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  1. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Ok, it's dead time around here, with the combine happening and pretty much nothing else. So, I thought of an idea to pass the time.


    Jason has the Patriots sitting at about $11 million once all rookies are signed and bonuses are paid. According to some rumors about the cap out there, he could easily be 1-2 million on the low side. Now, here's the game....

    We'll call the above 12.5 million, and add 3 million from a Mankins restructure. Looking at who's currently on schedule to be a FA (Walterfooball has a list, for example) and those who are rumored to be getting cut, build the team with that $15.5 million and give your money spent (i.e. Sign Jennings to his $14 million per year demands :singing: ). Be reasonable with your numbers, as no veteran minimum contract for Aqib Talib is going to happen, if you get my drift. Draft picks are allowed and encouraged, as long as the current "general consensus" has them available when you're making the pick.


    Anyone interested, fire away:





    2/26 mod edit: with the contract extension for Tom Brady, you can now use a figure of $20.5 million rather than $12.5 million


    .
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 26, 2013
  2. nzahir

    nzahir Rookie

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    Re sign talib for 5-6 mil a year average 4 years or maybe a guy like derek cox, keenan lewis, or grimes(though he will be 29 or 30 and just came off a huge injury).
    Sign amendola for 3-4 mil a year average 3 years
    Sign gosder cherilus for 4 years 4 mil a year average
    So now lets say we have 2.5 mil left, maybe if we cut or restructure some guys to save us a million or 2, we can sign a guy like desmond bryant

    Draft:
    Round 1: Tavon austin
    Round 2(traded up, round 3 pick was used): matt elam
    Round 4: The honey badger
    Round 5-7: depth at db's, o line,..

    I wish this team could get another big playmaker except for talib, such as woodson, reed, goldson, or melton; but that means somebody wouldnt be signed(such as cherilus) and maybe other contracts would have to be restructured. Maybe instead of cherilus, this team can draft o-line in round 2 and sign a guy like reed or woodson.
  3. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Seems like a real low number? I thought we were in the 18-20 range? How do rookies take us to 11?
  4. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Where do we get picks in rounds 4, 5 and 6? We don't have any.
  5. ivanvamp

    ivanvamp Rookie

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    So assuming that we haven't got Welker, Vollmer, or Talib in the fold, here's one way to approach it.

    Premise #1: The Patriots' offense is historically great with Wes Welker. Without him, they would drop from historically great down to merely being tremendous (top 2-3 in the NFL). I estimate that they would score about 28-30 points a game without Welker, as opposed to the 34 they score with him. His overall contributions are worth 4-6 points a game, IMO. But can a team with a 28-30 ppg offense win the Super Bowl? Absolutely positively yes.

    Premise #2: The biggest area of need the Patriots have is on defense (pass rush and DBs, specifically) and wide receiver. Obviously if you let Welker go you create an even bigger need at the WR position.

    Premise #3: The defense, full of young players, will probably improve *some* just due to increased experience. But not enough for my liking.

    Premise #4: I have to assume that Dennard will miss some time due to his conviction. I have to plan on him not being around in 2013. If he is here, bonus. If I plan on him being here and he's not, it cripples my defense.

    So here's the deal.

    (1) Here () lists the highest paid corners in the NFL in 2012. Based on this information, I think the Pats re-sign Talib to a 4-year, $26 million contract. He can't expect to be a top 5 guy, but I think making more of it guaranteed entices him (say, $18 million of it). If you have to go an extra year at that rate to make him bite, so be it. So there's $6.5 million of the $15.5 million available, meaning I've got $9 million left.

    (2) Sign either Reed or Woodson to a 3-year, $13.5 million deal to play safety. This is for two reasons. First, if Dennard is out, you can move McCourty to corner and have Reed/Woodson play with Gregory. And if he's there, you have Dennard/Talib at CB, and McCourty/Reed(Woodson) at S. That's a very, very strong defensive backfield. All four guys can cover and hit. And second, they draft a S and having Reed/Woodson serves as a great mentor and placeholder until that new guy is ready. That leaves me with $4.5 million left.

    BTW, you can structure the contracts for Talib and Reed/Woodson in such a way that instead of $4.5 million left, you actually have about $7 million left, so I'm working with that number.

