Trade with the Redskins?

[thesmee1]

[/QUOTE]Imagine how our roster would look if we drafted in the top 10 more often. The one guy we've taken up there has had a HOF career for us.
[/QUOTE]

I know, but when you look at the majority of the drafts most top 10 players don't pan out to the hype that they're given. Seymour's different, and I credit Belichick and Pioli for doing the research. Than you look at a player like Gallery and you wonder wtf? I'm kinda glad the Pats draft in the middle to late rounds, I think it gives them a safety net of sorts. If it doesn't work out, cut them. If it does, like Samuel, his value goes up,jettison a malcontent, and get a few draft picks. I don't know if Snyder would want him, but if anyone does, there will be a price to pay.

 

[The Gr8est]

Imagine how our roster would look if we drafted in the top 10 more often. The one guy we've taken up there has had a HOF career for us.
[/quote]

I know, but when you look at the majority of the drafts most top 10 players don't pan out to the hype that they're given. Seymour's different, and I credit Belichick and Pioli for doing the research. Than you look at a player like Gallery and you wonder wtf? I'm kinda glad the Pats draft in the middle to late rounds, I think it gives them a safety net of sorts. If it doesn't work out, cut them. If it does, like Samuel, his value goes up,jettison a malcontent, and get a few draft picks. I don't know if Snyder would want him, but if anyone does, there will be a price to pay.[/quote]

Right, the pats have two #1 picks in the range that Bob Kraft has already said they like. With the money that you have to pay a top 10 pick, he'd better pan out or you'll have a big drain on the cap.

 

[thesmee1]

Imagine how our roster would look if we drafted in the top 10 more often. The one guy we've taken up there has had a HOF career for us.

I know, but when you look at the majority of the drafts most top 10 players don't pan out to the hype that they're given. Seymour's different, and I credit Belichick and Pioli for doing the research. Than you look at a player like Gallery and you wonder wtf? I'm kinda glad the Pats draft in the middle to late rounds, I think it gives them a safety net of sorts. If it doesn't work out, cut them. If it does, like Samuel, his value goes up,jettison a malcontent, and get a few draft picks. I don't know if Snyder would want him, but if anyone does, there will be a price to pay.[/quote]

Right, the pats have two #1 picks in the range that Bob Kraft has already said they like. With the money that you have to pay a top 10 pick, he'd better pan out or you'll have a big drain on the cap.[/QUOTE]

Exactly. Then you compare Bob Kraft, Belichick and Pioli versus Dan Snyder and Joe Gibbs. It seems that Snyder's a bit impulsive, ( not that there's anything wrong with that,) with a win now attitude. What it's done has driven them into cap hell that everyone was predicting, and has finally come to pass. The Pats have shown the way to build a team is through the draft.

Snyder overpaid for Fauria and Patten. Belichick and Pioli knew they were asking for too much and were on the downhill side of things, yet Snyder snatched them up. It's like buying a used car, there's a reason why someone's getting rid of it. I think Gibbs has a lot of influence over Snyder, too. He's got to remember, that the 80's have come and gone. The salary cap is here, and there's no getting around it. We are fortunate to have the owner we have, and Belichick and Pioli. That being said, the skins can have Samuel and get him out of the AFC. I'd rather they get him then the Jets.

 

[DGreen28]

Exactly. Then you compare Bob Kraft, Belichick and Pioli versus Dan Snyder and Joe Gibbs. It seems that Snyder's a bit impulsive, ( not that there's anything wrong with that,) with a win now attitude. What it's done has driven them into cap hell that everyone was predicting, and has finally come to pass. The Pats have shown the way to build a team is through the draft.

There has been improvement at Redskins Park as far as the "win now" attitude goes. They still are overpaying for overrated free agents (the exceptions being Portis and Moss)... but atleast the free agents themselves are getting younger.

As for cap hell... I'm not trying to be insulting or anything, but you clearly aren't familiar with the fact that the Skins know how to manage a hefty salary cap better than many NFL teams. I'm not denying that our cap number shouldn't be as big as it is, I'm just saying that we've supposedly been in cap hell for around 8 years and have still operated the exact same way as we always have. Honestly, there are a LOT of people around the league who say that Skins cap hell "has come to pass" every year but it never does. I'd encourage you to stop by ExtremeSkins closer to the beginning of free agency if you want an idea of how it gets worked out. Admittedly, there are so many members there that much of the board and its posters aren't worth the visit but there are some bona fide capologists who can explain exactly how its done.

I think Gibbs has a lot of influence over Snyder, too. He's got to remember, that the 80's have come and gone. The salary cap is here, and there's no getting around it. We are fortunate to have the owner we have, and Belichick and Pioli. That being said, the skins can have Samuel and get him out of the AFC. I'd rather they get him then the Jets.

