How many picks did Steve Belichick make?

[Ivan]

In this case, I think it's reasonable to guess that the Bucs were a pretty strong candidate to take Harmon. They need depth at safety behind Goldson and Barron, and with the ludicrous contracts that they just gave to Goldson and Revis, they're probably looking to do it on the cheap. If Harmon really is a diamond in the rough, then obviously Schiano would already know that, so it sort of makes sense that Belichick may have felt the need to 'reach' to ensure that he got him. I'm still not a fan of the pick, on the face of it, but the presence of Schiano in the NFL does make it a bit more defensible IMO.

I think this is right on the money and that it holds true for many of the picks they make that we consider "reaches," when in fact the Patriots have them rated in that general area and gauge that there are other teams that have the same kind of rating on them and feel the need to take them before someone else does. I also think that this kind of approach probably led the steelers to grab Markus Wheaton when they did, guessing that the Patriots were probably looking at him seriously and that they couldn't take the chance of leaving him there. Basically i think this game goes on between the teams during every draft and teams leave and take players throughout every draft in some part due to their projections of what they believe other teams are going to do.

 

[neuronet]

I guess the self-hating Pats fan is fast becoming a new class of fan here. Everyone is better and smarter than we are.

New? 10char

 

[BradyFTW!]

I think this is right on the money and that it holds true for many of the picks they make that we consider "reaches," when in fact the Patriots have them rated in that general area and gauge that there are other teams that have the same kind of rating on them and feel the need to take them before someone else does. I also think that this kind of approach probably led the steelers to grab Markus Wheaton when they did, guessing that the Patriots were probably looking at him seriously and that they couldn't take the chance of leaving him there. Basically i think this game goes on between the teams during every draft and teams leave and take players throughout every draft in some part due to their projections of what they believe other teams are going to do.

I was hoping that the Pats would draft Wheaton, and I'm confident that they would have if he'd been available at #91. Which presumably would have meant picking Harmon over Boyce at #102.

 

[borg]

Isn't it a league rule you can't draft a player a scout has blown bongs with? Pretty sure!!

 

[BradyBranch39]

she said these Rutgers kids were all recruited and played for Tampa Bay Coach Schiano. Yet Schiano won't touch any of them in the Draft.

Yeah, because BB knows that if he doesn't take them a round early, Schiano will before BB picks again.

 

[Clonamery]

Isn't it a league rule you can't draft a player a scout has blown bongs with? Pretty sure!!

Yeah, well, there's also a rule about being a doosh every time you post here but that hasn't stopped anyone, right?

 

[Coach42]

I love the "day after". If someone had told us a week before the draft that the pats would come away with 2 very athletic outside pass rushers and two fast receivers (one who was 6'2") I think this board would have erupted in joy. Instead, today we've go people hypothesizing that one of the most serious men in football decided to turn over one if the most important events in team molding this year to his son so he could draft some friends. Yowza.

 

[chasa]

we could have drafted adrian peterson and clay mathews and people would be upset that we missed on richard sherman.

Bunch of spoiled brats complaining about how bad a gm BB is, and yet every year is a potential superbowl.

 

[Joker]

Joker, your signature rules. Fact.

Bill Belichick > internet nobodies.

I must confess...that is NOT my work...that is the work of Zeus...I just thought he said it far better than I ever could. I think this is the first sig I ever used on Patsfans and is aimed directly at the six degrees of hallucination known as Moron2Idiot.

 

[Triumph]

well, i've been avoiding this discourse for a while. i've followed the pats drafts since we drafted hannah, sam bam and stingley in the first rd of '73. loved the first two picks but didn't know stingley that well at the time. i've never been a big fan of belicheck's drafts. i remember eric turner at 2, tommy vardell at 9 and craig powell at 30 ,or so, while in cleveland. nothing great. he's definitely improved upon those days. what i think people might be missing now is that because he's the coach/major domo/pseudo gm is that the picks may not be up to mel kiper's snuff but these are the guys bb wants to coach.i think it just boils down to that.

Well said.

