Wickersham book discussion

[50-yard-line]

Yea

Yea, unfortunately his book is hitting the NY Times Top 10 Best Sellers list.

Which list?

And also, that list is a joke and has become more of a joke since it's all about pre-orders at this point.

 

[50-yard-line]

A stacked roster so good they had not won a playoff game in 18 years. Did you just question why a QB who has 7 superbowls didnt win one every year? lol

Please stop with this idiocy.

Jameis Winston threw for 5100 yards and 33 TDs the year before Brady got there. Only Winston's continual brain farting - 30 picks - held that team back and everyone knew it.

Brady went to THAT team, where a QB had thrown for 5100 yards the previous year, with TWO 1,000+-yard A-list receivers, and added Gronkowski, AB, Fournette, and Suh.

Before last season started, Tampa was placed #5 in the Power Rankings, because it was pretty clear to everyone watching that all they needed to go to the next level was someone who wouldn't make stupid throws (like Winston did the other day, and got away with it).

Brady did a fantastic job there, both in keeping the team inspired, helping with discipline, and playing smart, but the nonsense you're spouting is just that. Tampa was superbly positioned and talented, added a ton of hungry veteran talent, and got the right breaks to get to the promised land.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Before Salary Cap
BB as GM had to field a team where best players left after winning rings to "get paid"
Walsh also had Montanna

...and Bill Walsh as GM of the 49ers was awful.

 

[venecol]

Which list?

And also, that list is a joke and has become more of a joke since it's all about pre-orders at this point.

Children's books?

 

[50-yard-line]

Children's books?

Should be fiction, right?

 

[203Pat]

Please stop with this idiocy.

Jameis Winston threw for 5100 yards and 33 TDs the year before Brady got there. Only Winston's continual brain farting - 30 picks - held that team back and everyone knew it.

Brady went to THAT team, where a QB had thrown for 5100 yards the previous year, with TWO 1,000+-yard A-list receivers, and added Gronkowski, AB, Fournette, and Suh.

Before last season started, Tampa was placed #5 in the Power Rankings, because it was pretty clear to everyone watching that all they needed to go to the next level was someone who wouldn't make stupid throws (like Winston did the other day, and got away with it).

Brady did a fantastic job there, both in keeping the team inspired, helping with discipline, and playing smart, but the nonsense you're spouting is just that. Tampa was superbly positioned and talented, added a ton of hungry veteran talent, and got the right breaks to get to the promised land.

I love this revisionist history that Tampa was some a great team and Brady put them over the top. Tampa was bad to mediocre and had Brady not showed up would have likely gone into a full rebuild. They had some talented individual players but they were losers. It is in the DNA down there. Brady changed that. There were a dozen stories throughout their playoff run last year talking about how Brady gave them the belief they could win. You also act like Gronk, AB, and Fournette (who was/is somewhat of a bust and was available for anyone to sign), and Suh just signed there for the weather. Gronk and AB signed there exclusively because of Tom Brady. Now Gronk, who half the board hates and called washed up last year, is making half of what our TEs are with significantly better production. AB has said about 20 times now that it is Brady who is helping him keep his **** together and it was Brady who brought him there after that fat blowhard HC said it wasn't gonna happen.

Every thing that happened in Tampa last year was because of Tom Brady.

 

[venecol]

Should be fiction, right?

I don't know. I read that all three refused to be interviewed for this book but he based it on "quotes" from all three from the previous decades. I doubt he writes a book like this w/o having solid documentation and backup to support it, given he's going up against powerful men and icons.

A good journalist can get people to open up. He can get a "quote" about an incident from one party and then use that in private to get a tidbit from another party by using the "he said such and such, what's your recollection?" You then add context and confirmation by using 2nd and 3rd parties and you put it all together. It's a long painstaking process but at the end you just never know.

I'll say this, the marketing of this book is perfect with the release of these leaks prior to this historic game and the book itself right after it. I just wonder how much interest there will be outside the fan base market but everyone is talking about it.

 

[203Pat]

...and Bill Walsh as GM of the 49ers was awful.

He did draft 4 hall of famers (Montana, Lott, Haley, and Rice) as well as some very good players in Dwight Clark, Roger Craig, Jon Taylor, Tom Rathman, Steve Wallace, Don Griffin, Bill Romanoski, and Michael Carter. He also set the franchise up for the future by having the foresight to trade for another hall of famer, Steve Young. I wouldn't call that awful.

