How worried are you about not having Mankins?

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

No, Mankins isn't Brady. But when you cite to the Brady example to bolster your argument, it's misleading. The Patriots had a relative collapse post-Brady, despite Cassel eventually coming around and playing quite well.

I was citing it as an example as my full faith in BB to have backups that can step up to a greater degree than any poster on patsfans.com imagined possible, (lets not forget the general consensus on patfans.com was Cassel should have been cut during camp). BB has an oline guy we all think suck and everyone assumes is just camp fodder that will shock the hell out of everyone when he starts all 16 games.

 

[Deus Irae]

I was citing it as an example as my full faith in BB to have backups that can step up to a greater degree than any poster on patsfans.com imagined possible, (lets not forget the general consensus on patfans.com was Cassel should have been cut during camp).

Well, given that I was one who expected Cassel to be around, I'm again underwhelmed by your argument.

BB has an oline guy we all think suck and everyone assumes is just camp fodder that will shock the hell out of everyone when he starts all 16 games.

We saw Connolly play last season. This isn't a "We'll see........". This is an "Unless he got a hell of a lot better..........".

We also saw that disaster of a LB corps. Things like this undercut the "But BB is God!" argument.

 

[patsfan-1982]

i think Deus Irae said it alredy stephen neal, has not played i full 16 games in 4 years if Nick Kaczur, is playing LG who the hell is going to fill in if neal, goes down Connolly, ? that would be easy picking for teams like the jets reavens and steelers who love to blitz up the middle. they need mankins, bad

 

[Nikolai]

Brady gets knocked around a lot every year because he holds onto the ball until the last second to allow his receivers to get open. That wouldn't change no matter how good his line is because that is his playing style. Besides, Brady had Welker in 2007 and was sacked 26 times on the best offense in league history with three linemen going to the Pro Bowl.

Well, I will admit that part of the reason Brady gets hit a lot is because the playcalling has been too predictable. As with the defense, I expect things to be better on offense because of a change in the scheme this season.

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Things like this undercut the "But BB is God!" argument.

Heresy. Blasphemy. How can you say such a vile thing?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Well, I will admit that part of the reason Brady gets hit a lot is because the playcalling has been too predictable. As with the defense, I expect things to be better on offense because of a change in the scheme this season.

Better weapons will do wonders for playcalling. Might even help the OL.

That said, I wouldn't bet the house that Mankins doesn't show... In fact I'd be willing to bet by now he's getting positively bat **** paniced at the lack of attention/urgency his holdout is eliciting locally or nationally. Someone asked Reiss in his chat today what he was hearing on the Mankins front, and his response was "crickets".

 

[Deus Irae]

Heresy. Blasphemy. How can you say such a vile thing?

well played

 

[Metaphors]

Look at the possible options for Mankins:

1) The Pats release Mankins from his tender and he becomes a free agent

Ain't gonna happen.

2) The Pats trade Mankins to a team that will give him a long-term deal

Also ain't gonna happen. That time has come and gone. The Pats could never get equal value for Mankins now.

3) Mankins sits out the whole (or significant part of) the season

Unlikely to happen. Once Mankins doesn't report by August 10th (unlike past years, reporting after week 10 doesn't make a difference), he loses 2010 as an accrued season. Not a big deal since the next CBA is unlikely to keep UFA at 6 years.

This scenario isn't likely to benefit Mankins at all. In addition to losing his 2010 salary, he is unlikely to get the salary he is looking for by missing a significant number of games. While he is still a top OG, he hasn't shown elite skills since his choke job in SB 42. He needs to put a big year on his resume, not a bunch of DNP's.

4) Mankins signs a long-term agreement with the Pats

This isn't happening until the next CBA becomes a little clearer. Since that is unlikely to happen any time soon, that really doesn't affect Mankins short-term decision making.

5) Mankins reports by Week 1, possibly with some cash and non-franchise promise

IMO, easily the most likely scenario. Mankins got screwed by the last CBA. He can get angry and pitch a fit about it, but that won't change anything. He just needs to get what he can, have an All-Pro season and cash in big time with the new CBA.

He knows that now but is holding onto the chance that the Pats interior line will be decimated by injuries, boosting his leverage. If that doesn't happen, his leverage disappears and his focus turns to setting himself up for 2011.

