Post your current roster projections

[pats1]

Non-rookie PS eligible guys:

Ninkovich
O'Connell
Connolly
Wendell
DeVree
Adams
Crable
Wheatley

 

[pats1]

Offense: 24

QBs (3) - Brady, O'Connell, Hoyer
RBs (4) - Maroney, Morris, Taylor, Faulk
WRs (5) - Moss, Welker, Galloway, Lewis, Edelman OR Nunn
TEs (4) - Baker, Watson, Smith, Thomas
OL (8) - Light, Mankins, Koppen, Neal, Kaczur, Hochstein, Vollmer, Yates

Defense: 24

DL (8) - Seymour, Wilfork, Brace, Warren, Burgess, Green, Wright, Banta-Cain
LB (6) - Thomas, Mayo, Guyton, Woods, Crable, Alexander
CB (5) - Bodden, Wilhite, Springs, Butler, Wheatley
S (4) - Meriweather, Sanders, Chung, McGowan

Specialists (6) - Gostkowski, Hanson, Ingram OR Hodel, Ventrone, Aiken, Ciurciu

PUP: Ohrnberger, Levoir; NFI: Tate; IR: McKenzie

Notable Cuts: Bruschi, Smith, Slater, Green-Ellis, Williams, Britt, Lenon, Bussey, Pryor, Richard, O'Callaghan, Walter, Nunn/Edelman, Hodel/Ingram

 

[captain stone]

Non-rookie PS eligible guys:

Ninkovich
O'Connell
Connolly
Wendell
DeVree
Adams
Crable
Wheatley

Thanks. Connolly still has eligibility? Hmmm. I like his size, but he just hasn't found his place yet.

P.S.: Tedy doesn't make your final 53? Double Hmmm.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

You only list 6 LBs

 

[pats1]

You only list 6 LBs

Yes. And...?

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Yes. And...?

So it's the Eagles' 4-3 two-gap pressure defense this season?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Yes. And...?

You count 7 and name 6 LBs.

You count 5 specialists and name 6

 

[pats1]

So it's the Eagles' 4-3 two-gap pressure defense this season?

Not that drastic. But from everything I've seen and heard from practice and I think we'll see in the preseason, the base 3-4 defense we've seen for years won't be seen nearly as much this year. The Pats, I think, have figured they have the personnel to run a 4-3 this year, where in past years it's obviously been a 3-4. It simply gives them the best chance to win.

It's not going to be the Tampa 2, or the Eagles' pressure. It's not going to be the Patriots' 3-4 featuring Phifer and Vrabel and Bruschi. Not this year.

What we'll see is a defense that provides the best opportunity to stop the run; as Reiss noted in his blog today, that's with Wilfork and Brace inside. We'll see a defense that also provides the best pass rush; that is with Burgess in a three-point stance.

What will characterize the Patriots' defense in 2009 will be the ends: Warren and Seymour. They still won't be playing the role of a traditional 4-3 end, some 260-pound rush end like Schobel.

I think the best way to describe it is a "big 4-3." Could even call it a hybrid, because you could very easily take Brace off the field and put Woods on, creating a 3-4. But that would have to be in running situations, and I don't believe that would give the Pats the best chance to stop the run; you'd rather have Brace in there.

So in the end, this "transition" is really the product of the Pats still not having a Vrabel-type OLB to complement AD, someone who can set the edge and be a force in the run defense. Instead, the Pats have an asset in a developing inside force in Brace. They've simply made the decision having him on the field instead of Woods will give the team the best chance to win.

 

[pats1]

You count 7 and name 6 LBs.

You count 5 specialists and name 6

I moved Ciurciu from LBs to specialists after I was done. Whoops.

 

[pats1]

Two more practice reports from today mesh with my prediction:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...pm-notes-reiss-scalavino-x2-smy-rapoport.htmlhttp://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/members/the_riddler.html

I was there today and yes Ron Brace was part of the consistent 4-man DLine featuring the stoutest 4-some this league can put together with (Warren, Big Vince, Brace and Big Sey), a huge group that would be brutal to run against. I think this may end up being our base 1st down package. BB ran it alot in the 11/11. The LB's in this 4-3 were AD/Mayo/Guyton.

