We haven't done anything but get worse

[Joker]

It's March 27, 2013...jeezus krist

 

[Fencer]

I'm saying Vereen backed up by Woodhead is better than Vereen backed up by Washington. (Except in the return game.)

I'm saying a durable Welker backed up by Edelman is better than a less durable Amendola perhaps not backed up by Edelman.

huh? You can argue WW/DA all day and WW is tough to replace but Woodhead leaving means whoever picks up his slack is a downgrade? I dont buy that at all. Vareen is ready for prime time. I think if BB picks up where he left off we could have another steal. I think Washington is going to really help out.

I dont agree with the FO all the time. But I dont see the downgrade there.

I dont worry about the Oline. I think worring about depth there with Dante coaching and Volmer back is a waste of brainwaves.

WR sure. CB sure...not those positions.

 

[supafly]

I think instead of looking at the positions that you see as "downgraded" you should look at the positions that we'll be better off at this year when the season starts.

We've gotten pretty far the past 2 seasons, so I think that positions like CB, S, LB, etc are even better than they've been during the 2011 and 2012 span. We've added more talent and more depth.

The only 2 positions I see as true needs at the moment (and I'm not going to nitpick things like "backup nickel back" etc since those will obviously be addressed...that's stupid) are WR and DL.

We need to address the WR and DL positions both in the draft and in free agency still. If that happens, we will be just fine for high competition this year.

 

[Bruins29]

I'm saying Vereen backed up by Woodhead is better than Vereen backed up by Washington. (Except in the return game.)

I'm saying a durable Welker backed up by Edelman is better than a less durable Amendola perhaps not backed up by Edelman.

I would rather have my backup be the 2nd best return man (or whatever he was) in the league but that is just me.

The WW story has been overdone and the story has become tiresome. WW missed the playoffs with an injury...an injury he caused to himself mind you. Then he drops the 2nd most important makeable catch in franchise history.

I am sure the FO will address the WR issues. I never ever worry about this team not being ready and loaded up for a run. Why people do here is really hard to explain.

 

[mgcolby]

I don't have time to respond to every individual posts, so I'll just hit a couple key things.



5. CB, solid depth/talent, really? Talib is so grossly overrated. He had a big time effect on our defense because he allowed McCourty to play safety and it coincided with Dennard emerging, allowing Arrington to play in the slot. Any decent corner (or even mediocre) could have done what he did.

Yup cause it isn't like Boldin had huge second half or anything in the AFCCG after Talib went down and that mediocre CB started covering him.

This might be one of the most ignorant things I have read on here and that is saying a lot.

 

[supafly]

I'm saying Vereen backed up by Woodhead is better than Vereen backed up by Washington. (Except in the return game.)

I'm saying a durable Welker backed up by Edelman is better than a less durable Amendola perhaps not backed up by Edelman.

I would say that your overall point is valid, Fencer, although I also think that you'd need to take the value of the lost player + his replacements into account for a more accurate picture too.

In other words, Vereen + Washington should very well be just as likely to have the potential to catch 40 balls between the two of them and chug along for 4-5 yds up the middle on 3rd down draws from the shotgun formation.

I actually think that an argument could be realistically made that we at least kept the position the same--if not even possibly upgraded it due to the cheapness of Vereen/Washington and their potential upgrade from Woodhead in the return game.

We've added a proven probowl player for returns, which is yet another position/aspect of past weakness that has been addressed at a reasonable cost. Woodhead certainly wasn't contributing much in that regard.

 

[tonyto3690]

Yup cause it isn't like Boldin had huge second half or anything in the AFCCG after Talib went down and that mediocre CB started covering him.

This might be one of the most ignorant things I have read on here and that is saying a lot.

Cole being terrible doesn't change the fact Talib is overrated. Stupid logic is incredibly stupid.

Talib is a solid corner who does an okay job but isn't nearly as special as people like to believe. The Patriots turnaround in the secondary was because McCourty solidified the safety position more than anything. The secondary thing was because Arrington was moved inside with the emergence of Dennard and was great in the slot as opposed to dreadful outside. LASTLY was because Talib played not horribly.

If a solid/decent player gets injured and is replaced by a terrible player and that terrible player gets destroyed, that doesn't suddenly mean that solid/decent player is really an elite player and indispensable to the team. That is just incredibly stupid logic.


EDIT:
On top of that, the reason the Ravens offense took off is just as much about their adjustments as it is about the chain effect losing Talib had. Instead of moronically pounding the ball right into Wilfork they spread the offense out and let Flacco loft bombs to his players downfield.