BBs Cleveland drafts were pretty bad, but the Ravens had 2 1st round picks (sound familiar?) after the Browns moved and 1 pick was used to select Ray Lewis.

If BB is right about last years draft and this draft, we may be finally celebrating number 4 this February. The Pats are due to hit on a WR.

 

[Se7eN]

OT: What does JAG stand for? Just another guy?

 

[Joker]

OT: What does JAG stand for? Just another guy?

Jerks Are Green...

 

[fair catch fryar]

Jerks Are Green...

Good one...now I have to clean the coffee stain off my pants. Thanks a lot.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Although the OP is a bit off I do wonder about Steve's capabilities and potential sometimes. If there's anyone I'd feel okay with taking over for BB down the road I'd think someone who literally has his genes and grew up learning from him would be a solid candidate. But I honestly have no clue about Steve's football IQ or what the plans are for him. Could be merely a figurehead for all I know.

 

[serifyn]

Have you honestly forgotten that Bill does this every year?

Sebastian Vollmer? Who the hell is that, he wasn't even invited to the combine!

Devin Mccourty? Why is Bill drafting a special teams player in the first round? I don't care how many downs he can play!

Stevan Ridley? how come we didn't draft Mark Ingram!? He was right there!!


Belichick's batting average is better than most, of course he has misses, everyone does, but the fact that Bill was so bullish on Harmon makes me think he really does think he got great value where he selected him.

I'm actually really excited about this crop, the more i hear about them, the more hungry i get for football to return.

 

[DaBruinz]

O.K. now here comes the tag line. "The Pats Draft differently". Yet every year Ted Thompson and Ozzie kick Bill's ass in the Draft room.
DW Toys

When the Harmon pick was made Patsfans.com wasn't happy fess up guys. Harmon was not good value where we pick him also Tavon Wilson last year. Also Ted Thompson and Ozzie kick Bill's ass in the Draft room also that guy in Pittsburgh. How many of us felt a little sick to the stomach when Pittsburgh got WR Markus Wheaton? I did again I liked the picks except Harmon where they took him.

It always amazes me when people start pointing to other teams supposedly "kicking Belichick's ass" in the Draft room because 9 times out of 10, people don't know what they are talkiing about.

For instance:

Green Bay - Their 2007 draft was just as bad as the Pats. In 2010 and 2011, they took 1st round tackles. Brian Bulaga in 2010 and Sherrod in 2011. Bulaga has missed 9 games in the last 2 seasons. Sherrod has played in a total of 5 games over 2 seasons. They've been so "successful" drafting RBs they added Eddie Lacy in the 2rd round this year after spending a 3rd in 2011, a 6th in 2010, and a 5th in 2009. 6 of 9 of their 2008 draft are gone.

Baltimore - Ozzie uses a similar system to Bill. He's had his misses. Jah Reid comes to mind. Jimmy Smith is another one. 1st round pick get's demoted to where he's not even seeing time as the Nickel back because others have passed him. Tavares Gooden. Oneil Cousins. Even Terrence Cody hasn't really been a success. Now, having said all that, the last few drafts of Ozzie's have been pretty damn good. But, then, so have the Pats, much to the chagrin of people on here.

Pittsburgh - People talk about their "success" with receivers. Their record is actually worse than Bill's with the Pats. I showed this in the Prospect thread. The reason for the PERCEPTION was because people ignored half the WR picks that the Steelers made. Including guys like Limas Sweed.

Then you have the fact that 4 of 9 of their prospects from the 2012 draft have already been cut. Their 2nd round pick from the 2011 draft is already gone. 5 of 10 from their 2010 are gone. Jason Worilds has underwhelmed. They have 1 player from their 2009 draft remaining...

 

[DW Toys]

It always amazes me when people start pointing to other teams supposedly "kicking Belichick's ass" in the Draft room because 9 times out of 10, people don't know what they are talkiing about.