 

[XLIX]

Brady did a fantastic job there, both in keeping the team inspired, helping with discipline, and playing smart, but the nonsense you're spouting is just that. Tampa was superbly positioned and talented, added a ton of hungry veteran talent, and got the right breaks to get to the promised land.

It is amazing - absolutely amazing - that Tim Brady just always seems to get "the right breaks" isn't it...? The guy has 7 rings and people still think it is just a coincidence....

To quote you: Please stop with this idiocy.

 

[Steve102]

Please stop with this idiocy.

Jameis Winston threw for 5100 yards and 33 TDs the year before Brady got there. Only Winston's continual brain farting - 30 picks - held that team back and everyone knew it.

Brady went to THAT team, where a QB had thrown for 5100 yards the previous year, with TWO 1,000+-yard A-list receivers, and added Gronkowski, AB, Fournette, and Suh.

Before last season started, Tampa was placed #5 in the Power Rankings, because it was pretty clear to everyone watching that all they needed to go to the next level was someone who wouldn't make stupid throws (like Winston did the other day, and got away with it).

Brady did a fantastic job there, both in keeping the team inspired, helping with discipline, and playing smart, but the nonsense you're spouting is just that. Tampa was superbly positioned and talented, added a ton of hungry veteran talent, and got the right breaks to get to the promised land.

I love this revisionist history that Tampa was some a great team and Brady put them over the top. Tampa was bad to mediocre and had Brady not showed up would have likely gone into a full rebuild. They had some talented individual players but they were losers. It is in the DNA down there. Brady changed that. There were a dozen stories throughout their playoff run last year talking about how Brady gave them the belief they could win. You also act like Gronk, AB, and Fournette (who was/is somewhat of a bust and was available for anyone to sign), and Suh just signed there for the weather. Gronk and AB signed there exclusively because of Tom Brady. Now Gronk, who half the board hates and called washed up last year, is making half of what our TEs are with significantly better production. AB has said about 20 times now that it is Brady who is helping him keep his **** together and it was Brady who brought him there after that fat blowhard HC said it wasn't gonna happen.

Every thing that happened in Tampa last year was because of Tom Brady.

You guys are both right, yanno. Brady did go to a team that previously had a 5100 yard passer. Gronk and AB did join Tampa because of Brady. Brady did do a great job of keeping the ship going in the right direction. Tampa needed a guy like Brady to come in and fix the QB situation. It's not revisionist history, Tampa was a team on the upswing.

 

[50-yard-line]

It is amazing - absolutely amazing - that Tim Brady just always seems to get "the right breaks" isn't it...? The guy has 7 rings and people still think it is just a coincidence....

To quote you: Please stop with this idiocy.

Getting to and winning almost every Superbowl requires the right breaks. That's not an insult except to people who think Brady is (literally) God.

Adam's kick in the snow? The Refs calling the tuck play? Coin flip in the 2018 AFCCG? The Butler pick (3.1% chance)?

And it works both ways, of course: the '08 loss of Brady, the helmet catch, Gronk playing hurt in 11.

"Tim" Brady doesn't ALWAYS get the right breaks, does he?

 

[50-yard-line]

You guys are both right, yanno. Brady did go to a team that previously had a 5100 yard passer. Gronk and AB did join Tampa because of Brady. Brady did do a great job of keeping the ship going in the right direction. Tampa needed a guy like Brady to come in and fix the QB situation. It's not revisionist history, Tampa was a team on the upswing.

Fanboys be fanboys.

The idea that Tampa was some weak team was absurd. Brady and the other adds completed the picture. And I would never deny that Brady brought in the winning attitude - I even said that, but to give anyone BUT Brady any credit for anything just sets them off.

 

[203Pat]

You guys are both right, yanno. Brady did go to a team that previously had a 5100 yard passer. Gronk and AB did join Tampa because of Brady. Brady did do a great job of keeping the ship going in the right direction. Tampa needed a guy like Brady to come in and fix the QB situation. It's not revisionist history, Tampa was a team on the upswing.

I don’t think think they were on an upswing. Either way Winston was gone and unless they traded up in the 2020 draft they were out of range for any of the top QB's. Maybe they make a run at Phillip Rivers a little harder or maybe they were the ones who picked Cam off the scrap heap but either way they likely miss the playoffs and the Arians and the GM are probably canned and the whole thing gets blown up. They cycled through head coaches every 2-4 years since Gruden left all while continually whiffing on QB's. That pattern would have kept going had Brady not shown up.

