Report from San Diego

[Tunescribe]

It is 2 a.m. West Coast time, I'm mercifully a tad under the influence ... Not much positive to report from this experience. A few observations on the debacle:

* We all saw the game, I don't have much to add beyond the obvious: the defensive backfield needs something, don't know if it's scheme or personnel shortcomings, but that coupled with the lack of pressure on Rivers was painful to watch. Cassel just could not cut it; the goal-line stand where he got stuffed on fourth down was the final turning point after which the wheels fell off for New England. His pocket awareness continues to be very poor. His throws to Moss were awful.

* Qualcomm is a crumbling relic of a stadium -- lots of bad sightlines, but fairly intimate confines and it holds noise well.

* Chargers fans, as a group, are horrible. LOTS of punk Mexican kids in their teens/early twenties wearing Merriman jerseys, talking trash and trying to pick fights with Patriots fans. I ignored them, but saw some pretty horrific fights in the stands. Very uncivilized atmosphere, unlike Gillette. One Pats fan I saw had a bloody head after being wailed on and had to leave before halftime. The Chargers apparently contract outside for security, and security seemed disorganized and slow to respond to trouble. One San Diego fan who left early (a woman) wished me luck getting out alive. I wore my Pats gear, got harassed standing in line for the men's room -- very mean-spirited comments, and taunting, not good-natured ribbing. A really crappy atmosphere for visitors.

* San Diego is a classy city, but its NFL franchise is anything but, on many levels. Maybe a minor thing, but I noticed that the Chargers had a rather haphazard way of warming up before the game. They just sort of milled around on their side of the field, whereas the Pats did their stretching/warm-up exercises as usual in rows down the yard lines and did drills via position group, etc. They just looked more disciplined and organized overall, despite their performance during the game.

* Kaczur and Jarvis Green were immediately carted off after their injuries, a really bad sign.

* I've never seen BB more angry at officials than after the personal foul called on Mayo. He didn't let up, they eventually walked away from him and he followed one down the sideline. I didn't see what Mayo did on the replay, if anyone can fill me in on that please do.

* The Chargers do deserve credit for sticking it to the Patriots. They were very physical, and their kick coverage was superb. Our defense just couldn't stop them, and our offense looked like it was playing together for the first time.

* I could not figure out BB's reasoning for how the Pats proceeded after the touchdown with about five minutes left. They kicked deep instead of trying onsides, then treated the rest of the game like a preseason contest. No urgency to try to score more, yet timeouts were called later amidst running plays. Anyone hear any explanation?

* Wish I had something more positive to add. The weather was nice. There was a flyover of fighter jets after the national anthem. Looking forward to getting home tomorrow. Goodnight.

 

[tuckeverlasting]

It is 2 a.m. West Coast time, I'm mercifully a tad under the influence ... Not much positive to report from this experience. A few observations on the debacle:

* We all saw the game, I don't have much to add beyond the obvious: the defensive backfield needs something, don't know if it's scheme or personnel shortcomings, but that coupled with the lack of pressure on Rivers was painful to watch. Cassel just could not cut it; the goal-line stand where he got stuffed on fourth down was the final turning point after which the wheels fell off for New England. His pocket awareness continues to be very poor. His throws to Moss were awful.

* Qualcomm is a crumbling relic of a stadium -- lots of bad sightlines, but fairly intimate confines and it holds noise well.

* Chargers fans, as a group, are horrible. LOTS of punk Mexican kids in their teens/early twenties wearing Merriman jerseys, talking trash and trying to pick fights with Patriots fans. I ignored them, but saw some pretty horrific fights in the stands. Very uncivilized atmosphere, unlike Gillette. One Pats fan I saw had a bloody head after being wailed on and had to leave before halftime. The Chargers apparently contract outside for security, and security seemed disorganized and slow to respond to trouble. One San Diego fan who left early (a woman) wished me luck getting out alive. I wore my Pats gear, got harassed standing in line for the men's room -- very mean-spirited comments, and taunting, not good-natured ribbing. A really crappy atmosphere for visitors.

