Belichick: 'Outburst' and plane incidents complete fabrications

[emoney_33]

Simple reply: they didn't want him near the team.

The draft choice is practically irrelevant. We're talking about the difference between a 3rd and a 5th for Moss. It's the difference between Wheatley and Wilhite.

So, he goes out and gets badly hurt, spends the rest of the season in Florida. Or, he gets traded. Either way, he's not around the team anymore.

What... the... HELL?

 

[upstater1]

I'm tempted to make a new thread about this, but Moss's situation is so impacted by next year's lockout.

The Patriots might have given him SOMETHING in the way of a contract had it not been for the lockout. This has been a league wide issue with plenty of holdouts.

We have our own in Mankins, the guy who called the owner Kraft a liar.

The lockout is simply playing with people's brains. All the intrigue surrounding the Moss trade is easy to boil down. Players are pissed at the owners. This creates a selfish attitude among players (I don't blame them for it). Some of them take this selfishness and act immaturely (Mankins and perhaps Moss).

We don't really need to get into the past or other intrigues. The owners are grouping together, and so are the players, and some of those players are getting older and are without contracts.

 

[upstater1]

What... the... HELL?

You do realize I was responding to someone talking about Randy getting hurt, right?

 

[SVN]

You think ownership made him do this?

I heard that theory yesterday and it's a valid one ... as good as any other.

In the end I think the best solution was found albeit in an uncomfortable way.

well..weei claims so..i posted the link on the forum ...donno who to believe but it seems a plausible explanation after BB's presser....if BB did really feel that randy was an issue ,he probably wouldnt have called a impromptu presser IMO

 

[PowerRunRevival]

Bill's pants are on fire.

 

[Matw]

I think the reasons for the move are simple if we just think about it for a minute:

- Moss is in a contract year and needs big numbers

- Pats don't want him beyond this season. He's 33 and his play is already starting the inevitable decline. Pats are young, have a boatload of picks next year, and feel they don't need an aging $8-10m/yr wide receiver

- the Pats are in the process of changing their offense back to the short passing game + running game featuring TE's. We all can see that the deep threat approach is too hit or miss for our team, we need to move the chains. 10-yd receptions and YAC are not Moss' strengths.

- therefore, he's not going to get the looks and numbers he wants, which could translate to a big drop in his market value (many millions)

- this puts his interests and the team's interests at odds, for the first time since he's been here. Everyone likes and respects each other, but that's the reality and it was causing a lot of tension

- thus more "incidents" in 3 months than the previous 3 years. Pats decide to pull the trigger, get some comp, avoid a deteriorating atmosphere in front of all the young kids, and free the coaches and Brady from worrying about this issue any more.

And also in fairness to Moss, send him to a place where he can get his needs met. I don't think it's by chance that the deal is with an NFC team with SB aspirations and a gunslinging QB.

And also it's the bye week, and the trading deadline's in 2 weeks.

As BB said, he's paid to make these tough decisions and he made a good judjment imo.

I agree... I could definitely see a scenario like this being behind the trade.

 

[Rob0729]

And also in fairness to Moss, send him to a place where he can get his needs met. I don't think it's by chance that the deal is with an NFC team with SB aspirations and a gunslinging QB.

It's not by chance, but not in the way you think it is. The Vikes have Super Bowl aspirations this year and their offense isn't clicking (Favre has 2 TDs and 6 INTs in three games). They went after hard on Vincent Jackson and came the closest to getting him (even reportedly had a deal done with Jackson), but San Deigo was firm in their demands. Favre always wanted to play with Moss too. Moss was their plan B (or C or D). They were the ones coming knocking and giving up the most.

Do you really think if another team like the Raiders were offering a second or first rounder, the Pats would have still traded him to the Vikes? I certainly don't. Belichick was going to ship him to the team that gave him the best compensation and the desperate Vikes were the ones offering the most.

Three teams have been desperately looking to upgrade their WRs and pursued Jackson - Washington, Seattle, and Minnesota. Washington and Seattle are probably not as desperate as the Vikes to get a WR who will make an immediate impact even if he ends up being a rent a player (since Favre isn't getting any younger). Washington and Seattle are probably holding out hopes that San Deigo gets desperate at the trade deadline, but both are in first years of new coaching regime and don't have the pressure to win now.

