Welker "could" get traded to us instead?

[BelichickFan]

For fun I went back to the thread when Welker was tendered as a #2 pick.

The vote was 10 YES and 8 NO (but I didn't vote, so make that) : 9 NO on spending a #2 on him.

I know there was a poll over the weekend overwhelmingly for it but that was after we though an offer was forthcoming.

I'm surprised the YESes were over 50% but it was 10-9 before we knew the Patriots were interested. Hardly overwhelming.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

The Dolphins are not going to accept less than the #2 pick.
The Patriots are not going to offer more than the #2 pick.

If there is a trade to be made, it is because the Dolphins would rather have a player than a pick. It's possible a three-way trade is being discussed.

The market for Welker has been established. It is the #60 draft pick.

I'm sorry if someone has stated such. I read through the first two pages and my head started to hurt.

Reading is fundamental - so is aspirin.

 

[Rob0729]

This dude has it right, but no one is listening to his several posts here. The Fins might simply not want Welker back and they are making FA plans themselves and surely can see some benefit in resolving this matter immediately even if it comes at a lower price than a second rounder.

Just because the Pats may not sign Welker doesn't mean other teams may not try, so Welker's status could remain in limbo for months. The Fins see a team, in this case the Pats, interested in player that has shown an interest in leaving, that could be leaving the team at any time, that could keep the teams plans from moving forward, that could be an unhappy camper come August if retained, etc., and see an opportunity to clear up the situation while weakening a division opponent by definetly getting some kind of compensation from them.

Don't forget that the Fins could be put in a position where another team signs Welker to contract only a slightly out of line and then feel compelled to sign Welker. Picture a team offering a longer contract than the Fins would like to offer but at reasonable price, what then? It's easy to say the Fins would just take the 2nd rounder but how do we know the Fins FO wouldn't end up keeping Welker then regretting the move later because they felt forced to make a decision.

The posters in this thread who insist that the Fins wouldn't agree to a trade for less than a second rounder might want to listen to Belichickfan.

The thing is that it is known the Pats intend to sign Welker either way and the Pats are a division oponent. Why would the Dolphins make it easier for a division rivals to get a player they own the rights to?

I personally think that they want to keep Welker. They want him for the same reason we want him, his value as a receiver and on special teams. The Dolphins will now need to get potentially two players to replace him.

Looking at the age of their team especially at WR, I think they desperately wanted to keep him. Booker is going to be 31 next season. Chambers is going to be 29. Chambers is going into his contract year. Booker's base salary is going to be $4.3 million in 2008. So he is most likely gone. Hagan has yet to show he is a good #3. They probably need Welker as much or more than we do, but a second round pick might be more valuable. I doubt a third is though.

 

[spacecrime]

I never said the Dolphins wouldn't be open to players. I am saying they will not take less than second round value. It could be that they are negotiating player trades, but the Dolphins will not settle for less than a second round pick value.

Ah, sorry. I was confused by all your posts where you were screaming in CAPs that a trade couldn't make any sense.

 

[BelichickFan]

The Dolphins are not going to accept less than the #2 pick.

And you know this how ?

 

[BelichickFan]

The thing is that it is known the Pats intend to sign Welker either way and the Pats are a division oponent. Why would the Dolphins make it easier for a division rivals to get a player they own the rights to?

And maybe Pioli has called the Dolphins and told them that we don't intend to offer him a RFA contract. None of us know. But logic dictates it's the Patriots that are balking because we could EASILY make a contract the Dolphins wouldn't want to touch.

 

[cstjohn17]

If there is a trade to be made, it is because the Dolphins would rather have a player than a pick. It's possible a three-way trade is being discussed.

I will now poke a dog with a stick against by better judgement...

Start naming players and partners in the 3 way, I will start with some 100% made up non-sense.

Scenario 1) Trade for player
Patriots trade Nick Kaczur for Wes Welker

Scenario 2) 3 Way Trade
Patriots send pick 60 to Oakland, Oakland sends randy Moss to Miami

See that was easy, who is next...

 

[bb07]

Oakland gets:
Miami's 4th round pick

Miami gets:
New England's 1st round pick (#28 overall)

New England gets:
WR Wes Welker
WR Randy Moss



...figured I'd throw all the rumors together into one big three team trade. I'd think heavily about taking that one for the Patriots.

Oakland only get a 4th round? Then why don't they trade with us directly?

 

[Sorna]

And maybe Pioli has called the Dolphins and told them that we don't intend to offer him a RFA contract. None of us know. But logic dictates it's the Patriots that are balking because we could EASILY make a contract the Dolphins wouldn't want to touch.

If the Pats balk at the 2nd, then it is obvious he won't be leaving Miami. The Dolphins are not dumb enough to accpet less when they are primed for a 2nd rounder.

 

[patsgo]

just in from reiiss pats give up their 2 1's and a player to be named later for welker

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

And you know this how ?