For instance:

Green Bay - Their 2007 draft was just as bad as the Pats. In 2010 and 2011, they took 1st round tackles. Brian Bulaga in 2010 and Sherrod in 2011. Bulaga has missed 9 games in the last 2 seasons. Sherrod has played in a total of 5 games over 2 seasons. They've been so "successful" drafting RBs they added Eddie Lacy in the 2rd round this year after spending a 3rd in 2011, a 6th in 2010, and a 5th in 2009. 6 of 9 of their 2008 draft are gone.

Baltimore - Ozzie uses a similar system to Bill. He's had his misses. Jah Reid comes to mind. Jimmy Smith is another one. 1st round pick get's demoted to where he's not even seeing time as the Nickel back because others have passed him. Tavares Gooden. Oneil Cousins. Even Terrence Cody hasn't really been a success. Now, having said all that, the last few drafts of Ozzie's have been pretty damn good. But, then, so have the Pats, much to the chagrin of people on here.

Pittsburgh - People talk about their "success" with receivers. Their record is actually worse than Bill's with the Pats. I showed this in the Prospect thread. The reason for the PERCEPTION was because people ignored half the WR picks that the Steelers made. Including guys like Limas Sweed.

Then you have the fact that 4 of 9 of their prospects from the 2012 draft have already been cut. Their 2nd round pick from the 2011 draft is already gone. 5 of 10 from their 2010 are gone. Jason Worilds has underwhelmed. They have 1 player from their 2009 draft remaining...

Reasonable post sir. Some people think BB is better at FA and Trades as his best eye for talent. Some say his Drafting is mediocre although every pick is a crap shoot. I am one of those who see like the former, and history for such is evident.

It might not be BB in the Draft War Room as much as his scouts. We all can attest the group of scouts lack in WR and DB talent evaluation. Maybe this year is a turn around. They have no choice but to do so. I like Dobson and Boyce.

Look, I have no real problem with this Draft class other than the kid who was shocked himself. This was actually a weak Draft class and I thought so day one. You could get notable talent separation between rounds. It was a mass of similar talent in the middle.

My issue is they took Tavon Wilson high last year. Everyone bowed to BB on that pick as maybe brilliant some day. It is only one year in his three year venue so it is early, but right now it says JAG stamped on his forehead. So much so BB picked another question mark to already compete for this same exact roster spot. Color me mystified! Or to all who naysay this, did we Draft a backup Safety, special Teams guy in round three?!!! If that is the case then this is without doubt a booboo pick.

Bill is too smart. Some scout or coach filibustered him to do this one (Steve?). That was my initial thought.
DW Toys

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Although the OP is a bit off I do wonder about Steve's capabilities and potential sometimes. If there's anyone I'd feel okay with taking over for BB down the road I'd think someone who literally has his genes and grew up learning from him would be a solid candidate. But I honestly have no clue about Steve's football IQ or what the plans are for him. Could be merely a figurehead for all I know.

Yes because elevating the offspring of royalty has always worked so well

 

[DarrylS]

It always amazes me when people start pointing to other teams supposedly "kicking Belichick's ass" in the Draft room because 9 times out of 10, people don't know what they are talkiing about.

For instance:

Green Bay - Their 2007 draft was just as bad as the Pats. In 2010 and 2011, they took 1st round tackles. Brian Bulaga in 2010 and Sherrod in 2011. Bulaga has missed 9 games in the last 2 seasons. Sherrod has played in a total of 5 games over 2 seasons. They've been so "successful" drafting RBs they added Eddie Lacy in the 2rd round this year after spending a 3rd in 2011, a 6th in 2010, and a 5th in 2009. 6 of 9 of their 2008 draft are gone.

Baltimore - Ozzie uses a similar system to Bill. He's had his misses. Jah Reid comes to mind. Jimmy Smith is another one. 1st round pick get's demoted to where he's not even seeing time as the Nickel back because others have passed him. Tavares Gooden. Oneil Cousins. Even Terrence Cody hasn't really been a success. Now, having said all that, the last few drafts of Ozzie's have been pretty damn good. But, then, so have the Pats, much to the chagrin of people on here.

Pittsburgh - People talk about their "success" with receivers. Their record is actually worse than Bill's with the Pats. I showed this in the Prospect thread. The reason for the PERCEPTION was because people ignored half the WR picks that the Steelers made. Including guys like Limas Sweed.

