Welker "could" get traded to us instead?

[BelichickFan]

All I can say is from fans of other teams I know, the reaction was : "a #2 for Wes Welker ? That's a lot". We've come to accept it as the price based on the RFA situation. If I'd have suggested a week ago trading a #3 for him I doubt everyone would have said "no way the Dolphins do that". I think a #2 is overpaying. And I think it's very possible no team will offer him a RFA contract at that price and the Dolphins would happily take a #3.

 

[Rob0729]

No they aren't.

They're guaranteed Wes Welker or a second round pick. How do you know they wouldn't prefer a third round pick to keeping him ?

They would probably prefer to keep him. He is too intrical part of their team to let go for a third rounder. If they are willing to trade him for a third rounder, I am sure there are plenty of teams outside the division who have higher third round picks who would trade for him for him.

I am about 99.999999% convinced they have no intention of letting the Patriots get Welker for less than a second rounder especially when they know they will offer him a contract anyway. The Pats already showed their hand on this one.

The Pats have to offer at least a second round pick value or more. They can't tell the Dolphins they better take a third or they will offer him a contract anyway and give up a second rounder. What type of leverage is that?

 

[dburgwin]

To BelichickFan,

Just wondering, why assume that The Dolphins don't want Welker anymore?

d

 

[spacecrime]

We don't have any leverage for the Dolphins to take less than a second. If the Dolphins are resigned to the fact they can't keep Welker, they can do nothing and take a second rounder or they can negotiate a trade and take less? Why in the world would the Dolphins take less than a second rounder for Welker?

Well, sure, if you are locked into the dolphins only getting a draft pick, it doesn't make sense. But I'll bet the Dolphins are less rigid in what they could ask for. They could take an offensive lineman instead of a pick, for instance.

How are the Dolphins going to give up less than Welker? Are they going to cut off his arm?

PEOPLE! THE DOLPHINS ARE GUARANTEED A SECOND ROUND PICK FOR WELKER!!!!!!!! They have absolutely no reason to negotiate a trade unless they are getting more value than the Pats' second round pick. None. Zero. Ziltch. Nada!

If I were the Dolphins, I would rather take Matt Light than a second round pick. If you were the Dolphins wouldn't you pull the trigger on that one?

Not that the patriots would offer Light, but why are you so insistent that the Dolphins couldn't do better than a second round pick in a trade? It doesn't make sense.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I don't see the incentive for a deal here.

Two clubs going for a win/win rather then a "gotcha."

Miami is rebuilding, their offense sucks and their D is older then the Pats' LB corps. The Pats want Welker, they can just take him using the poison pill and create bad blood, but that's not their way, or hasn't been in past trades.

As speculated above:
One of the Pats' young lineman, such as Wright or Santonio Thomas or Britt or O'Callaghan.
Maybe the Pats want that #10 and are working a deal that sends Samuel & #24 & 2008's #2 to Miami for Welker & #10 (this is an example, there is no attempt to be exact).
Maybe Miami doesn't think it can get one of the top tackles this year, or wants a second pick in the first to increase the odds.

There are a lot of scenerios where both clubs get something they want/need without resorting to a poison pill or trying to cut the other guy's throat. Division rivals or not, it sounds like BB/SP are playing for a win/win to get what they want without resorting to the kind of dirt that made last season so entertaining.

 

[Crowpointer]

All I can say is from fans of other teams I know, the reaction was : "a #2 for Wes Welker ? That's a lot". We've come to accept it as the price based on the RFA situation. If I'd have suggested a week ago trading a #3 for him I doubt everyone would have said "no way the Dolphins do that". I think a #2 is overpaying. And I think it's very possible no team will offer him a RFA contract at that price and the Dolphins would happily take a #3.

It would be like if someone really wanted Randall Gay (who we tendered a second round pick offer) I don't think many people here think he is worth a second round pick but would be open to somebody offering us a 3rd .

 

[salty]

So I guess its apparent we haven't actually signed him to an offer sheet. There would be no need to talk of a trade if we had. This makes me think that the Patriots must be trying to get Welker for less than a second rounder, because I really can't imagine them giving up more.

 

[BelichickFan]

This is something I got from KFFL (grrr) from a VERY respected Dolphins poster on the Patriots board :

"There were a number of rumours through February that the Fins were not interested in keeping him around (some talk suggested they weren't even going to tender him) and it was confirmed that of all the free agents Miami had this year, Welker was one of the few who did not get any kind of contact from the team regarding a contract to return. If they had tendered him higher then obviously this would have made teams think twice about signing him, and any lower then he would have gone for no compensation at all...."

Now put 2 and 2 together. They tender him at a #2 level to maintain control over him. Now, if what's above is true they may happily take a #3. Or two #4s. You guys need to get over this "Wes Welker is easily worth a #2". I don't think he is. And I doubt the Dolphins think he is. They maintained control by tendering him and will likely get something worthwhile out of doing so . . . it just may be less than a #2.

 

[Rob0729]

All I can say is from fans of other teams I know, the reaction was : "a #2 for Wes Welker ? That's a lot". We've come to accept it as the price based on the RFA situation. If I'd have suggested a week ago trading a #3 for him I doubt everyone would have said "no way the Dolphins do that". I think a #2 is overpaying. And I think it's very possible no team will offer him a RFA contract at that price and the Dolphins would happily take a #3.