It's impossible to tell who is influencing the personnel moves anymore. Gibbs usually gets his guys... but a lot of the time moves are influenced by Vinny Cerrato (TERRIBLE personnel guy/talent evaluator and Snyder's right hand man) and some of the other coaches. For example, Adam Archuleta was mostly Greg Williams' fault. There are WAY too many people with input.

I gotta hand it to Kraft and Pioli... those guys are without a doubt two of the best guys to have running an NFL team. Belichick I'm much less fond of for a variety of reasons, but I won't get into that here

 

[thesmee1]

[/quote] There has been improvement at Redskins Park as far as the "win now" attitude goes. They still are overpaying for overrated free agents (the exceptions being Portis and Moss)... but atleast the free agents themselves are getting younger.

As for cap hell... I'm not trying to be insulting or anything, but you clearly aren't familiar with the fact that the Skins know how to manage a hefty salary cap better than many NFL teams. I'm not denying that our cap number shouldn't be as big as it is, I'm just saying that we've supposedly been in cap hell for around 8 years and have still operated the exact same way as we always have. Honestly, there are a LOT of people around the league who say that Skins cap hell "has come to pass" every year but it never does. I'd encourage you to stop by ExtremeSkins closer to the beginning of free agency if you want an idea of how it gets worked out. Admittedly, there are so many members there that much of the board and its posters aren't worth the visit but there are some bona fide capologists who can explain exactly how its done. [/quote]



I will agree that Extremeskins is a huge site, and that it does take time to sift through the posts to find what your looking for. If your capologists are reading this thread, I'd love to hear from them. Our resident capologist is Miguel, hopefully he's reading this, too.



[/quote] It's impossible to tell who is influencing the personnel moves anymore. Gibbs usually gets his guys... but a lot of the time moves are influenced by Vinny Cerrato (TERRIBLE personnel guy/talent evaluator and Snyder's right hand man) and some of the other coaches. For example, Adam Archuleta was mostly Greg Williams' fault. There are WAY too many people with input.

I gotta hand it to Kraft and Pioli... those guys are without a doubt two of the best guys to have running an NFL team. Belichick I'm much less fond of for a variety of reasons, but I won't get into that here [/quote]

If their are too many fingers in the pot, I would think it would be time to simplify the FO. Hire a GM, have the owner step back, and let the GM do his job. As for Bob Kraft, he stepped back and let Belichick and Pioli do their job and we haven't been disappointed so far. Say what you will about Belichick, here in NE we're all about him. What he does in his private life, is just that, private. He's a smart man, who may not say much, but on the field , he speaks volumes. He has a degree in economics from Wesleyan, has a defensive game plan in the HOF, and I wouldn't want anyone else coaching my team. Kraft may have some input, but it's BB and Pioli who do the draft, sign FA's and figure out the numbers. Pats fans feel the same way about them as you guys feel about Gibbs. Ok, my rant is off. So how would you guys fix your team? What's the first thing you would do? If I were GM, I'd be looing at picking up a QB with that first pick. Brunell's not getting you to the next level.

 

[DGreen28]

I will agree that Extremeskins is a huge site, and that it does take time to sift through the posts to find what your looking for. If your capologists are reading this thread, I'd love to hear from them. Our resident capologist is Miguel, hopefully he's reading this, too.

I'd encourage you to search ES for "cap hell" and take a look for yourself. If you want the basic version, every season we have a number of players re-structure their backloaded contracts. Although it generally sounds like they are taking one for the team, they get more money up front (from the signing bonus) and, once again, their contracts are generally backloaded so that all the money is pushed back. Now, it may not sound sustainable but it does work so long as contracts are continually re-structured and provided that players who are cut are done so during the early stages of their contract.

Thats the gist of it, atleast. By no means is that technical or 100% accurate... I'm not one of the guys who focuses on that.

If their are too many fingers in the pot, I would think it would be time to simplify the FO. Hire a GM, have the owner step back, and let the GM do his job. As for Bob Kraft, he stepped back and let Belichick and Pioli do their job and we haven't been disappointed so far.

That would make too much sense for us

Seriously, its not like anything you guys do is revolutionary... you just have the right guys running the operation and the Skins simply do not.

So how would you guys fix your team? What's the first thing you would do? If I were GM, I'd be looing at picking up a QB with that first pick. Brunell's not getting you to the next level.

We need a GM... but that won't happen, atleast not until Gibbs leaves.

You might want to do a bit of research before saying what you would do as a GM. We drafted Jason Campbell in the first round in 2005 and he took over as starter when we played in Tampa Bay (around week 9, I believe). Based on what we've seen, there's no need to look into another QB... the kid has a hell of an arm and can make some amazing pin-point throws, but is a tad bit inconsistent and will throw some into the dirt.