* San Diego is a classy city, but its NFL franchise is anything but, on many levels. Maybe a minor thing, but I noticed that the Chargers had a rather haphazard way of warming up before the game. They just sort of milled around on their side of the field, whereas the Pats did their stretching/warm-up exercises as usual in rows down the yard lines and did drills via position group, etc. They just looked more disciplined and organized overall, despite their performance during the game.

* Kaczur and Jarvis Green were immediately carted off after their injuries, a really bad sign.

* I've never seen BB more angry at officials than after the personal foul called on Mayo. He didn't let up, they eventually walked away from him and he followed one down the sideline. I didn't see what Mayo did on the replay, if anyone can fill me in on that please do.

* The Chargers do deserve credit for sticking it to the Patriots. They were very physical, and their kick coverage was superb. Our defense just couldn't stop them, and our offense looked like it was playing together for the first time.

* I could not figure out BB's reasoning for how the Pats proceeded after the touchdown with about five minutes left. They kicked deep instead of trying onsides, then treated the rest of the game like a preseason contest. No urgency to try to score more, yet timeouts were called later amidst running plays. Anyone hear any explanation?

* Wish I had something more positive to add. The weather was nice. There was a flyover of fighter jets after the national anthem. Looking forward to getting home tomorrow. Goodnight.

my son and a grip of pats fans went to the game as a group. because he knew there was going to be trouble he escorted a female pats fan to the girls room and was surrounded by a gang of 5' 3" hispanic charger fans. he tried to ignore the losers but one spit on him. he did his best to maintain his composure but once his female friend came out of the girls room, he jocked one on the jaw and they made a dash for their seats. when he told his friends they were enraged and wanted blood. thankfully, they couldn't find them.

 

[pao]

You are very kind. But I must say this: The Charger ownership has a serious problem on its hands from what I saw and experienced at Qualcomm. Again, there is a very tangible hooligan element of young, primarily Hispanic males looking to cause trouble with visiting fans in the stands and on the concourses. Coupled with the lax out-sourced security, it's not a good place to take in a game if you're not a Chargers fan.

I thought the days were gone when groups of fans around me would stand up during the game so they could watch the fights happening a couple sections over. I remember how stupid that could be at old Foxboro Stadium in the '80s and early '90s, before the Krafts instituted a zero-tolerance policy for violent behavior. The Chargers appear to be way behind the curve.

I believe the Chargers are not long for San Diego. That stadium is a disaster and City finances are a mess (although getting better). The City Attorney is a jackass and will be a roadblock to anything the Chargers do short of paying for a new stadium out of pocket (they won't). But all of that is no excuse for the behavior you describe and it needs to stop NOW. I have emailed the Chargers and a copy of your descripion, and others, was included. I expect to get the obligatory "we listen to our fans and will look into the matter" response. All responsible Chargers fans should do the same. Later in the day I will start a thread on the CMB and try to get a concerted effort started to get something that you describe as zero-tolerance policy instituted. I am surprised it isn't in place already. Again, on behalf of all Charger fans, I apologise to you and your family.

 

[Patjew]

Ugh, sounds like a pretty crappy experience. Glad I wasn't there.

 

[Pats726]

Sounds like a pretty poor place to be at...worse than Gillette in its worse days..no surpise at all though...given how they booed the refs when it was an obvious situation where teh player didn't have control of the ball..and being up by 20 plus points..when I saw that I realized the mentality OR lack of it in the fans there.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Our defense just couldn't stop them, and our offense looked like it was playing together for the first time.

That about sums up the game. For what it's worth I was cheering their performance.

 

[ScottieC]

It is 2 a.m. West Coast time, I'm mercifully a tad under the influence ... Not much positive to report from this experience. A few observations on the debacle:

* We all saw the game, I don't have much to add beyond the obvious: the defensive backfield needs something, don't know if it's scheme or personnel shortcomings, but that coupled with the lack of pressure on Rivers was painful to watch. Cassel just could not cut it; the goal-line stand where he got stuffed on fourth down was the final turning point after which the wheels fell off for New England. His pocket awareness continues to be very poor. His throws to Moss were awful.

