Peter King on Cassel's trade value

[Deus Irae]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

While I agree that is a good reason to not sign him to a tender, I still think doing so and giving up those two 1st rounders is the best deal for the Vikings. They get the best QB they can get, in his prime for the next 5 years or so. And they dont run the risk of losing him to another team who outbids you for him.

It really does come down to a few things:

1.) What do teams really think Cassel's worth?

2.) Do the Patriots prefer 2 picks this year to 1 pick this year and one next?

3.) Is there a team Cassel would sign the contract for w/out Patriots involvement?

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

3.) Is there a team Cassel would sign the contract for w/out Patriots involvement?

The Patriots would strenuously object, I think, if Cassel found a deal with a team willing to cough up two firsts.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

The Patriots would strenuously object, I think, if Cassel found a deal with a team willing to cough up two firsts.

Not quite where I was going, but well played.....

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

Not quite where I was going, but well played.....

Fair enough. But, seriously, because Cassel's not under contract with the Pats for 2009, why would he need to go through the Patriots first?

 

[Angry Man]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

Fair enough. But, seriously, because Cassel's not under contract with the Pats for 2009, why would he need to go through the Patriots first?

If he gets franchised then he would have to. We'll see what happens.

 

[DW Toys]

Hopefully there are some GMs out there that think this way, and you're probably right that there are. Some teams are desperate for a QB, and for probably half of the league, Cassel represents an upgrade.

But for the 400 yard games, no, I don't think many GMs will be overly-wooed by those games, and yes, I think they would take DVOA or metrics more seriously. The 400 yard games were almost a statistical anomaly and the fact that the last person to do it was Billy Volek says something. Cassel played really well in those games, of course, but GMs are going to look a little deeper at things.

Case in point. Dilhome right now is not a better QB than Cassel. He is also 34. Now the Peppers for Cassel trade makes sense.
DW Toys

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

If he gets franchised then he would have to. We'll see what happens.

No, he wouldn't. Extending the (non-exclusive) franchise tag automatically gives the player the right to negotiate offer sheets with other teams, without consultation with his current team.

 

[BelichickFan]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

This is the best case for sure, I guess it's possible if the Vikings, or whoever, expects a draft choice bidding war. I doubt it, but it's not impossible.

More interesting would be if the NJ Jets did it instead of Minnesota. That's the one way they could get him as we won't be trading him there.

 

[JoeShmoe]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

Honestly we ARE NOT going to get a first for MC. Please stop with it. A 2nd and a conditional 2010 is about the best we can hope for

Like it or not he is 'seen' around the league as a system QB with one decent half season behind him. Thats the truth and unless there's a bidding war thats the way most GM's will angle any deal. Cassel just doesnt have enough game time to warrant first round picks. Also go look at the boards - most Vikes dont see him as much better than Jackson or Booty

If we get a good 2nd and a conditional I would be pleased with that - providing TB is fit and well. Either that or a good player trade

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

This is the best case for sure, I guess it's possible if the Vikings, or whoever, expects a draft choice bidding war. I doubt it, but it's not impossible.

More interesting would be if the NJ Jets did it instead of Minnesota. That's the one way they could get him as we won't be trading him there.

The elephant in the corner is, of course, Brady's status. If Matt seriously thought that he could become the long term starting QB in Belichick's system with this ownership and team, I don't think he'd be in a hurry to give up his guaranteed $14 mill for 2009. He might just wait and see what happens.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

Honestly we ARE NOT going to get a first for MC. Please stop with it. A 2nd and a conditional 2010 is about the best we can hope for

Like it or not he is 'seen' around the league as a system QB with one decent half season behind him. Thats the truth and unless there's a bidding war thats the way most GM's will angle any deal. Cassel just doesnt have enough game time to warrant first round picks. Also go look at the boards - most Vikes dont see him as much better than Jackson or Booty

If we get a good 2nd and a conditional I would be pleased with that - providing TB is fit and well. Either that or a good player trade

And you have talked with all the 31 other NFL GMs to confirm how 'he is seen' around the league? Yeah right. Sounds more like your own opinion. Matt Cassel will get 1st round value in return. It might be a combo of picks, but a franchise QB these days is worth at least a 1st. If Jared Allen and Roy Williams can get a 1st and 3rd, Cassel can get back at least a 1st.

 

[JoeShmoe]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

And you have talked with all the 31 other NFL GMs to confirm how 'he is seen' around the league? Yeah right. Sounds more like your own opinion. Matt Cassel will get 1st round value in return. It might be a combo of picks, but a franchise QB these days is worth at least a 1st. If Jared Allen and Roy Williams can get a 1st and 3rd, Cassel can get back at least a 1st.

Fair play I dont know obviously but that's the fans general perception from reading general NFL forums. Their view is 'anyone can do that with Moss, Welker and Faulk'.

