Tom Brady says he's done "for good"

[Wozzy]

There have been 56 Super Bowls, so 112 starting quarterbacks.

I'll name all of the bums according to me:

Joe Namath
Joe Kapp
Billy Kilmer
Craig Martin
Vince Ferragamo
Tony Eason
Doug Williams
Jeff Hostetler
Stan Humphries
Trent Dilfer
Rex Grossman

That's 11. So 101 remaining and many of them were elite quarterbacks. I don't know but if I'm counting out elite gunners, or punters, or right guards, I don't think my list of elites would be too long.

You missed a ton of average QB’s who won. I mean a lot… also it took 48 years for the Eagles to finally win the Super Bowl. There’s 13 teams that have never won. You’re taking a slice of the smallest fraternity in football history and saying “look, a trend.”

All the teams that won rings also had some of the best offensive tackles, guards, centers, TE’s, WR’s, RB’s, DT’s, LB’ers, DB’s, Kickers, Long Snappers and coaches as well…. but QB’s are unique somehow.

Sure thing. Here’s a newsflash: Great teams find great players.

 

[PatsWSB47]

The quarterback is the most important position on a football team but they can't do it alone.

 

[RicoG]

Yes I can. I’m not a millennial who thinks just because the Pats made it look easy that it was. This was the early 2000’s when defenders could still level a QB in the pocket. There are only 32 teams, there were very few optimal situations for a QB to land at. If he went to the Cardinals you wouldn’t even know his name.

Sure… twelve years in Detroit Matt Staffords played in two playoff games and got bounced with zero wins.

One season on the Rams and he wins a ring… but it’s because of Matt Stafford’s magic QB powers.

Moss doesn’t have a ring, neither does Julio Jones or Deandre Hopkins. Pats had good weapons most of the time. The Pats paid the middle of the roster, they spread the money out which gave them depth to withstand injuries. From 2015-2013 Tom was one of the highest paid players in the league and they won no rings.

The OLine and rest of the teams were good, they all made each other look very good.

My comments aren’t about Tom Brady, it’s about the QB position. They’re important, they’re also just one player in one phase out of three. It takes a team. Tom landing in and hand picking the optimal situation in Tampa doesn’t make that any less true.

Nah, there's probably about 6 teams give or take where Brady would have had close to the same success. The Pats could have even won more SBs. 1 of 2 against the Giants and the Philly SB. But they should have lost against the Falcons. Against the Seahawks, well it's no sure thing that you can run 1 yard at the goal line. The Bucs tried it 2 or 3 times in a row this year and got stuffed.

Stafford went to a team that had superstars at their best. The Rams team was loaded. Lions are one of those franchises that have a loser mentality where it's hard to have sustain success so obviously Stafford wouldn'tbe successful. Bucs were even worse with the worst record of in all the major sports. Brady's SB achievement much more impressive then Stafford. But then the Bucs do what loser franchises do, starting with hiring a bad head coach in Bowles.

Brady being the highest paid for a couple years didn't affect the team. He could have been the highest paid for 10 plus years. Those significant discounts did help with building depth. I don't recall any QB taking significant discounts over a prolong period of time. In fact nowadays, most of the star QB are overpaid by millions and holding their team back. Anyone getting paid close to and above Mahomes is overpaid.

 

[Wozzy]

Nah, there's probably about 6 teams give or take where Brady would have had close to the same success. The Pats could have even won more SBs. 1 of 2 against the Giants and the Philly SB. But they should have lost against the Falcons. Against the Seahawks, well it's no sure thing that you can run 1 yard at the goal line. The Bucs tried it 2 or 3 times in a row this year and got stuffed.

Sure, that’s why there’s so many examples of QB’s with more than one ring to their name… if you can’t feel the sarcasm leaking from this response I’ll spell it out for you.

In his entire career only two QB’s beyond Tom have more than one, Ben and Eli. Meanwhile other greats like Brees, Rogers etc have one.

Prior to Brady the only argument for why Montana wasn’t the best was Marino… he had no rings. If Eli can win two, if Bradshaw can win four… it doesn’t take a magical unicorn, it takes a team.

Brady didn’t have to go to a good team back in 2000, he had to go to a team that wasn’t good but had a new head coach and was on the rise. Good teams already had QB’s and a 211 pound late round pick wasn’t starting as a rookie.

Consider this, after his rookie contract ended Mahomes had one ring… Brady had three. Mahomes was better than Brady in his rookie contract, Brady’s team was better and more balanced. The Pats defense was as good or better than the offense, the rushing attack was punishing.