Considering also that we had the 12th ranked offense with an ineffective veteran and a first-time starter (who had virtually no reps with the starters when he took over), I'd say that our offense is not a problem. Our oline is one of the best in the league, our RB depth is nothing short of amazing (arguably as good as Dillon-Maroney-Faulk), Cooley is one hell of a TE, and we have a top-notch #1 WR in Santana. Receiver is the only position we would consider upgrading because of the serious underperformance of Lloyd (Randle El was good but not as #2 and we have an undrafted rookie by the name of Mike Espy who looks promising). Our defense was ranked 31st.

Basically, what we need most is a run-stuffing/space-eating DT or a balanced DE (adept at both stopping the run and blitzing). We also need to address the secondary... we need a strong nickelback (or possibly even a starter) in the event that Springs goes down or we have him play more at SS. The way I see it, our 1st rounder will go to the defensive line and we will get a CB out of free agency. Clements would be the most likely candidate but may be too expensive and Asante would be another "ideal" option, but it is also possible we look for bargains (i.e. Rod Hood or bringing Fred Smoot back).

 

[Major **********]

Didn't the new CBA save their bacon last year? Wasn't there talk that they would have had to cut a ton of players if the old CBA had been played out?

 

[thesmee1]

Didn't the new CBA save their bacon last year? Wasn't there talk that they would have had to cut a ton of players if the old CBA had been played out?

I've heard that even with the new CBA, they're still pretty tight under the cap this year.

 

[thesmee1]

I'd encourage you to search ES for "cap hell" and take a look for yourself. If you want the basic version, every season we have a number of players re-structure their backloaded contracts. Although it generally sounds like they are taking one for the team, they get more money up front (from the signing bonus) and, once again, their contracts are generally backloaded so that all the money is pushed back. Now, it may not sound sustainable but it does work so long as contracts are continually re-structured and provided that players who are cut are done so during the early stages of their contract.

Thats the gist of it, atleast. By no means is that technical or 100% accurate... I'm not one of the guys who focuses on that.



That would make too much sense for us

Seriously, its not like anything you guys do is revolutionary... you just have the right guys running the operation and the Skins simply do not.



We need a GM... but that won't happen, atleast not until Gibbs leaves.

You might want to do a bit of research before saying what you would do as a GM. We drafted Jason Campbell in the first round in 2005 and he took over as starter when we played in Tampa Bay (around week 9, I believe). Based on what we've seen, there's no need to look into another QB... the kid has a hell of an arm and can make some amazing pin-point throws, but is a tad bit inconsistent and will throw some into the dirt.

Considering also that we had the 12th ranked offense with an ineffective veteran and a first-time starter (who had virtually no reps with the starters when he took over), I'd say that our offense is not a problem. Our oline is one of the best in the league, our RB depth is nothing short of amazing (arguably as good as Dillon-Maroney-Faulk), Cooley is one hell of a TE, and we have a top-notch #1 WR in Santana. Receiver is the only position we would consider upgrading because of the serious underperformance of Lloyd (Randle El was good but not as #2 and we have an undrafted rookie by the name of Mike Espy who looks promising). Our defense was ranked 31st.

Basically, what we need most is a run-stuffing/space-eating DT or a balanced DE (adept at both stopping the run and blitzing). We also need to address the secondary... we need a strong nickelback (or possibly even a starter) in the event that Springs goes down or we have him play more at SS. The way I see it, our 1st rounder will go to the defensive line and we will get a CB out of free agency. Clements would be the most likely candidate but may be too expensive and Asante would be another "ideal" option, but it is also possible we look for bargains (i.e. Rod Hood or bringing Fred Smoot back).

Sorry for the delay in the response. In my opinion, Asante had a good year and stepped up his play because it's a contract year. Not to say he won't have that playing for another team, but from my observation, he played harder this year, than in years past.

Why was Smoot let go? If he could be had for a bargain price, yeah, it would be a good deal, but, wouldn't it make sense to go younger? Like you said, draft a good DE, it costs less and he would be developed the way Gibbs would want him to.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

I've heard that even with the new CBA, they're still pretty tight under the cap this year.

According to ESPN, the Redskins are 4.3 million under the cap for 2007. However they will most likely cut some high priced vetrans such as Brunell. For some more cap room. They only have the #6 pick, and then they do not have another pick until the fifth round (pick # 133). So at least they won't have to waste alot of cap room on signing their draft class (pun intended).

That is why I thought that a trade with Washington could be possible, the only way I see the Pats trading picks 24 & 28 for #6 is that if Calvin Johnson is still around at #6. Other than that forgetaboutit.

The Pats will have at least five, and most likely seven picks (after the comp picks are handed out) between the two Washington picks.