    (3) Sign Freeney or Umenyiora (preferably Freeney) to be a situational pass rusher. I hope you can get one of them for $5 million a year over 3 years. This gives the Pats added help getting after the quarterback.

    So I'm down to $2 million. With that, I'd re-sign Edelman and add a couple of depth moves to fill out the roster, especially on the OL where Dante can coach up a couple of JAGs into useful players.

    So my pass defense looks like this:

    DE Jones
    DT Wilfork
    DT Armstead
    DE Freeney/Umenyiora
    LB Ninkovich (in for Spikes in passing situations; he can cover better and rush the QB better)
    LB Mayo
    LB Hightower or Fletcher (Fletcher is better in coverage)
    CB Talib
    CB Dennard
    S McCourty
    S Reed/Woodson

    That is, on paper, a MUCH improved defense against the pass. And it takes care of their biggest need on the entire team.

    Now, that's it for free agency. And it brings me to the draft. They have a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 7th round picks. I would use the 1st and 2nd round picks, and trade the 3rd rounder for a 4th and 5th rounders, just to add depth, unless there was a guy I wanted that's available in the 3rd round.

    Round 1 - Tavon Austin, WR. The more I think about this guy the more I like him. He is unbelievable. Blazing speed (4.39). Can play RB or WR. Very good hands. Incredible playmaker. He not only helps you right now but he becomes the best WR target on the team for years to come.

    Round 2 - DJ Swearinger, S. Per my comments on Reed/Woodson, the Pats will need a new young safety. I think Tavon Wilson has potential, but a guy like Swearinger has more, IMO. I think other possibilities could include Datone Jones (DE, UCLA), Jamar Taylor (CB, Boise St), Eric Reid (S, LSU), etc. Go with the best available safety here.

    Round 4, 5, 7 - the best available D-linemen and DBs. I might even trade my 4th for a 5th and a 6th, meaning instead of 3 picks in this group, I'd have 4, thus increasing my chances of landing someone good.

    So my offense, would then have a good player in Edelman plus a dynamic stud in Austin replacing Welker. Austin, Lloyd, Hernandez, Gronk, Ballard, Edelman, Vereen, Woodhead, Ridley, Bolden, Demps....that's a LOT of firepower to give Brady. Hope your OL holds up - that's the one big question mark, but again, I'm counting on Scarnecchia to do his work.

    There's not enough money to get everyone you want, but this fills in the biggest holes and sets the team up not just now, but longer-term as well. I *think* they can do it with the budget you've allotted. (obviously nobody knows for sure)
  6. The_Riddler

    The_Riddler Rookie

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    Just off the top, I would spend the first 2 picks on WRs (Tavon Austin to play the slot at 29 and Robert Woods in round 2 on the perimeter to play with Lloyd).

    Then trade down in round 3 and pick up some additional depth picks that were lost in rounds 4 and 5. Use those picks for a coverage LB and a developmental OG OT.

    Let Welker walk and use those saved funds to bring back Talib at slightly above market rate and then Vollmer at market rate, whatever that market projects.

    Then in FA, focus all allocated FA funds on the defensive side of the ball. Goldsen or Reed and/or Dominque Rodgers-Cromartie.
  7. Nehalem

    Nehalem Rookie

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    So how exactly do you get

    Gronk - Hernandez - Austin - Woods - Llyod - Ridley on the field at the same time?

    And why are we spending a first on a slot receiver when we have Gronk and Hernandez (and possibly Ballard) to work the middle of the field? Hasn't everyone been complaining that we have to many players to work the middle of the field?
  8. The_Riddler

    The_Riddler Rookie

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    First of all why couldn't you get the aforementioned all on the field at the same time?