Except the Patriots have already said they are going to offer him a deal and give up a second. That is like playing Texas Hold'em with your hold cards facing up so everyone can see them.

It has been reported everywhere that the Pats intend on offering Welker a contract that the Dolphins can't match. Why would the Dolphins take less than a second rounder if they know the Patriots are going to do the deal anyway? Randy Mueller is not a dumb man. You don't trade for less than you know you are going to get.

 

[tombonneau]

Horrible idea. We can EASILY make a contract that the Dolphins wouldn't match.

If they're talking trade, it's the Patriots wanting to pay less, not the Dolphins wanting more.

Exactly. If we give up a 1st in any package for Welker I will chew off my hand.

 

[BelichickFan]

It would be like if someone really wanted Randall Gay (who we tendered a second round pick offer) I don't think many people here think he is worth a second round pick but would be open to somebody offering us a 3rd .

Exactly, I bet most people here would take a #3 for Gay. Or even a #4 this year and next. Same thing.

 

[Jimke]

I don't think Welker would balk at a poison pill. The Pats may be

the only team willing to give up a #2 pick. His alternative might be

playing at 1.3 mil for the Dolphins or 3.6 million a year for the Pats

with a signing bonus. It is possible the league has stepped in to force a

trade.

 

[BelichickFan]

Except the Patriots have already said they are going to offer him a deal and give up a second.

I'll send you $20 if you can show me where the Patiots said they were going to do that.

 

[Sorna]

Miami is not going to take anything lower then the value of a 2nd round pick. Miami holds all the cards, not the Pats.

 

[Rob0729]

Well, sure, if you are locked into the dolphins only getting a draft pick, it doesn't make sense. But I'll bet the Dolphins are less rigid in what they could ask for. They could take an offensive lineman instead of a pick, for instance.


If I were the Dolphins, I would rather take Matt Light than a second round pick. If you were the Dolphins wouldn't you pull the trigger on that one?

Not that the patriots would offer Light, but why are you so insistent that the Dolphins couldn't do better than a second round pick in a trade? It doesn't make sense.

I never said the Dolphins wouldn't be open to players. I am saying they will not take less than second round value. It could be that they are negotiating player trades, but the Dolphins will not settle for less than a second round pick value.

 

[BelichickFan]

Miami is not going to take anything lower then the value of a 2nd round pick. Miami holds all the cards, not the Pats.

Because this is Torry Holt we're talking about, right ?

:bricks:

 

[patsgo]

This is something I got from KFFL (grrr) from a VERY respected Dolphins poster on the Patriots board :

"There were a number of rumours through February that the Fins were not interested in keeping him around (some talk suggested they weren't even going to tender him) and it was confirmed that of all the free agents Miami had this year, Welker was one of the few who did not get any kind of contact from the team regarding a contract to return. If they had tendered him higher then obviously this would have made teams think twice about signing him, and any lower then he would have gone for no compensation at all...."

Now put 2 and 2 together. They tender him at a #2 level to maintain control over him. Now, if what's above is true they may happily take a #3. Or two #4s. You guys need to get over this "Wes Welker is easily worth a #2". I don't think he is. And I doubt the Dolphins think he is. They maintained control by tendering him and will likely get something worthwhile out of doing so . . . it just may be less than a #2.

MOST OF THE PEOPLE IVE READ OR HEARD BELIEVE HES WORTH A SECOND, PLUS THEY KNOW THE PATRIOTS WANT HIM SO ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS WAIT FOR THE OFFER,

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

Two clubs going for a win/win rather then a "gotcha."

Miami is rebuilding, their offense sucks and their D is older then the Pats' LB corps. The Pats want Welker, they can just take him using the poison pill and create bad blood, but that's not their way, or hasn't been in past trades.

As speculated above:
One of the Pats' young lineman, such as Wright or Santonio Thomas or Britt or O'Callaghan.
Maybe the Pats want that #10 and are working a deal that sends Samuel & #24 & 2008's #2 to Miami for Welker & #10 (this is an example, there is no attempt to be exact).
Maybe Miami doesn't think it can get one of the top tackles this year, or wants a second pick in the first to increase the odds.

There are a lot of scenerios where both clubs get something they want/need without resorting to a poison pill or trying to cut the other guy's throat. Division rivals or not, it sounds like BB/SP are playing for a win/win to get what they want without resorting to the kind of dirt that made last season so entertaining.

I agree. The league could also be stepping in too.

My bet is we give them a lower draft pick and a player. If I was the Dolphins, I would want Kaczur, because he could play LT/RT.

 

[BelichickFan]

PLUS THEY KNOW THE PATRIOTS WANT HIM SO ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS WAIT FOR THE OFFER,

How do you know the Patriots would trade a #2 for Wes Welker. I'm not saying I know they wouldn't but it's a big stretch to think they we, or the Dolphins, think or know they would.

 

[patsgo]

Exactly, I bet most people here would take a #3 for Gay. Or even a #4 this year and next. Same thing.

SO WHAT YOUR SAYING IS IF THE PATS HEARD SOMEONE WANTED TO SIGN GAY THEY WOULD CALL THE TEAM UP AND SAY SIGN HIM WE ONLY VALUE HIM AS A 3?