Fanboys be fanboys.

The idea that Tampa was some weak team was absurd. Brady and the other adds completed the picture. And I would never deny that Brady brought in the winning attitude - I even said that, but to give anyone BUT Brady any credit for anything just sets them off.

Lol yes I am a "fanboy" because I don't think Tampa was some juggernaut waiting on the final piece. No one but Brady deserves credit for Tampa's super bowl win last year. You can argue Arians and the GM deserve credit for knowing enough to get out of the way and let Brady run the show if you want but it is what it is. Brady singlehandedly lured in two big contributors down the stretch in Gronk and AB and won three road playoff games, two of them with future first ballot hall of famers.

 

[venecol]

Getting to and winning almost every Superbowl requires the right breaks. That's not an insult except to people who think Brady is (literally) God.

Adam's kick in the snow? The Refs calling the tuck play? Coin flip in the 2018 AFCCG? The Butler pick (3.1% chance)?

And it works both ways, of course: the '08 loss of Brady, the helmet catch, Gronk playing hurt in 11.

"Tim" Brady doesn't ALWAYS get the right breaks, does he?

Brady's the LOAT!

 

[203Pat]

Brady's the LOAT!

View attachment 36151

Apparently he's lucky that the superstar squad down in Tampa was just waiting for him to hop on their coat tails so they could drag him to the super bowl.

 

[venecol]

You guys are both right, yanno. Brady did go to a team that previously had a 5100 yard passer. Gronk and AB did join Tampa because of Brady. Brady did do a great job of keeping the ship going in the right direction. Tampa needed a guy like Brady to come in and fix the QB situation. It's not revisionist history, Tampa was a team on the upswing.

The notion by many on this forum (not you) that any good QB would've won a SB with that Bucs team is odd.

I wonder how many good QBs switched teams after playing for one team and went on to win a SB their first year? @Ice_Ice_Brady ?

 

[DropKickFlutie]

He did draft 4 hall of famers (Montana, Lott, Haley, and Rice) as well as some very good players in Dwight Clark, Roger Craig, Jon Taylor, Tom Rathman, Steve Wallace, Don Griffin, Bill Romanoski, and Michael Carter. He also set the franchise up for the future by having the foresight to trade for another hall of famer, Steve Young. I wouldn't call that awful.

I love Walsh. But Did he have to recreate the team about 8 different times due to a brutal cap? Apples to oranges.

.

 

[203Pat]

I love Walsh. But Did he have to recreate the team about 8 different times due to a brutal cap? Apples to oranges.

I am not saying they're the same thing. I'm just saying Walsh was far from awful as a GM and at least when he left the team was set up for success.

 

[italian pat patriot]

Hightower came back for $12 million. Wouldn't be surprised if this is the last we see of him and while he has been a great player here I think it is time. Bill needs to transition the linebacking core to smaller faster guys and not these big lumbering guys. We have added some speed on the edges with Judon and Uche but the middle is still slow as molasses.

I had hopes in Jennings...

 

[Steve102]

I don’t think think they were on an upswing. Either way Winston was gone and unless they traded up in the 2020 draft they were out of range for any of the top QB's. Maybe they make a run at Phillip Rivers a little harder or maybe they were the ones who picked Cam off the scrap heap but either way they likely miss the playoffs and the Arians and the GM are probably canned and the whole thing gets blown up. They cycled through head coaches every 2-4 years since Gruden left all while continually whiffing on QB's. That pattern would have kept going had Brady not shown up.


Lol yes I am a "fanboy" because I don't think Tampa was some juggernaut waiting on the final piece. No one but Brady deserves credit for Tampa's super bowl win last year. You can argue Arians and the GM deserve credit for knowing enough to get out of the way and let Brady run the show if you want but it is what it is. Brady singlehandedly lured in two big contributors down the stretch in Gronk and AB and won three road playoff games, two of them with future first ballot hall of famers.

I think you are correct that those things would have happened if Brady didn't come. Take those 30 turnovers away and add Rivers and they become a playoff team without adding Gronk, AB and Fournette. Brady was the difference, but they still had a good defense and killer WRs. You don't throw for 5100 yards without talent. Brady 100% brought in a winning atmosphere. I think you are glossing over the fact that they had very good talent because you want it all credit to be given to Brady. Brady is the difference AND they had talent.