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Welker "could" get traded to us instead?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by DefenseRules, Mar 5, 2007.

  1. DefenseRules

    DefenseRules Rookie

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    http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/
    Very interesting. Like Mike said, it will not surprise me if he's traded to us.
    I wonder what the Dolphins are up to here? If we sign him to the offer sheet and they don't match, they will get our second round pick. Do they want more?
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2007
  2. Ice Cold Bruschi

    Ice Cold Bruschi Rookie

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    which course of action would be most advantageous for us?
  3. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    They need O-line and some D-line help.

    Watch O'Callahan, Kazur or Mike Wright if there is a true trade.
  4. Fumblerooski

    Fumblerooski Rookie

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    Uh, maybe Chad Jackson? They tried to trade him for Moss before it came out he had a ACL injury.

    But, I could think of Hill, Childress, Mruckowski as players in lieu of the #2. Maybe a #4 and one of them?
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2007
  5. kas

    kas Rookie

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    IMO, talking trade can only help us. If they were talking about more than a second, the Pats could just use a poison pill and sign the deal. Therefore, I expect negotiation to be for something a little less, maybe our 3rd our something like that.

    That might be the reason for the leaks about contacting Stallworth and interest in Moss. The Pats want backup plans (or at least make it seem like they do) so that they can get a deal done without having to give up the second.
  6. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think this could be bad for us from a draft pick standpoint, but better for us by a salary cap standpoint. Why would the Dolphins trade Welker for less than a second? It wouldn't make sense. They could not match the offer and get a second for him and make the Pats overpay for him.

    My only guess would be if there was a trade, the Pats would have to package a second day pick in with the deal and they get the right to offer Welker a contract that is market value without worrying about the Dolphins matching.

    Personally, if we can save a decent amount of cap space, I would be willing to give a conditional sixth or seventh for the 2008 season which could be increased based on performance. I feel a second is a bit too high for Welker, but if we are going to do the deal I would rather have Welker with a cap friendly deal and lose a late second day pick for it than keep the pick and have Welker have an inflated, front-loaded contract.
  7. Kdo5

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    Keep Welker IMO.
  8. holyredeemer

    holyredeemer Rookie

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    And where did you pull this one from? I never heard that.
  9. Sean Pa Patriot

    Sean Pa Patriot Rookie

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    I dont get it, the Dolphins either could match it or not.. if they match it, they are on the hook for the contract...if they dont they get a second round pick... If we have to give more for this guy, its not worth it...
  10. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The compensation right now is a second rounder. If they trade, it will most likely be more than a second rounder. The Pats will probably have to add a second day pick (hopefully a conditional 2008) to that second round pick in a trade.

    If they work out a trade for less than a second round pick, then the Dolphins lose for no reason. If the Pats offer Welker a deal, the Dolphins can do nothing and get a second rounder for him. Why would they make a trade for less that only helps out the Pats and gives them a lesser draft pick.

    The only reason we are talking trade is to avoid cap issues with a deal to make it unattractive for the Dolphins to match. That means we have to give up more to get a deal done, not less.
  11. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    It would have to be more advantageous to us since Miami in tendering him and at that level really has no choice but to agree to a poison pill deal on an offer sheet or take that 2nd round pick. Maybe Pioli read Aqua's contention that there was no place for him on the Miami roster anyway since the have another player signed who plays the position as well, so we now feel we have leverage. :D Maybe we send them a player we tendered or maybe we send them our second but swap thirds. The possibilities are endless but they all would have to favor us.
  12. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Rumor from PatriotsPlanet that he's passing on as fact.
  13. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If we have to give Welker $12 million guaranteed to make it so the Dolphins don't match, there is big incentives for us to make a trade where we give up an extra pick to get Welker. Then we can offer him something like $6 million guaranteed.