Then you have the fact that 4 of 9 of their prospects from the 2012 draft have already been cut. Their 2nd round pick from the 2011 draft is already gone. 5 of 10 from their 2010 are gone. Jason Worilds has underwhelmed. They have 1 player from their 2009 draft remaining...

I need to update this for 2012, but here is a brief synopsis of some other teams.. the draft is a crapshoot, and folks should adapt an NFL vision and get out of the tunnel.

Steelers....

2011.. Marcus Gilbert..OT currently starts for the Steelers
2010.. Jason Worilds.. playing ok, but seems to be a work in progress
2009.. no second round pick
2008.. Limus Sweed... has been waived
2007.. Lamar Woodley.. great pick
2006.. no second round pick

Miami's vaunted 2nd round picks..

2011...Daniel Thomas RB.. looks like a good pick
2010..Koa Missa. LB.. work in progress
2009..Pat White. QB... not in the game
2008..Phillip Merling.. not in the game
Chad Henne..
2007.. John Beck. QB...traded to the Redskins
Samson Satele.. C.. good pick
2006..no pick

The Jets absolutely wonderful 2nd round picks..

2011... no second round pick
2010.. Vladimir DuCasse
2009.. Shonn Greene
2008 .. no second round pick
2007.. David Harris
2006.. Kellen Clemens
2005... Mike Nugent
Justin Miller..


The Green Bay Packers recent 2ndround picks..

2011.. Randall Cobb
2010.. Mike Neal.. oft injuried
2009.. no second round pick
2008..Brian Brohm.. no longer in the NFL
Patrick lee.. marginal player
2007..Brandon Jackson.. marginal player now with the Browns.
2006...Darren Colledge..starting O lineman now with the Cardinals
Greg Jennings
2005..Nick Collins.. a pro bowler on IR
Terrence Murphy retired from the NFL..

 

[DaBruinz]

Reasonable post sir. Some people think BB is better at FA and Trades as his best eye for talent. Some say his Drafting is mediocre although every pick is a crap shoot. I am one of those who see like the former, and history for such is evident.

It might not be BB in the Draft War Room as much as his scouts. We all can attest the group of scouts lack in WR and DB talent evaluation. Maybe this year is a turn around. They have no choice but to do so. I like Dobson and Boyce.

There has been a turnover in the scouts. There have been some significant changes since 2007. Some left with Dimitroff. Others left with Pioli. We here very little about what goes on amongst the actually scouts. There hasn't exactly been a ton of focus on WR despite what the pundits might say. 9 picks over 11 years isn't much. Not when you've got 24 amongst the DBs over that same period of time.

Look, I have no real problem with this Draft class other than the kid who was shocked himself. This was actually a weak Draft class and I thought so day one. You could get notable talent separation between rounds. It was a mass of similar talent in the middle.

My issue is they took Tavon Wilson high last year. Everyone bowed to BB on that pick as maybe brilliant some day. It is only one year in his three year venue so it is early, but right now it says JAG stamped on his forehead. So much so BB picked another question mark to already compete for this same exact roster spot. Color me mystified! Or to all who naysay this, did we Draft a backup Safety, special Teams guy in round three?!!! If that is the case then this is without doubt a booboo pick.

Bill is too smart. Some scout or coach filibustered him to do this one (Steve?). That was my initial thought.
DW Toys

Only the people who hold the Mel Kipers, Mike Mayocks, NFLDraftscout.coms as the be all end all to scouting claim that Wilson was taken too high. The idea that Wilson has "JAG" stamped on his forehead is ludicrous. As is the thought that,some how, Steve Belichick (BB's son) influenced his father to make the Rutgers picks and it wasn't the fact that Greg Schiano coached those guys.

It's not hard to believe that you are "mystified". Your concepts of what each round of the draft should produce are lacking. If a 3rd round pick turns out to be a Star Special Teamer and a Rotational Safety that doesn't start, I'd say that's a win. But, that's just me.