 

[JackBauer]

No one is saying they are perfect teams, nor should the Patriots be that. What is being repeatedly stated is that the team has some significant issues that needed to be addressed and really haven't been fixed. DT, DE, S, S3, WR2, WR3, WR4, CB2, OL depth, CB depth all need to be upgraded or filled.

Realistically we can hope that we sign some mediocre WRs who overachieve, some middling CB and OL depth, and a talented young prospect at either DT or DE.

We just don't have the resources to add a couple quality role players and a stud on defense, which is what we need.

You keep saying CB2. It isn't a need (along with half the others on your list).

 

[Brady2Moss]

Um... they're essentially the same team. Slightly better defense, slightly worse offense. My problem is they haven't gotten better, but saying they've gotten worse is moronic.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

lucky if we win 4 games this year....

 

[Clonamery]

Um... they're essentially the same team. Slightly better defense, slightly worse offense. My problem is they haven't gotten better, but saying they've gotten worse is moronic.

Yup, and it's March so it's a team on paper. You won't know if they ARE better until late September. Some people should stop pissing themselves.

 

[Blackluck]

A flash from the past:

Originally Posted by ESPN.COM
Patriots looking at Hall?

DeAngelo Hall | Redskins | Interested: Patriots?

The Boston Globe reports that the New England Patriots may be looking to add cornerback DeAngelo Hall to their roster if the Washington Redskins are unable to secure him before the free agency period begins tomorrow.
The Patriots' ususally stout defense had issues last season, and according to the Globe, the team ranked 26th out of 32 teams in third down conversion percentage against, and 31st in red zone defense. In addition, the Patriots did express interest in Hall when he was released mid-season by the Oakland Raiders in 2008.

A true "shutdown corner", the flashy Hall would take over as the team's No. 1 cornerback on the depth chart. Although the Patriots' AFC East rivals do not have the electrifying wide receiver options that would necessitate spending a wheelbarrow full of cash on one of the league's elite cornerbacks, Hall would definitely help to contain the likes of Santonio Holmes and Reggie Wayne during an extended playoff run

2009. Our defense has not substantially improved since then. During this off season, we chose to double down on our suspect secondary. Arrington has no business playing on the outside, he's a major liability there, but that's exactly what happens should either Dennard or Talib go out (with Talib, it's when, not if he misses playing time due to injury. And even if Dennard avoids jail time, there's still the matter of the NFL suspending him.) Maybe miracles happen and Dowling stays healthy, but since he seems to get injured if he trips over his shoe laces, not a player to count on. Cole has already proven he's no better than a WR playing DB (see Edelman, 2011.)

Although this team hasn't exactly been augers of scouting defensive back talent, we are going to need to draft (yet another) CB, both to play behind Talib and to replace him in the likely event he leaves after next year. How much draft capital has been wasted on this pursuit? This FA period saw a depressed market for starting caliber corners, but we chose not to pursue any options outside of resigning Talib and Arrington. Obviously the FO feels comfortable with our secondary, but that shouldn't mean it's above scrutiny. (After all, the results of the field would argue otherwise.) A team can get by with a mediocre secondary assuming it has a potent pass rush. We don't.

FA can't be used to build teams, that's been proven time and again, but it can be an effective tool to shore up weaknesses, yet we've not really done that either outside KR.

On paper, which is all we have to go on in March, we still don't have a receiver that can beat press coverage, we still have an anemic pass rush, we still have a suspect secondary. This is not to say we still can't improve on these areas as there's a long way to go, but right now IMO these all need improvement.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

Don't know if they're worse or but they're not much better than they were last year especially on defense and that's disappointing given the cap space they had to work with.
Disappointing off-season so far. Hope it gets better with the draft.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

On the same day the OP wrote this post, NFL.com listed us as part of the NFL's five strongest rosters. Just amazing how much contrast there can be in opinions at times.

The pass defense should be improved simply by having Talib for the entire season. And I think Flacco's 3 TD passes overlook the fact that the pass defense minus Talib only gave up 240 yards and 58% completion in the play-off loss. I'm not saying they were great, just that people are over-reacting (surprise) based on the outcome of that game.

But no, our lineup is not perfect. Nobody's is. That doesn't mean people should be lining up to jump off the bridge. And it doesn't mean we shouldn't continue to try and fill those holes. But it's a process, and we're a long ways from the first game of the season. Have a bit of perspective and patience.