 

[Kontradiction]

With Kaczur being injured and with the back-up being Connolly, I'm kind of worried. Mankins is a pretty damned good guard. If Kaczur gets healthy and stays that way, I'm less worried. His ability to start and play at a somewhat consistent level is what earned him the extension he got. It's time to collect on it. If Kaczur's injury takes a turn for the worst, I would hope BB would be out there scouting whatever is available on the market.

 

[TheComeback]

We are shooting ourselves in the foot for this season if we don't get Mankins to play. His loss will leave a similar mark to what the Seymour trade did for the Dline.

This oline struggled mightily at times last year, despite what the stats say. In addition to that, they were already a weak run-blocking line, and without Mankins they will be worse. I hope they find a way to get him on the field.

 

[Coach42]

personally I'm worried with or without Kaczur. You can win in the NFL with a flawed team but between the OLB and O Line the Pats are pushing it.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

This is a classic "How the heck can I know?" question, but my gut is that tinkering with the blind side of a line that gave up only 16 sacks of the Franchise as he came off a major injury last year is probably not a good idea.

 

[BlueThunder]

Didn't the Pats just sign Giachiuc (sp) for C/G work? Vet (3 years exp) and he was a starter. Let him compete for the job to backup Kaczur/Neal ...

Doesn't look like BB is standing still on the matter.

 

[Schmo]

LG is now the biggest hole we have on the roster. Take that FWIW. To answer your question, it is the biggest worry I have on the team, just because I have a good feeling about Cunningham and think Ninkovich (I'm a fan) will elevate his play at OLB this year.

 

[ahmed]

Anyone who actually things not having Mankins is not a big deal either has no clue about football, is in denial or just dumb (though I don't want to be rude). How can you say losing your best guard and having nobody anywhere near his ability to replace him is not a bid deal or not a minus?

You can talk about the new big TEs and the better RT all you want, does not change the fact that none of them can play G and nothing is worse for a QB than a rush up the middle.

LG is by far our biggest concern going into the season if Mankins is not playing and please let's stay away from comments such as he's too greedy blah blah blah... he thinks he's worth more than he was offered, he is free to be that way.

 

[Ring 6]

i think Deus Irae said it alredy stephen neal, has not played i full 16 games in 4 years if Nick Kaczur, is playing LG who the hell is going to fill in if neal, goes down Connolly, ? that would be easy picking for teams like the jets reavens and steelers who love to blitz up the middle. they need mankins, bad

The offense didnt screech to a grinding halt with Connolly in there. Overall there was not a drastic dropoff, althought the statistically significance of 5 games is dubious. Nonetheless, comments that suggest his man will put Brady in the hospital are hyperbole.

 

[IcyPatriot]

I'm just waiting to see the OL veterans who will get cut this summer ... if nothing halfway competent comes along then I'll worry ... but just a bit. Almost every thread worrying about disgruntled veterans here was over hyped a bit.

Bill has a high success rate of valuing players ... don't see him making a mistake here either. Mankins is valuable ... but not as valuable as Wilfork and Brady thus he got the mere 7 million a year salary offer ... no way can he feed his kids on that.

 

[RayClay]

2001,2003,2004. Name all the guards on those teams that were not street free agents.
















*C/G shift

 

[Ring 6]

Anyone who actually things not having Mankins is not a big deal either has no clue about football, is in denial or just dumb (though I don't want to be rude). How can you say losing your best guard and having nobody anywhere near his ability to replace him is not a bid deal or not a minus?

You can talk about the new big TEs and the better RT all you want, does not change the fact that none of them can play G and nothing is worse for a QB than a rush up the middle.

LG is by far our biggest concern going into the season if Mankins is not playing and please let's stay away from comments such as he's too greedy blah blah blah... he thinks he's worth more than he was offered, he is free to be that way.

Kaczur is moving to G. He has started for 5 years. A capable starter who has played both RT and LT converting to LG isn't a frightening thing IMO.
Sure Mankins is a good G, but its not like we are throwing a HS player in his place.

 

[Deus Irae]

2001,2003,2004. Name all the guards on those teams that were not street free agents.

Great.... where's the LG on the 2010 roster who's a street free agent and demonstrably capable of getting the job done?