 

[emoney_33]

Second, it laughable to think that Moss' best interest had anything to do with this decision. Belichick doesn't work that way. Belichick always does what is best for the team and only the team.

Since you don't believe anything BB says so how do you know he only does what is best for the team?

It is quite clear that Belichick felt Moss was or was going to be a problem with the team otherwise he would be here right now. If all he was the rest of the way was a decoy, he would still be here if his attitude wasn't an issue.

No it's not quite clear, except in the people's minds who had already come to that conclusion.

As for the O'Brien thing, that alone wouldn't be an issue, but there are other stories. Troy Brown said his sources had Randy blowing off Belichick on the plane ride back.

And BB flat out LIED by saying he didn't speak to Randy on the plane. Right, BB just loves to outright LIE.

Others have a blow up THE NEXT DAY. His attitude and actions at Kraft's charity dinner was disgraceful (who cares if it was a Kraft/Patriots sponsored event, it was to raise money for charity). Other reports have him being a problem for all season. His press conference after the first win was selfish and disrespectful.

You weren't there, please don't pretend that Burton's recollection is perfect. Burton wasn't sitting with Raytheon was he?

I don't know what is true or not, but I am sure Belichick was sugar coating things. Some of what he said could be 100% true while other parts are bold faced lies. Obviously, he was not telling the truth because if Moss was never a problem as Belichick stated, he would be with the team today. Belichick gains nothing from telling the truth (in fact, if he bad mouthed Moss, it could backfire on him) and he would never do it.

So everyone BB trades was a 'problem'? How come he didn't trade Terry Glenn RIGHT away, he was given multiple chances.

I know you love the guy and thought he was going to retire a Patriot, but I saw a divorce coming. I did know if it was going to be messy or not, but Moss is the type of guy who has a shelf life with teams. He needs to be "appreciated" and tends to become a problem when he isn't. This is not all that uncommon with marquee WRs, but it is clear he shot his way out of town.

Yes everything is clear with you because you came to this conclusion before the season and thus read everything with your conclusion as the assumption. And of course you'll have an excuse when he's catching TDs from Favre, since you are already on record that he's lost it.

 

[emoney_33]

You do realize I was responding to someone talking about Randy getting hurt, right?

Yes I do and your logic was that they played him WITH the team because they wanted him AWAY FROM the team... If they wanted him away from the team no matter what, they send him home.

 

[emoney_33]

I think the reasons for the move are simple if we just think about it for a minute:

- Moss is in a contract year and needs big numbers

- Pats don't want him beyond this season. He's 33 and his play is already starting the inevitable decline. Pats are young, have a boatload of picks next year, and feel they don't need an aging $8-10m/yr wide receiver

- the Pats are in the process of changing their offense back to the short passing game + running game featuring TE's. We all can see that the deep threat approach is too hit or miss for our team, we need to move the chains. 10-yd receptions and YAC are not Moss' strengths.

- therefore, he's not going to get the looks and numbers he wants, which could translate to a big drop in his market value (many millions)

- this puts his interests and the team's interests at odds, for the first time since he's been here. Everyone likes and respects each other, but that's the reality and it was causing a lot of tension

- thus more "incidents" in 3 months than the previous 3 years. Pats decide to pull the trigger, get some comp, avoid a deteriorating atmosphere in front of all the young kids, and free the coaches and Brady from worrying about this issue any more.

And also in fairness to Moss, send him to a place where he can get his needs met. I don't think it's by chance that the deal is with an NFC team with SB aspirations and a gunslinging QB.

And also it's the bye week, and the trading deadline's in 2 weeks.

As BB said, he's paid to make these tough decisions and he made a good judjment imo.

This is the most sensible post I've read regarding the whole situation.

 

[Ron Sellers]

Back to the original topic for a moment:

From reports I have read, the "outburst" was at halftime with O'Brien (not Belichick; and later Moss would not respond to Belichick on the plane.

So if that is the case, then technically Belichick did answer truthfully: “Absolutely not true. A total fabrication,” Belichick said. “I didn’t even talk to Randy on the plane.”

