Assessment of the '09 draft...

[Blizzzard]

Two words (well...names, actually) Floyd Reese!

I'm more confident in the draft day Front Office with him on board.

This... :yeahthat::youtheman:

 

[jmt57]

If Chung can't beat out McGowan or Sanders, he's a bust.

Yep, regardless of how you feel about McGowan and Sanders, that's very true.

Remember how so many on this board were crazy about Chung last training camp? It's amazing how low the level of expectations has dropped in eight months.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

For some strange reason I have a hunch that Darius Butler with all those sessions and workouts with Deion Sanders will show in his second season and probable starting role and Butler will have an all-pro season at CB and better than Bodden.....

As far as Chung...I really don't know but Butler will have a special season...you heard it here first

 

[RayClay]

Why are people hung up on who "starts" at safety? We have four young safeties, whose skills perfectly complement each other, and a coach who is probably the most inventive and expert ever at using defensive backs in a variety of combinations.

Talk about trying to fix what ain't broke.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

As I recall it was Floyd Reese (and Ernie Sims) who recommended Belichick to Ray Perkins, who hired him as one of the coaches with the New York Giants. Reese and Belichick were relatively unknown low-level assistant coches with the Lions in the late '70s. Perkins wanted to hire Reese but he had already accepted a position with Minnesota, and recommended Belichick to Perkins. Getting that job with the Giants was obviously a big stepping stone in Belichick's career.

Though Perkins may have had a mediocre coaching career, he did hire a few familiar names: Bill Belichick, Bill Parcells, and Romeo Crennel.

And coaching is a fraternity. Dom Capers got a slot here to regroup. Same deal for Floyd. Who also had the Titans in cap hell for a while, and made some less than stellar (long term) selections and eventually got caught in a power struggle between an egotistical HC and an overweaning ownership. Hiring him here for this gig is the equivalent of bringing in Jr. Seau. Great guy, good soldier and friend, knows how to play the game even if he didn't come up in Belichick's version of this system. But that is who he is here. He hopes to get another shot as a GM one day. It won't happen here unless someone snags Caserio, and it won't happen even then since the title doesn't exist here because the ultimate authority for all football ops rests with Belichick. I have to chuckle though because it reminds me of the way Martz was viewed by some here. These guys haven't won even one... This whole thread is permeated with that mentality. Same folks who wanted Shanny or Gruden as an OC...they want a HOF'er starting at each position or it sucks. They don't grasp what teambuilding entails.

 

[WelshPat]

Whoever said that if Chung can't beat out Sanders or Mcgowan he is a bust, is 100% right. Those guys are Jags, hell, Mcgowan i think was cut by the bears? As a 2nd round pick he should be better than them.

And tbh, i'm kinda alone in saying this but i was let down by Butler last year. I had heard how he was a 1st round talent and could have easily been the first corner taken but, i was let down by his athletism and thought he got picked on a lot, especally against the Dolphins. He was a rookie and will get better but it was dissapointing to see Vontae Davis really make some great plays and compare him to Butler.

 

[Deus Irae]

Whoever said that if Chung can't beat out Sanders or Mcgowan he is a bust, is 100% right. Those guys are Jags, hell, Mcgowan i think was cut by the bears? As a 2nd round pick he should be better than them.

And tbh, i'm kinda alone in saying this but i was let down by Butler last year. I had heard how he was a 1st round talent and could have easily been the first corner taken but, i was let down by his athletism and thought he got picked on a lot, especally against the Dolphins. He was a rookie and will get better but it was dissapointing to see Vontae Davis really make some great plays and compare him to Butler.

I assume that this was a tongue-in-cheek humor post..........

 

[patsinthesnow]

Why are people hung up on who "starts" at safety? We have four young safeties, whose skills perfectly complement each other, and a coach who is probably the most inventive and expert ever at using defensive backs in a variety of combinations.

Talk about trying to fix what ain't broke.

Good point. "Starter" is almost just a title for a secondary player. Since so many packages are used, each safety will have it's strengths maximized, as you pointed out.

Kevin Faulk is "5th string" RB, although most could argue he's our best player at RB.

 

[BostonPatriot]

You've got to love all this talk about Butler, like he was anything more than average last season. He's got all the tools to be a top level corner. Lets see if he shows it this year.

As for james Sanders...HA-HA, he is a jag at best.

 

[BostonPatriot]

Why are people hung up on who "starts" at safety? We have four young safeties, whose skills perfectly complement each other, and a coach who is probably the most inventive and expert ever at using defensive backs in a variety of combinations.

Talk about trying to fix what ain't broke.

You're right Ray, the secondary was AWESOME last year!!!! As mentioned, nothing to see here, move along!

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Why are people hung up on who "starts" at safety? We have four young safeties, whose skills perfectly complement each other, and a coach who is probably the most inventive and expert ever at using defensive backs in a variety of combinations.

Talk about trying to fix what ain't broke.

Those variety of combinations as you mentioned meant squat in 2009...or have you forgotten how much of our leads in the 4th quarter melted away last season?.

The players at safety all have skill but there have been breakdowns last season in the last quarters and the Safeties while they were better than the corners at times,had problems keeping leads late and opposing receivers from doing damage as much as any other part of our defense,we simply could not shut down teams that were behind at the end of the 3rd quarter,especially teams with good quarterbacks...that MUST be fixed this year.