Dont get me wrong id love us to get a first but unless we get into a bidding war I dont think we get one - I think MC's good but he's not Allen, Williams class

 

[ScottieC]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

If the Pats franchise Cassel, what is to stop the Vikings from signing Cassel to an offer? If he signs, they need to give up two first round picks to the Pats. Their pick this year is the #22, and their potential 2010 pick is more then likely in the 20's as well. To me, it makes all the sense in the world for the Vikings to do this. They are a good QB away from being a top team in the NFC, if not the NFL. Their time is now and with as weak as the NFC North is, they can be on top of that division for years. A rookie will take a few years to develop and they might not have enough picks to trade up to get a top QB in the draft. And there are not really any other good FA QBs out there. Warner will more then likely stay at Arizona, and Garcia and Collins are not much better then Ferrotte. CasSsel gives them a good QB in his prime who has little wear and tear on him and has a much higher ceiling then other QBs. Not to mention the biggest plus out of it, you stay out of a bidding war with other teams and you keep him from another NFC rival.

So the question is if you were the Vikings GM, would you give up two 1st rounders (both in the 20's) and sign Cassel? I would. I would then go out and sign Housmanzadeh.

And as a Pats fan, would you be happy with that as compensation for Cassel? I most certainly would.

I'd rather Cassel not go to MN, I think with a QB they could be very very good - Despite the ownership and coaching. I know they are a NFC team, but still - I don't hope for good things for any team but ours.

KC or Detroit - Those are my two hopeful landing spots for Mr. Cassel.

 

[dhamz]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

Teams don't really like giving up first round picks. They definitely prefer not to do it 2 years in a row. Draft picks are gold in the NFL - it is how the successful teams have sustained their success.

The Vikings would have to give up their #1 for the 2nd and 3rd years in a row if they sign Cassel to an offer sheet. That is why they wouldn't.

 

[VJCPatriot]

As a side note here how much of this is all possible due to the O'Connell pick? Belichick can trade Cassel without knowing if Brady will be ready because he has O'Connell ... an unproven commodity but probably good enough to at least be a backup. O'Connell takes away any thought of Belichick having to trade Cassel just to pick another QB or to trade Cassel at some specific time in the future. A small thing but something that helps not hinders Belichick's trading of Cassel.

I think KO is at least 2-3 years away from starting. I wouldn't overrate KO's value at this point in time. He's all potential. Cassel has proven something, throwing for over 3,600 yards and 21 tds in his first full season. That's a heckuva promising start. And that is why he has significant trade value.

 

[Jimke]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

The only player on the Patriot's roster worth two #1 draft

picks is a healthy Tom Brady. With regard to Minnesota,

The Vikings and Bears believe that a good quarterback is not

essential to win the Super Bowl. I think the Patriots will settle

for a deal giving them a late first round pick or a couple of

second round draft picks.

In order to conclude the deal quickly to recoup their salary cap

space, the Patriots will need the cooperation of Cassel and his

agent. Cassel could wait until after the draft to sign the tender offer.

 

[stinkypete]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

I don't think it would happen because Minnesota already gave up a 1st and two 3rds to get Jared Allen. If Cassel costs, say, a first and a 3rd, then we're talking about a team giving up 5 top 100 picks in two years. That kind of draft management is going to kill a team's depth in the long run.

 

[JoeShmoe]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

The other thing here is that teams will see Cassel as carrying a level of risk, is he a product of the system , what would he be like without Moss, Welker etc

Hence why he's a 2nd rounder. I hear all this talk of Peppers but to do a trade we'd have to give up more than MC, probably a 3rd as well

 

[patchick]

I think here in NE were hopecasting about Cassel going for a first. Around the rest of the league he had one good half of a season and is a system QB.

The thing is, Cassel isn't just some guy who had some good games. He's the ideal athlete for the position: 6'4" 230, strong arm, terrific all-around athleticism. And if he had been a rookie, he would have given Ryan some real competition for ROY -- they put up the same numbers, but Cassel did it with steady improvement while Ryan was up and down all year.

Or how about this comparison: imagine for a moment that Cassel's one and only year as a starter -- with a fabulous supporting cast -- was in college. So he's entering the draft on the strength of that one season and his innate physical talents. In other words, he's Mark Sanchez. Sanchez is being projected as a top-10 pick in every ranking I've seen.

For the teams picking 18, 19, 20 & 22 this year, what rookie could be reasonably expected to be more valuable than Cassel?

 

[lostjumper]

Re: Why wouldnt the Vikings sign Cassel to an offer sheet if francised?

With regard to Minnesota,

The Vikings and Bears believe that a good quarterback is not

essential to win the Super Bowl.

Really? And they know this because they've been able to win the superbowl with an average QB, right?

Oh wait, the vikings and bears have not been able to win the big games recently because they DON'T have a good qb. I know a couple of bears fans. All they ever talk about is dumping grossman and orton and just wishing for 1 good QB.