    The Pocket Rocket, Tavon Austin, just ran a 4.25 in Indy. He is worthy of the slot WR pick because from a financial and age perspective, it would help the team out tremendously, not to mention Tavon's dynamic ability as a returner, which is a huge need for us. It's time to move on from Welker, he gave us a great five years, but it's time to get an explosive kid like this. He would make our offensive absolutely deadly. Woods in round 2 is the guy we would draft for the perimeter.
  9. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Rather than signing big contract guys until the money runs out, I will look at it from the reverse perspective, that is, after the basics are handled, what is left for the big money guys.
    I'll break it down into 3 posts, offense, defense, then conclusion.
    I'll start with what we have, filling in 'jags' or draft choices (I will use WR, S, DL as the top 3 picks for the sake of example, and not heavily rely on any in year 1 because we don't know who will be on the board at 29, and therefore which position we will add a player who can contribute)

    OFFENSE
    QB- All set, no moves needed
    RB- Ridley, Vereen, Bolden, Demps. I'm good with this group, and I think Woodhead is now a luxury because Vereen can fill his role.
    WR- We need a boatload. Lloyd staying, IMO is a no brainer. Add a draft choice. Here we must spend at least 2 mill (note here that I am using the 51 rule, so that is really 3 mill in first year cap hits, and it is for JAGs). in first year cap hits to just fill in bodies. This will require more money because Lloyd a pick and 2 JAGs won't cut it.
    OL- 4 of 5 starters under contract. As is, Cannon becomes the starter, Zusevics and McDonald are the only players under contract. 2 JAG OL to fill the roster equals net cost of 1mill. At the least we need either a starter at RT or a strong backup than just a JAG.

    So by filling in the offense with JAGs at OL and WR, we have spent 3 mill of cap space. When we revisit and say, sign a FA WR, we will only address the INCREASE over what the JAG cost we already accounted for is.
  10. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well, you could. . . . if one of them is playing quarterback.
  11. patsinthesnow

    patsinthesnow PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Resign Welker 3 years 25 million
    Resign Arrington vet minimum
    Sign JAGs at WR and OL

    Vollmer, Talib, Edelman, Woodhead, Chung, Thomas, and the rest all gone.

    Money remaining: 6.5 million

    Sign Nnamdi Asomugha 3 years 15 million

    Draft:

    Trade down from 29 to 35 and a 4th round pick.

    35: Robert Woods, WR, USC
    59: D.J Swearinger FS, South Carolina
    3rd round: Jordan Reed, TE, Florida
    4th round: Leon McFadden, CB, SDS
    7th round: Connor Vernon, WR, Duke
    7th round: Ace Sanders, WR, South Carolina

    This year is interesting considering we have one 5 star FA, two 4 star FAs, only 15 million in cap, and for once are just another draft team. (No two 1sts, two 2nds, two 3rds) We have to trust our guys at OL and DL IMO.
  12. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    DEFENSE

    DL- If we played with todays roster we would start:
    Ninkovich-Wilfork-Love/Armstead-Jones with Deaderick, Armstead/Love, Cunningham, Francis and Forston as backups. With Vega, Benard and Bequette as long shots.
    Armstead, Cunningham, and possibly Francis figure to be inside pass rushers in sub packages.
    No moves are needed here, but an upgrade to the pass rush is on the list of wants.

    LB- Mayo, Spikes, Hightower, with Fletcher as the backup is the core. Tarpinian is under contract as the special teamer (resiging White,or someone else is a costfree change). With Ninkovich and Cunningham able to fill in here if needed, we would need a JAG at the minimum in the least to fill out the spot. Net cost due to rule of 51 is zero.

    CB- I am assuming Dennard will be available. Worst case is that he will get a short suspension but precedent says he should not.
    If we started the season today (assuming we count McCourty at S, which for the purpose of 'Jagging out' the roster is fine) we would have Dennard, Dowling and Williams. Fill in with a minimum salary guy and a cheap nickle and we spend a net of 2mill

    S- As of now we have McCourty, Gregory, Wilson, Ebner, plus we are counting a draft choice here.

    After reviewing this, I am changing the DL draft pick to corner, to fill the nickel spot, so I'm going to lower the extra DB to a 1mill cap hit to just add 1 guy who should make the team (1.5 first year hit) to Dennard, Dowling, rookie. Clearly this is, at this point a place holder for the big money addition at corner.

    Total fill out the roster spending on D is 1mill
  13. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    So we have 'spend' 4 mill of the 15.5 getting to a full roster.
    BTW, I neglected TE, but we are all set there, with the exception of a 4th TE that should be a net of next to zero, and special teams is all under contract.