4th quarter breakdowns have to be a big issue of fixing with BB and his boys,both safeties and corners....of course a pass rush would be nice as well to help them out.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

correct me if I'm wrong... but isn't next year only his second in the league?

There isn't any competition at the other safety spot. I expected him to start right away because of that. Now that he has one year of learning the system, it's time for him to take the other safety spot which shouldn't be too difficult. If he can't start in 2010, I'm pretty sure he will turn out to be a bust.

I'm sure you're also with the Brandon Tate is a bust crowd.

No, I'm not in that camp as I thought the pick was stupid from the beginning. I don't have expectations for players coming off of ACL tears. Now with his second ACL tear in two years, I don't expect anything from him. Ditto with McKenzie as I'm already looking for an alternative at ILB. [/QUOTE]

 

[Deus Irae]

There isn't any competition at the other safety spot. I expected him to start right away because of that. Now that he has one year of learning the system, it's time for him to take the other safety spot which shouldn't be too difficult. If he can't start in 2010, I'm pretty sure he will turn out to be a bust.

To claim that there's no competition at the 'other' safety spot is just ridiculous.

No, I'm not in that camp as I thought the pick was stupid from the beginning. I don't have expectations for players coming off of ACL tears. Now with his second ACL tear in two years, I don't expect anything from him. Ditto with McKenzie as I'm already looking for an alternative at ILB.

Please provide a link, from a reliable source who would have such medical knowledge, that tells us Tate suffered another ACL tear.

 

[jmt57]

correct me if I'm wrong... but isn't next year only his second in the league?

I'm sure you're also with the Brandon Tate is a bust crowd.

I, for one...am going to give them both at least another year before I plant any labels.

There isn't any competition at the other safety spot. I expected him to start right away because of that. Now that he has one year of learning the system, it's time for him to take the other safety spot which shouldn't be too difficult. If he can't start in 2010, I'm pretty sure he will turn out to be a bust.

No, I'm not in that camp as I thought the pick was stupid from the beginning. I don't have expectations for players coming off of ACL tears. Now with his second ACL tear in two years, I don't expect anything from him. Ditto with McKenzie as I'm already looking for an alternative at ILB.

I don't think it's fair to lump McKenzie in with Tate, or assume that he (or Tate) will be a bust.

If you don't like the Tate pick (with the benefit of a little hindsight) because of his previous injury that's one thing. But McKenzie had zero injury history prior to being drafted. There's no reason to believe he'll automatically duplicate Crable and go on IR again.

Obviously the chances of success diminish whenever any player has to undergo an ACL surgery, but it doesn't automatically end his career. Twenty or thirty years ago knee surgery was the kiss of death to a professional athlete, but that's no longer the case today.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

To claim that there's no competition at the 'other' safety spot is just ridiculous.



Please provide a link, from a reliable source who would have such medical knowledge, that tells us Tate suffered another ACL tear.

What Brandon Tate could mean to the Patriots - Extra Points - Boston.com

A simple knee cleaning for Tate in 2009

 

[Deus Irae]

What Brandon Tate could mean to the Patriots - Extra Points - Boston.com

A simple knee cleaning for Tate in 2009

Yes, I'd read that. I want to see HEY BRO! WHAT UP? providing a respectable link that claims otherwise, since he's claiming it's another ACL injury.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

That is good news on Tate, I thought he tore his ACL. My bad.

 

[the assman]

In 2-3 years we're all going to look back at 2009 as a GREAT draft with numerous starters & contributors. Great job by BB of adding talent to the roster & picking up the 2 extra 2nd rounders this year.

Look for Chung to get a lot more playing time this year. I have a feeling that by the end of season he's going to be one of this boards' new favs.

 

[RayClay]

Those variety of combinations as you mentioned meant squat in 2009...or have you forgotten how much of our leads in the 4th quarter melted away last season?.

The players at safety all have skill but there have been breakdowns last season in the last quarters and the Safeties while they were better than the corners at times,had problems keeping leads late and opposing receivers from doing damage as much as any other part of our defense,we simply could not shut down teams that were behind at the end of the 3rd quarter,especially teams with good quarterbacks...that MUST be fixed this year.

4th quarter breakdowns have to be a big issue of fixing with BB and his boys,both safeties and corners....of course a pass rush would be nice as well to help them out.

Maybe we should let our young defense get experience playing together?

Just a thought.

Imagine if the San Diego coaches thought like some posters. "26 games over two full years and this Harrison guy has no starts. Can't crack the lineup by now, he's obviously a bust, lets cut him."

 

[RayClay]

As I recall it was Floyd Reese (and Ernie Sims) who recommended Belichick to Ray Perkins, who hired him as one of the coaches with the New York Giants. Reese and Belichick were relatively unknown low-level assistant coches with the Lions in the late '70s. Perkins wanted to hire Reese but he had already accepted a position with Minnesota, and recommended Belichick to Perkins. Getting that job with the Giants was obviously a big stepping stone in Belichick's career.

Though Perkins may have had a mediocre coaching career, he did hire a few familiar names: Bill Belichick, Bill Parcells, and Romeo Crennel.

Ha ha. He had the "tree" some want to give Fairbanks credit for.