* Qualcomm is a crumbling relic of a stadium -- lots of bad sightlines, but fairly intimate confines and it holds noise well.

* Chargers fans, as a group, are horrible. LOTS of punk Mexican kids in their teens/early twenties wearing Merriman jerseys, talking trash and trying to pick fights with Patriots fans. I ignored them, but saw some pretty horrific fights in the stands. Very uncivilized atmosphere, unlike Gillette. One Pats fan I saw had a bloody head after being wailed on and had to leave before halftime. The Chargers apparently contract outside for security, and security seemed disorganized and slow to respond to trouble. One San Diego fan who left early (a woman) wished me luck getting out alive. I wore my Pats gear, got harassed standing in line for the men's room -- very mean-spirited comments, and taunting, not good-natured ribbing. A really crappy atmosphere for visitors.

* San Diego is a classy city, but its NFL franchise is anything but, on many levels. Maybe a minor thing, but I noticed that the Chargers had a rather haphazard way of warming up before the game. They just sort of milled around on their side of the field, whereas the Pats did their stretching/warm-up exercises as usual in rows down the yard lines and did drills via position group, etc. They just looked more disciplined and organized overall, despite their performance during the game.

* Kaczur and Jarvis Green were immediately carted off after their injuries, a really bad sign.

* I've never seen BB more angry at officials than after the personal foul called on Mayo. He didn't let up, they eventually walked away from him and he followed one down the sideline. I didn't see what Mayo did on the replay, if anyone can fill me in on that please do.

* The Chargers do deserve credit for sticking it to the Patriots. They were very physical, and their kick coverage was superb. Our defense just couldn't stop them, and our offense looked like it was playing together for the first time.

* I could not figure out BB's reasoning for how the Pats proceeded after the touchdown with about five minutes left. They kicked deep instead of trying onsides, then treated the rest of the game like a preseason contest. No urgency to try to score more, yet timeouts were called later amidst running plays. Anyone hear any explanation?

* Wish I had something more positive to add. The weather was nice. There was a flyover of fighter jets after the national anthem. Looking forward to getting home tomorrow. Goodnight.

Thanks for the report!

Wow, I was close to going to this game. Glad I did not - I'll mark this one off the bucket list as a no-go for future reference.

 

[pao]

It is 2 a.m. West Coast time, I'm mercifully a tad under the influence ... Not much positive to report from this experience. A few observations on the debacle:

* We all saw the game, I don't have much to add beyond the obvious: the defensive backfield needs something, don't know if it's scheme or personnel shortcomings, but that coupled with the lack of pressure on Rivers was painful to watch. Cassel just could not cut it; the goal-line stand where he got stuffed on fourth down was the final turning point after which the wheels fell off for New England. His pocket awareness continues to be very poor. His throws to Moss were awful.

* Qualcomm is a crumbling relic of a stadium -- lots of bad sightlines, but fairly intimate confines and it holds noise well.

* Chargers fans, as a group, are horrible. LOTS of punk Mexican kids in their teens/early twenties wearing Merriman jerseys, talking trash and trying to pick fights with Patriots fans. I ignored them, but saw some pretty horrific fights in the stands. Very uncivilized atmosphere, unlike Gillette. One Pats fan I saw had a bloody head after being wailed on and had to leave before halftime. The Chargers apparently contract outside for security, and security seemed disorganized and slow to respond to trouble. One San Diego fan who left early (a woman) wished me luck getting out alive. I wore my Pats gear, got harassed standing in line for the men's room -- very mean-spirited comments, and taunting, not good-natured ribbing. A really crappy atmosphere for visitors.

* San Diego is a classy city, but its NFL franchise is anything but, on many levels. Maybe a minor thing, but I noticed that the Chargers had a rather haphazard way of warming up before the game. They just sort of milled around on their side of the field, whereas the Pats did their stretching/warm-up exercises as usual in rows down the yard lines and did drills via position group, etc. They just looked more disciplined and organized overall, despite their performance during the game.

* Kaczur and Jarvis Green were immediately carted off after their injuries, a really bad sign.