    The only way there would be a trade is because the Pats are looking to not give Welker an overinflated contract. Why would the Dolphins want to trade him for less than a second rounder? They can do absolutely nothing and get a second rounder for him. Why take a third?
  14. Sorna

    Sorna Rookie

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    The Dolphins likely want one of the Patriots 1st round picks. IMO a trade would probably be something like this:

    Dolphins Get: 1st round pick
    Patriots Get: Wes Welker and a 4th round pick
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2007
  15. Bobs My Uncle

    Bobs My Uncle PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think the only reason why the Pats would entertain a trade is so that they don't have to include a poison pill element to the contract and have that issue follow them around with the league. That is if the rumoured contract totals are accurate.
  16. patsgo

    patsgo Rookie

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    IF THEY ALREADY TALKED NUMBERS WITH WELKER THAN THET CANT SHORT CHANGE HIM BECAUSE HE HAS THE RIGHT NOT TO SIGN, SO THEY WOULD GIVE UP PICKS FR A 1 YEAR, MAKES NO SENSE BECAUSE
  17. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We don't have any leverage for the Dolphins to take less than a second. If the Dolphins are resigned to the fact they can't keep Welker, they can do nothing and take a second rounder or they can negotiate a trade and take less? Why in the world would the Dolphins take less than a second rounder for Welker?
  18. Sean Pa Patriot

    Sean Pa Patriot Rookie

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    I would not want this at all.. I wont give that pick for Randy Moss, let alone Wes Welker...
  19. 40yrpatsfan

    40yrpatsfan PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If there's truth to all this, then it's likely something like the above. Instead of a low 2nd, we give them a player and a 4th or 5th.
  20. BelichickFan

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    I think you have it backwards.

    We could offer a big contract which they wouldn't match and give up a #2. Done.

    What's likely going on is the Patriots don't want to trade a #2. And probably no-one else does either. If someone else did the Dolphins would have no reason to trade him for less. More likely, if no-one wants to give up a #2 for him, including us, the Patriots want to negotiate a lower draft choice package that both teams are satisfied with.
  21. Don_the_patfan

    Don_the_patfan Rookie

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    Could it be Welker and another player for a 1st?? I hope not..
  22. BelichickFan

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    Horrible idea. We can EASILY make a contract that the Dolphins wouldn't match.

    If they're talking trade, it's the Patriots wanting to pay less, not the Dolphins wanting more.
  23. Patstopia

    Patstopia Rookie

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    "That's crazy talk" We can give a 2nd round pick, why would we trade OC, Wright, or even Kazur. Everyone is a surer thing than a draft choice. And to think they trade a 1st round selection (Jackson) to save a 2nd round pick is just plain dumb.
  24. salty

    salty Rookie

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    I'm pretty confused by this.

    Does it mean that the Patriots HAVEN'T signed Welker to an offer sheet?

    What is the movitation here for either team to work out a trade? I can't imagine the Pats will give up a first round pick for Welker, and I can't see why the Dolphins would trade him for less than a 2nd.

    This just doesn't add up.
  25. Mark Morse

    Mark Morse PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    What if it were a swap of positions in the draft, say our # 28 (which should land Miami a pretty good OLineman) for the Phins 2nd round pick (#40) which could give us any number of possibilities (Weedell, Gonzalez, Hunt, Bradley, Rice, Woodley). Another possibility is trading our Restricted Free Agent for theirs. Randall Gay has the same value as a RFA (2nd round pick). This would avoid all the rancor a poison pill would create.

    I wonder if the league stepped in on this and tried to broker a deal?

    sorry if this is the same as earlier posters
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2007
  26. BelichickFan

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    Because likely no-one is offering a #2 by offering a RFA contract. So then it's up to the Patriots and Dolphins to negotiate a package that both sides are happy with but it would be less that a #2 or we'd go the RFA offer route.
  27. PromisedLand

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    Once again BFan is right. (I was about to post the same thing but he beat me to it.)
  28. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Of course they can redo the deal. They can restructure it so that he isn't getting it as much against the cap this year and guarantee more in the future. I may have misspoke about the guarantee money, but word was the Pats are frontloading the contract to make it impossible for the Dolphins to match. If they restructure it after a trade, then they have more cap room to do other things.

    Again, the Dolphins are guaranteed a second round pick if they lose Welker. Why would they trade him for less to a division opponent?

    If you won the lottery and you were going to get a million dollars after taxes in two months, would sell the rights to someone else for $500k to get the money now?
  29. Crowpointer

    Crowpointer Rookie

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    I agree. The only reason to initiate a trade is to give up less not more.
  30. NE39

    NE39 Rookie

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    Maybe the Pats are offering a player and a lower pick in order to not give up the 2nd.

    Reche Caldwell played for Cameron in San Diego and knows his offense.

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