It Is What It Is Belichick speaks about Moss trade

 

[Synovia]

I think you may be reading to much into it. Brown may just be uncomfortable talking negatively about another player especially one that he had a good relationship with. Brown basically is choosing his role as a media person over his friendship with Moss (whatever it was/is). Many former players in the media struggle with this.

Or, the more simple explanation is that hes hedging his statements because he doesn't actually know.

 

[Rob0729]

Since you don't believe anything BB says so how do you know he only does what is best for the team?

He has amounted a pretty decent history of making very tough and controversial decisions for the good of the team. His actions speaks more volumes

No it's not quite clear, except in the people's minds who had already come to that conclusion.

Sure, you go with it not being fair to Randy to make him just a decoy and it was the right thing to do to make sure Randy played in a place where they can best use him in his contract year. They don't trade Randy if they don't think he is more of detriment to this team than a third round pick next year.

And BB flat out LIED by saying he didn't speak to Randy on the plane. Right, BB just loves to outright LIE.

You just learning this? Belichick has outright lied in plenty of press conferences in the past. I can't even remember all the players he talked up about how great they were and how hard they worked only to be cut the next week.

You weren't there, please don't pretend that Burton's recollection is perfect. Burton wasn't sitting with Raytheon was he?

LOL! And the meter maid he hit just imagined it. Everyone who watched him moon the Packer fans were just imagining that too. Don't go to ludicrious lengths to defend the guy. Burton was there and he saw it. You didn't. He wasn't the only one who reported it.

So everyone BB trades was a 'problem'? How come he didn't trade Terry Glenn RIGHT away, he was given multiple chances.

It takes two to tango in a trade. Someone has to give them what they want to trade him. Glenn shot himself in the foot because of that because he did, D-I-D, did make an arse of himself both by leaving the stadium before the game and stop to get a hot dog followed by making a bigger arse of himself on Sport Final. All of which happened AFTER THE TRADING DEADLINE. Both the him leaving the stadium and his Sports Final interview happened October 21, 2001 which was about a week after the trade deadline.

Yes everything is clear with you because you came to this conclusion before the season and thus read everything with your conclusion as the assumption. And of course you'll have an excuse when he's catching TDs from Favre, since you are already on record that he's lost it.

Ok, you got me. It is clear the Patriots had to take care of Randy. Who cares what it will do for the Pats season as long as Randy gets his long term deal somewhere else. Admit it, you were wrong about the guy. He shoots his way out of town when isn't happy. He isn't the first diva WR and won't be the last.

 

[Garbanza]

Newslflash:

THEY ALL LIE! Players, coaches, owners, assistants, general managers, personnel guys, towel boys, the pr staff, etc.

 

[Synovia]

LOL! And the meter maid he hit just imagined it. Everyone who watched him moon the Packer fans were just imagining that too. Don't go to ludicrious lengths to defend the guy. Burton was there and he saw it. You didn't. He wasn't the only one who reported it.

Randy Moss never mooned any fans, unless its possible to moon someone with your pants on (its not)

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

And BB flat out LIED by saying he didn't speak to Randy on the plane. Right, BB just loves to outright LIE.

Actually, he does.

Belichick: Maroney will help club - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston

 

[Rob0729]

Randy Moss never mooned any fans, unless its possible to moon someone with your pants on (its not)

I meant fake moon. Or similate moon. Or whatever. Still it was one of his lowlights.

 

[SVN]

I meant fake moon. Or similate moon. Or whatever. Still it was one of his lowlights.

i think at that time it was a response to what green bay fans usually do when the vikings bus comes into lambeau or something - i heard dungy say...

 

[Rob0729]

i think at that time it was a response to what green bay fans usually do when the vikings bus comes into lambeau or something - i heard dungy say...

Still it was a stupid move to do on a family friendly NFL. That said, it was one of his more minor low lights. I just added it because it was done in front of 60,000 people and on national TV.

 

[Synovia]

I meant fake moon. Or similate moon. Or whatever. Still it was one of his lowlights.

Lowlight? Its a hell of a lot better than Merriman's Roid Rage dance. Its not his fault that americans have no sense of humor.

I thought it was pretty funny.