* I've never seen BB more angry at officials than after the personal foul called on Mayo. He didn't let up, they eventually walked away from him and he followed one down the sideline. I didn't see what Mayo did on the replay, if anyone can fill me in on that please do.

* The Chargers do deserve credit for sticking it to the Patriots. They were very physical, and their kick coverage was superb. Our defense just couldn't stop them, and our offense looked like it was playing together for the first time.

* I could not figure out BB's reasoning for how the Pats proceeded after the touchdown with about five minutes left. They kicked deep instead of trying onsides, then treated the rest of the game like a preseason contest. No urgency to try to score more, yet timeouts were called later amidst running plays. Anyone hear any explanation?

* Wish I had something more positive to add. The weather was nice. There was a flyover of fighter jets after the national anthem. Looking forward to getting home tomorrow. Goodnight.

On behalf of all San Diegans please accept my apologies for the way you were treated. There is no place for stuff like that at a sporting venue. On a positive note I attended an Italian Festival here in San Diego before the game. Noticed many people wearing Patriot uniforms and spoke to a few, they were all gracious and talkative and it seemed as though they were enjoying themselves. None were hassled that I saw. Again, my apologies.

 

[pao]

my son and a grip of pats fans went to the game as a group. because he knew there was going to be trouble he escorted a female pats fan to the girls room and was surrounded by a gang of 5' 3" hispanic charger fans. he tried to ignore the losers but one spit on him. he did his best to maintain his composure but once his female friend came out of the girls room, he jocked one on the jaw and they made a dash for their seats. when he told his friends they were enraged and wanted blood. thankfully, they couldn't find them.

As a Charger fan I think I would have punched that Charger fan. Dude needed to be ejected and his season tickets taken away. Spitting on a girl?? Or anyone? Pathetic. Unacceptable. A stain on our fine city. For what it's worth I did not see any incidents described here.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

* Chargers fans, as a group, are horrible. LOTS of punk Mexican kids in their teens/early twenties wearing Merriman jerseys, talking trash and trying to pick fights with Patriots fans. I ignored them, but saw some pretty horrific fights in the stands. Very uncivilized atmosphere, unlike Gillette. One Pats fan I saw had a bloody head after being wailed on and had to leave before halftime. The Chargers apparently contract outside for security, and security seemed disorganized and slow to respond to trouble. One San Diego fan who left early (a woman) wished me luck getting out alive. I wore my Pats gear, got harassed standing in line for the men's room -- very mean-spirited comments, and taunting, not good-natured ribbing. A really crappy atmosphere for visitors.

* San Diego is a classy city

I love the SD area. I had similar experiences in my 2002 trip to Qualcom. Got seriously harrassed in the men's room but not accosted. It was a day game so there was probably less alcohol involved. Brady had a bad game with 2 very bad decision picks and LT ran wild. The Bledsoe Krishna Pats fans were still not over the recent divorce, so as the noted Brady's Lady in our 50 fan traveling contingent I took post game friendly fire as well.

 

[Tunescribe]

On behalf of all San Diegans please accept my apologies for the way you were treated. There is no place for stuff like that at a sporting venue. On a positive note I attended an Italian Festival here in San Diego before the game. Noticed many people wearing Patriot uniforms and spoke to a few, they were all gracious and talkative and it seemed as though they were enjoying themselves. None were hassled that I saw. Again, my apologies.

You are very kind. But I must say this: The Charger ownership has a serious problem on its hands from what I saw and experienced at Qualcomm. Again, there is a tangible hooligan element of young, primarily Hispanic males looking to cause trouble with visiting fans in the stands and on the concourses. Coupled with the lax out-sourced security, it's not a good place to take in a game if you're not a Chargers fan.

I thought the days were gone when groups of fans around me would stand up during the game so they could watch the fights happening a couple sections over. I remember how stupid that could be at old Foxboro Stadium in the '80s and early '90s, before the Krafts bought the team and instituted a zero-tolerance policy for abusive behavior. The Chargers appear to be way behind the curve in that respect.