His secret identity is Wayne Hiezanga-chusetts whatever. That guy!

 

[BelichickFan]

If the Pats balk at the 2nd, then it is obvious he won't be leaving Miami. The Dolphins are not dumb enough to accpet less when they are primed for a 2nd rounder.

Unless they aren't going to get a #2. Ah well, I'm just repeating myself now.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I will now poke a dog with a stick against by better judgement...

Start naming players and partners in the 3 way, I will start with some 100% made up non-sense.

Scenario 1) Trade for player
Patriots trade Nick Kaczur for Wes Welker

Scenario 2) 3 Way Trade
Patriots send pick 60 to Oakland, Oakland sends randy Moss to Miami

See that was easy, who is next...

If your waiting on me your backing up!

 

[primetime]

Oakland only get a 4th round? Then why don't they trade with us directly?

I didn't claim it made sense, I just figured I'd throw it out there.

 

[PATSNUTme]

Miami is not going to take anything lower then the value of a 2nd round pick. Miami holds all the cards, not the Pats.

I keep seeeing that. What is the "value' of a second round pick?

A young proven NFL player is worth more than a second round pick who could be a bust. That could be what is being offered by the Patriots.

 

[dryheat44]

And you know this how ?

Because he's their best receiver. They have actively been shopping McMichael also, FWIW.

So, no, I don't know for a fact. But I'd have to believe that the Dolphins aren't going to accept pick #93 for their best receiver who is signed for reasonable dollars. At that point, they'd probably take somebody else's 3rd rounder and not have to play him twice a year. Yes this is my assumption, although I am quite comfortable with it.

I did go back and read your posts, and must admit I didn't consider that option. However, in this case, I don't think it makes much sense for the Dolphins to accept a late 3rd round pick from a division rival for their best receiver and punt returner.

 

[dtbrks]

From the herald

Restricted free agent WR Wes Welker is wrapping up his meeting with Patriots officials at Gillette Stadium and his agent, former NFL defensive back Vann McElroy, is scheduled to talk with vice president of player personnel Scott Pioli this evening.

“Everything’s gone well,” said McElroy. “I think only time will tell.”

The NFL Network reported over the weekend that the Patriots are set to hand Welker a seven-year, $38.5 million offer sheet. Any such deal would likely be backloaded with Miami-specific provisions to guarantee some of the proposal’s “phony money”, making it hard for the Dolphins to match.

McElroy said that Welker has no further visits planned, and that the Dolphins have taken a “wait and see” approach to the negotiations. The agent also agreed that Bill Belichick’s close relationship with former Miami coach Nick Saban — who coached the 25-year-old Welker in two of the last three years — has been a catalyst in the process.

“I’m sure it helps,” said McElroy. “I think that Bill and Scott would trust Nick’s opinion of players, and I think that they like similar types of players.”

McElroy also left open the possibility that a trade could be in the works, though the Dolphins would be more likely to simply grab the Patriots’ assigned second-round pick, 60th overall in the April draft.

 

[BelichickFan]

Because he's their best receiver. They have actively been shopping McMichael also, FWIW.

I'm not sure Wes Welker is universally regarded as their best WR.

I guess we'll see . . . but I will be absolutely stunned if we trade more than a #2 for Wes Welker. If we trade less or exactly a #2 I won't be surprised. More ? It 'ain't happening.

 

[Rob0729]

And maybe Pioli has called the Dolphins and told them that we don't intend to offer him a RFA contract. None of us know. But logic dictates it's the Patriots that are balking because we could EASILY make a contract the Dolphins wouldn't want to touch.

Then why would the Dolphins make a trade now? They have a month and a half left of the the RFA period. Why take a third now? Why not call the Patriots bluff? If it is reported everywhere that the Pats intend to offer Welker a contract and Welker was here today, why would the Dolphins believe that the Pats have no intention of giving up a second round pick for Welker.

It just makes no sense to let Welker go for a third round pick especially to a divsion rival who is the best team in the division. Contrary to popular belief, there are intelligent people in other team's front office other than the Pats.

Stop looking at it as a Patriot fan. Look at it objectively. It is reported everywhere the Pats intend on offering Welker a contract for seven years and little under $39 million. Why would the Dolphins negotiate to take less value than a second rounder when the world is saying the Pats are ready to give up a second rounder for Welker. Mueller is a very good businessman. He would never do something so stupid.

If the Pats called Mueller told him they had no intention of signing Welker and giving up a second rounder, his response would be "Sorry, you can't have Welker then." Only a moron would go to the bargaining table and take less when it is well known the Pats want to sign him and were willing to give up a second. At the very worst, Mueller would call Pioli's bluff and let this stay on hold for about a week.

 

[Seymour93]

From the herald

Here's the link: www.bostonherald.com/blogs/patriots

I'm getting to like Saban more and more. He screws over a division rival and then recommends a few of their players to us.