 

[UK_Pat37]

The tragedy. We went from Super Bowl runner up to Conference runner up. A total draft position swing of two places.

Quick, lets do a Buffalo Bills and over pay some FAs radically because we're so desperate to catch up with the pack.



I forgot the 2013 season was played in free agency.

 

[JJDChE]

Last year it's arguably a different tune if gronk, talib, and chandler are healthy. However every team deals with injuries, including the sb champs ravens who were without their best corner, starting ss had broken ribs, former dpoy was a shell of himself, star dt was barely function and so on. They still smoked us in our own house and I'm pretty sure the niners, packers, falcons and Seahawks all would have beaten us as well.

So what have we done to improve? Our offense has gotten worse, which is okay assuming it gets worse because we invest in improving the defense... Which we have barely done anything besides barely maintain the status quo.

The only way you could possibly believe we will better this season is if you believe MULTIPLE of the following will happen.

1. We get two impact starters with our late first and second round picks
2. A few of Chandler, Wilson, dowling, Ridley, vereen, Hightower, bequette will have a significantly better season.
3. Gronkowski and Hernandez will both be healthy the entire season.
4. Brady will have a 50-1 td-int ratio.
5. Amendola turns into 2007 moss.
6. We manage to trade for a big time star player
7. We hit a couple Danny Woodhead calibre home runs in udfa and fa scrap heap
8. Wilson turns into 2004 Rodney Harrison
9. Talib stays healthy the entire season

For me there are WAY too many "if he stays healthy for the first time in his entire career" and "if we get extremely lucky and hit massive home runs" for my taste. Right now we are a worse team and a lot of things have to go right o just break even, let alone be better.

We have gaping holes on the dl, serious corner depth issues, questionable safety play behind McCourty and are still incapable of covering good pass catching tight ends and running backs. On top of that, our offense which won us most of our games in large part thanks to welker is praying amendola can stay healthy (doubtful) and can even come close to the production welker gave. AND we currently have no other real wideouts on the roster that we need to save cap space for and address somehow.

Im not saying we are going to be bad, but right now I don't see much beyond a first or second round loss in disappointing fashion. Our defense getting lit up in the secondary, no pass rush, and our team unable to run to win when it counts. Sorry it's not being a pessimist to think we can't solve these issues with two top 60 picks and limited cap space and free agents available.

Haven't been following this team long, have you?

God, I hope not.

If you have, yet you still thought it was reasonable to post this, I hope you actually start paying attention.

 

[jimache]

... Hell, if the Jets can proclaim themselves SB winners in March, why wouldn't some proclaim us as ...sorry but i cannot use the word losers ...so, let's go with "division runner-ups"

 

[tonyto3690]

Haven't been following this team long, have you?

God, I hope not.

If you have, yet you still thought it was reasonable to post this, I hope you actually start paying attention.

This is cute, and the internet tough guy act really does wonders for your credibility.

I've yet to see you post anything of value or provide any sort of substantial retort beyond "I'm right, you're wrong and now I'm going to plug my ears".

-Last year we had serious issues at DT, DE, WR, CB, S
-We have done nothing to improve upon those issues
-We've actually gotten worse at WR
-This team was not good enough to win last year
-We have not gotten better

This team as constructed and likely as it will finish is not good enough to win a SB without getting some extraordinary breaks. Next winter we are going to be saying "our defense isn't good enough, and we can't ask Brady to carry the team". Right now NOTHING has changed from what we've been saying the past three years.

The tragedy. We went from Super Bowl runner up to Conference runner up. A total draft position swing of two places.

Quick, lets do a Buffalo Bills and over pay some FAs radically because we're so desperate to catch up with the pack.



I forgot the 2013 season was played in free agency.

We were only conference runner up because we played in the significantly worse division. If we had played in the NFC we would have lost in the first or second round.

I've already posted I'm not complaining about not winning the SB, or not overpaying on a free agent. Our moves thus far have been underwhelming to say the least. We have done nothing but barely tread water (at best) for a roster that was not NEARLY good enough on defense last year.

On top of that, that is hoping that several players stay healthy which history states is very unlikely

 

[Bruins29]

-This team was not good enough to win last year

Actually you are 100% wrong here. I (we) dont have the time to explain to you nor will it matter since you will continue your tirade regardless of what is pointed out to you.

You are either:
A young kid
Someone who started following the team about 13 years ago
Looking for attention
Trolling
Projecting your own inadaquacies

Either way, your story has become tiresome.

 

[JackBauer]

Still waiting to hear how CB2 is a need.