 

[JoeSixPat]

You are very kind. But I must say this: The Charger ownership has a serious problem on its hands from what I saw and experienced at Qualcomm. Again, there is a tangible hooligan element of young, primarily Hispanic males looking to cause trouble with visiting fans in the stands and on the concourses. Coupled with the lax out-sourced security, it's not a good place to take in a game if you're not a Chargers fan.

I thought the days were gone when groups of fans around me would stand up during the game so they could watch the fights happening a couple sections over. I remember how stupid that could be at old Foxboro Stadium in the '80s and early '90s, before the Krafts bought the team and instituted a zero-tolerance policy for abusive behavior. The Chargers appear to be way behind the curve in that respect.

I'm not meaning this to reflect on the ownership's investment in team talent, but it strikes me as a very cheap organization - there's little willingness to invest in the stadium or in security and ensuring an overall positive experience for all fans. I wouln't feel very safe even if I were an SD fan.

Aside from that it's a great city though.

It might be a very small percentage of fans but if they can turn on visiting team fans they can easilly turn on their own fans should they do something they don't like.

 

[Ian]

It is 2 a.m. West Coast time, I'm mercifully a tad under the influence ... Not much positive to report from this experience. A few observations on the debacle:

* We all saw the game, I don't have much to add beyond the obvious: the defensive backfield needs something, don't know if it's scheme or personnel shortcomings, but that coupled with the lack of pressure on Rivers was painful to watch. Cassel just could not cut it; the goal-line stand where he got stuffed on fourth down was the final turning point after which the wheels fell off for New England. His pocket awareness continues to be very poor. His throws to Moss were awful.

* Qualcomm is a crumbling relic of a stadium -- lots of bad sightlines, but fairly intimate confines and it holds noise well.

* Chargers fans, as a group, are horrible. LOTS of punk Mexican kids in their teens/early twenties wearing Merriman jerseys, talking trash and trying to pick fights with Patriots fans. I ignored them, but saw some pretty horrific fights in the stands. Very uncivilized atmosphere, unlike Gillette. One Pats fan I saw had a bloody head after being wailed on and had to leave before halftime. The Chargers apparently contract outside for security, and security seemed disorganized and slow to respond to trouble. One San Diego fan who left early (a woman) wished me luck getting out alive. I wore my Pats gear, got harassed standing in line for the men's room -- very mean-spirited comments, and taunting, not good-natured ribbing. A really crappy atmosphere for visitors.

* San Diego is a classy city, but its NFL franchise is anything but, on many levels. Maybe a minor thing, but I noticed that the Chargers had a rather haphazard way of warming up before the game. They just sort of milled around on their side of the field, whereas the Pats did their stretching/warm-up exercises as usual in rows down the yard lines and did drills via position group, etc. They just looked more disciplined and organized overall, despite their performance during the game.

* Kaczur and Jarvis Green were immediately carted off after their injuries, a really bad sign.

* I've never seen BB more angry at officials than after the personal foul called on Mayo. He didn't let up, they eventually walked away from him and he followed one down the sideline. I didn't see what Mayo did on the replay, if anyone can fill me in on that please do.

* The Chargers do deserve credit for sticking it to the Patriots. They were very physical, and their kick coverage was superb. Our defense just couldn't stop them, and our offense looked like it was playing together for the first time.

* I could not figure out BB's reasoning for how the Pats proceeded after the touchdown with about five minutes left. They kicked deep instead of trying onsides, then treated the rest of the game like a preseason contest. No urgency to try to score more, yet timeouts were called later amidst running plays. Anyone hear any explanation?

* Wish I had something more positive to add. The weather was nice. There was a flyover of fighter jets after the national anthem. Looking forward to getting home tomorrow. Goodnight.

I thought this was an excellent post and a pretty telling one. I had heard it was like this going to a Raiders game, but didn't realize it was this bad in San Diego. The fact it's allowed and that they don't crack down on it is appalling. Unreal.

 

[mtbykr]

Sounds more like a soccer game south of the border, than a NFL game!

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

The punks that show up at games is clearly a bandwagon effect...