2) Ron Brace is in the mix. The second-round draft choice (40th overall) is right in the middle of the action, getting a lot of quality practice time with some of the team’s most experienced defensive linemen. The potential for a pairing with Vince Wilfork could make the Patriots extremely tough to run on up the middle.

 

[pats1]

Just to cover all the bases:

If Ohrnberger is activated from PUP, Yates goes.

If LeVoir is activated from PUP, Edelman goes.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Not that drastic. But from everything I've seen and heard from practice and I think we'll see in the preseason, the base 3-4 defense we've seen for years won't be seen nearly as much this year. The Pats, I think, have figured they have the personnel to run a 4-3 this year, where in past years it's obviously been a 3-4. It simply gives them the best chance to win.

It's not going to be the Tampa 2, or the Eagles' pressure. It's not going to be the Patriots' 3-4 featuring Phifer and Vrabel and Bruschi. Not this year.

What we'll see is a defense that provides the best opportunity to stop the run; as Reiss noted in his blog today, that's with Wilfork and Brace inside. We'll see a defense that also provides the best pass rush; that is with Burgess in a three-point stance.

So you have Wilfork and Brace at DT. Seymour and Warren at DE. But also Burgess "in a three-point stance". You've lost me a little, with those 4 DL aren't you making Burgess the 5th DL leaving just 2 LB ?

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

So you have Wilfork and Brace at DT. Seymour and Warren at DE. But also Burgess "in a three-point stance". You've lost me a little, with those 4 DL aren't you making Burgess the 5th DL leaving just 2 LB ?

It's the Oklahoma defense brought back to counter the single wing...

 

[pats1]

So you have Wilfork and Brace at DT. Seymour and Warren at DE. But also Burgess "in a three-point stance". You've lost me a little, with those 4 DL aren't you making Burgess the 5th DL leaving just 2 LB ?

Burgess will not be a 3-down player. He will replace Wilfork or Brace on passing downs, moving Seymour or Warren (or both - adding Thomas at DE) inside.

This isn't anything earth-shattering. The Pats have used a nickel package of (Thomas/McGinest, Warren/Green, Seymour, Vrabel/Colvin) for years. Burgess is a replacement for Vrabel/Colvin/McGinest in that setup.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Burgess will not be a 3-down player. He will replace Wilfork or Brace on passing downs, moving Seymour or Warren (or both - adding Thomas at DE) inside.

OK, so Burgess is off the field in that scenario. I'm fine with that, I just wasn't quite getting it; although I could see Burgess being the ROLB on first down with your front four, him or Woods depending on who's better against the run.

 

[pats1]

OK, so Burgess is off the field in that scenario. I'm fine with that, I just wasn't quite getting it; although I could see Burgess being the ROLB on first down with your front four, him or Woods depending on who's better against the run.

Nothing from practice - before or after Burgess' arrival - has suggested that. Burgess has no experience as a 3-4 OLB setting the edge against the run. Everything the Pats have done so far this camp suggests they'd rather have Brace on the field than Woods.

Again, to quote Reiss from today's practice:

1) Eyes on Derrick Burgess. I spent considerable time watching Derrick Burgess, who was thrown right into the mix in 11 on 11 drills by rushing off the defensive left side out of a three-point stance.

I have gone to practice twice now. Woods has only played second string SLB behind Thomas. Guyton has played first string WLB.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Nothing from practice - before or after Burgess' arrival - has suggested that. Burgess has no experience as a 3-4 OLB setting the edge against the run. Everything the Pats have done so far this camp suggests they'd rather have Brace on the field than Woods.

So who are your three LB ? Mayo, Thomas and who else ?

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

So who are your three LB ? Mayo, Thomas and who else ?

I have gone to practice twice now. Woods has only played second string SLB behind Thomas. Guyton has played first string WLB.

Looks like Guyton is your answer. Interesting, as he looked better at ILB last year but I'm not questioning you, I never get to go to camp.

 

[Deus Irae]

My fervent hope is that this has all been about 3rd down, and not about changing to a 4-3 base.

 

[pats1]

My fervent hope is that this has all been about 3rd down, and not about changing to a 4-3 base.

No; the base defense (i.e. early downs) has been a 4-man line with Wilfork, Seymour, Warren, and Brace.

This isn't just conjecture. This is what the Pats have been doing for the past two weeks in camp. I've seen it firsthand.