    To get here, we are left with these issues

    QB- none
    RB- none
    TE- none
    WR- We have Lloyd a draft pick and JAGs
    OL- We have Cannon starting and little depth

    DL- Pass rush is lacking
    LB- cover guy?
    CB- Need a #1
    S- If McCourty stays, we drafted a S to add to the mix of Wilson and Gregory for the #2 and #3.

    We have 11.5 mill to spend.

    1) The best way to improve this defense is the pass rush. I suggest a philosophy shift (one that has already started btw) to a greater concern about pass rush on first down, and to fill the field with pass rushers in sub.
    I am actually feeling OK about the inside pass rush, assuming Armstead can do what he is being portrayed as. Putting him next to VW in the base should create more pressure up the middle and Armstead, Cunningham, Francis may give us a decent inside rush in sub. VW needs to come off the field more often. Move Jones to LDE, and add a pass rush specialist to play RDE. Freeney has been mentioned, but there are many options at the right price.
    This also allows us to move Ninkovich back to backup LB and backup DE.
    This will cost net 4 mill, (3 years 19mill, sb of 9, salaries of 1, 4, 5).
    7.5 mill left

    WR. I've already accounted for 2mill, so the Welker contract of 4/38 with 14 up front and salaries of 2,4,7,11) which will cost us 5.5 in 2013, or 3.5 more than what I have accounted for.

    4 mill left

    OL. Thomas can come back if cheap, we can add a guy in the Gallery range. Over and above the 1 mill net I spent to add JAGs, if we add these type of players with 2 mill each first year hits, it costs another 3 mill.

    1 mill left, secondary to finish.

    This makes it clear to me that we need to redo Bradys deal and possibly Wilforks. I've seen reports that we could free up as much as 10mill that way, so it will be plenty to handle the secondary, and leave cushion for any cap hits I may have underestimated.

    WITHOUT redoing Brady and maybe Wilfork:
    We must move McCourty to corner and have a lineup of:
    CB- McCourty, Dennard, rookie, Dowling
    S- Gregory, Wilson, rookie

    If we do the restucture(s) we can afford to sign the best corner on the market, to go:
    CB1, Dennard, Rookie, Dowling
    McCourty, Gregory, Wilson, rookie

    or the best S on the market flipping CB1 and Mccourty.

    If its actually 10 mill, we may be able to afford BOTH giving us
    FA CB, McCourty, Dennard, Rookie
    FA S, Gregory, Wilson, Rookie

    That is the preferred solution.
  14. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    Very well done Andy. To me you got Wes back you got Talib or another CB1. Your improving the pass rush. Might be touch thin on the OL but I trust Scar.
  15. EwanSellars

    EwanSellars Rookie

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    Sign Desmond Bryant 3 years 4 mil per
    Sign Kenny Phillips 2 years 3 mil per
    Resign Edelman 2 years 1.25 mil per

    Draft
    1st round Johnathan Banks CB
    2nd Round Quinton Patton WR
    Trade down 3rd round pick for 4th and 5th
    trade 4th for a 5th and a 6th
    5th Connor Vernon WR
    5th Tyrann Mathieu CB
    6th Nick Kasa TE
    7th Cooper Taylor S
    7th Walter Stewart DE
  16. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    You might want to hold off on signing Bryant until you find out what he did that just got him arrested.
  17. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I forgot to mention it, but don't forget to leave enough money for needed in-season signings.
  18. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I like this approach. First we must have a roster. Then we can consider upgrades.

    A) I guess it's fine to consider JAG's to cost ONE MILLION per year, a net of $500K.

    B) I would include Edelman as a low-cost WR.

    C) I agree that Woodhead is a luxury.


  19. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    A) The jag cost is either a placeholder or an insignificant guy
    B) If he signs for that price. I'm not counting on him, because if he gets offered more elsewhere due to KR skills and versatility we can just plug someone else in.
    C) One it seems we cannot afford, unless its some kind of 3 year, 3.5mill deal.
  20. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    For me, the $2M or so DB will likely be Arrington, my placeholder.

    We're still within rounding of each other. I have simply named Edelman and Arrington as low-cost roster additions.

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