I've gone to several A's games over the years, even when the Sox weren't in town. McAfee Colisieum is normally a morgue, with tons of empty seats. When the A's were in the postseason every year earlier this decade, all the punks came out to fill the seats, just looking to start crap. I admit I smiled because usually they were looking to start crap with Yankees fans, but I digress .

Contrary to popular belief, Raiders games aren't all that bad. Go catch a Panthers/Raiders game and sure you'll find your share of losers, but overall it's a good experience and if you have any issues, you'll find plenty of empty seats to move to. However, if it's the Pats in town then the thugs show up in force. I had a row of kids sitting behind me calling me every name in the book in spanish when I caught the Pats/Raiders game in 2002. Fortunately my wife who understood them was wise and didn't translate or else I may have said something and escalated the issue.

When I lived in San Diego, the Chargers couldn't buy a sellout despite making the playoffs in '92 and going to the big show in '94. Now that they are part of the AFC's holy trinity...Pats/Colts/Chargers (at least until this year)...the bandwagon punks are showing up in force and are going to make the scene miserable until ownership steps in and does something. But here's the thing: Will ownership do anything? The Pats have a several years-long waiting list as leverage to keep ticket holders accountable for bad behavior. Do the Chargers have the same? San Diego might actually need those fans from a revenue standpoint.

Regards,
Chris

 

[JMarr]

Good post Tunescribe--gives you a good feel for the atmosphere at the game.

Even though I probably would say the same thing about the "punks" in the crowd if I had been there, some of the comments here sound pretty racist. Is it too PC to point out that there are hooligans of every ethnicity? Look at some of the English soccer fans. Is the fact that the Gillette crowd tends to be so homogenous and polite really such a good thing? Just wondering.

 

[tombonneau]

Wow, I was at the game and had the complete opposite experience. I was surprised as I was expecting it to be bad, but I didn't really meet anyone uncivilized. All the Charger fans were pretty cool. Plus, I thought there were a ton of Pats fans, maybe a 20/80 split where I was sitting.

Was heckled a few times tailgating, but nothing out of the norm.

I thought the fans were actually a bit worse at the SF game last week.

 

[miDeuce]

Wow, I was at the game and had the complete opposite experience. I was surprised as I was expecting it to be bad, but I didn't really meet anyone uncivilized. All the Charger fans were pretty cool. Plus, I thought there were a ton of Pats fans, maybe a 20/80 split where I was sitting.

Was heckled a few times tailgating, but nothing out of the norm.

I thought the fans were actually a bit worse at the SF game last week.

I had the same experience. My sister and her bf had to deal with one jerk in the 300s, but even other chargers fans were yelling at him to shut up. All in all I didn't have any problems and found the Charger fans around me were all pretty cool. There was some good natured trash talking but nothing that "congratulations you're 3-3" wouldn't shut up.

 

[Ghost of Ben Dreith]

Good post Tunescribe--gives you a good feel for the atmosphere at the game.

Even though I probably would say the same thing about the "punks" in the crowd if I had been there, some of the comments here sound pretty racist. Is it too PC to point out that there are hooligans of every ethnicity? Look at some of the English soccer fans. Is the fact that the Gillette crowd tends to be so homogenous and polite really such a good thing? Just wondering.

No...it isn't too PC, which I abhor, to point out that hooligans exist in every ethnicity, since it is true. But please......he was just stating facts. And yes....on the west coast.....Hispanic gangs are a huge problem......racist or not....it is just a fact. This is from somebody who lives in the middle of it.

The train of thought you had is why we pat down grandmothers at the airport instead of just middle eastern men. Again....just facts. Everybody won't like them, but they are still facts.

And this is not meant as a personal attack. Please don't take it as such.

The bigger issue and more germane to the thread is why the Chargers don't up the security. They owe that to paying customers. I am actually happy that a Charger fan is agreeing with this. I wonder if the Chargers will actually do something about this. It may take a tragedy for them to respond meaningfully.

 

[maverick4]

Some of you, what is with the constant need to put Mexican or Hispanic in front of your words here?

There were plenty of garbage White fans at Pats and Sox games up until just a few years ago.