it was the same story.

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Cromartie agrees: Moss slacked off against Jets

It is pointless to continue because we will never agree. You see what you want to see, so how can we have a reasonable discussion.

I will just chalk it up to you conclude that Bill Belichick thinks Moss gave his all, the players who said he dogged it, and ONLY say it about him are liars, and that BB thinks a late 3rd round pick in 2011 has more value to his frnachise that a top 5 WR giving 100% effort.

"the players" are Revis and Cromartie of the f'ing Jets, you are delusional and you accuse Brady, BB, Faulk, Wilfork etc... of being liars while pimping up Revis and Cromartie just to try to smear Moss. Your logic in the entire situation is terrible because it is based on the idea that Moss forced a trade by playing, but playing crappy on purpose. There is 0 logic in the idea that Moss felt it was best to play but not hard to get what he wanted.

And please answer the Vontae Davis question, I suppose ONLY Revis (getting his hamstring massaged) and Cromartie are the honest people in the NFL. Bailey, Davis, all the Patriots players, BB... they all just lie.

 

[D-Money]

I love big corners.I dont know why BB doesnt like drafting them.This Vontae Davis for the dolphins is turning into a solid corner.