Stafford went to a team that had superstars at their best. The Rams team was loaded. Lions are one of those franchises that have a loser mentality where it's hard to have sustain success so obviously Stafford wouldn'tbe successful. Bucs were even worse with the worst record of in all the major sports. Brady's SB achievement much more impressive then Stafford. But then the Bucs do what loser franchises do, starting with hiring a bad head coach in Bowles.

Either great QB’s change everything for your team or they don’t… you want to have it both ways. That’s what all QB fanboys do… ignore contradictory evidence.

Brady being the highest paid for a couple years didn't affect the team. He could have been the highest paid for 10 plus years. Those significant discounts did help with building depth. I don't recall any QB taking significant discounts over a prolong period of time. In fact nowadays, most of the star QB are overpaid by millions and holding their team back. Anyone getting paid close to and above Mahomes is overpaid.

It has nothing to do with Brady. It has to do with QB’s being the highest paid position and the massive advantage teams with great QB’s on rookies deals have that teams paying out don’t. Most casual fans don’t understand how the salary cap works.

 

[Wozzy]

The quarterback is the most important position on a football team but they can't do it alone.

Goff lost two more games (3) than Stafford's did (5) with his old team the year prior. Staffords won a Super Bowl with the team Goff made it there with a little over a year prior.

Seems Stafford's needed the team a lot more than they needed him. Plug any number of QB's in there and they win.

 

[crawhammer]

Yeah…. I’m sure it was the head coach and not their best defender in Donta Hightower, their 350 pound nose tackle Alan Branch, Jon Jones and Patrick Chung getting hurt.

But wait didn’t you tell us the best QB is what matters most anyhow?

I already explained that there are limitations for even the greatest of all time. Brady wasn't a perfect 10-10 in the Super Bowl, he lost 3.

Obviously a lot takes place in any game, but especially one with a record combined 1151 yards of offense, and 74 points. You have difficulty with this concept but if I'm looking for the top reason why the Patriots lost the game, then it's the Malcolm Butler benching. He had started every game that season and led the defense in snap%. Yet 0 defensive snaps in the Super Bowl, despite being dressed, standing on the sideline, and playing on ST.

The decision by Belichick to bench Malcolm was made even more egregious with the injuries the defense was dealing with. Benching Malcolm had a debilitating ripple effect on the defense, not only removing their CB1, but giving snaps to Bademosi and Richards (who is the single worst player I have ever seen in the NFL).

Brady was terrific in this SB: 505 yards, 3 TDs, 115.4 passer rating... I mean what more can you expect? Still, it wasn't enough because the defense was horrendous and reason number 1 for that was Belichick benching Malcolm Butler.

 

[crawhammer]

So in summation… QB’s are a small piece of what it takes for a team to win a ring.

And yeah, QB play is a big piece on the offensive side, but offense is only one phase in a sport with three.

Beyond that, this ^ entire meandering response above is a dancing around to prove a hypothesis from a teen fangirl gushing about Justin Bieber and calling him a god.

That's a copout. I answered all your questions. You couldn't even acknowledge getting things blatantly wrong.

 

[crawhammer]

The quarterback is the most important position on a football team but they can't do it alone.

Wozzy gave you a 'thumbs up!' despite arguing against it everywhere else. In his world all 3 phases are equally important, like exactly 33.3333333333% for each phase... it takes a team with 53 equal portions.

 

[crawhammer]

As I was saying...

ll the teams that won rings also had some of the best offensive tackles, guards, centers, TE’s, WR’s, RB’s, DT’s, LB’ers, DB’s, Kickers, Long Snappers and coaches as well…. but QB’s are unique somehow.

That's right, I forgot about that impressive list of long snappers who won SB MVP.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

From 1997-2008, Tiger Woods won 14 majors, but "the field" was better, winning 34 majors.

Therefore, "the field" is all you need to win a major golf tournament and you should bet on him because he is likely to win.

 

[crawhammer]

You missed a ton of average QB’s who won. I mean a lot… also it took 48 years for the Eagles to finally win the Super Bowl. There’s 13 teams that have never won. You’re taking a slice of the smallest fraternity in football history and saying “look, a trend.”

I named 11 bad quarterbacks (out of 112) to play in the Super Bowl.

Here's a list of elite quarterbacks to play in 3 or more Super Bowls:

Tom Brady (10)
John Elway (5)
Joe Montana (4)
Terry Bradshaw (4)
Roger Staubach (4)
Peyton Manning (4)
Jim Kelly (4)
Fran Tarkenton (3)
Bob Griese (3)
Troy Aikman (3)
Kurt Warner (3)
Ben Roethlisberger (3)
Patrick Mahomes (3)

That's 53 starts out of 112 for elite HOF quarterbacks. That's 43% of all SB starts by 13 elite HOF quarterbacks with 3 or more appearances.

Adding elite QBs with 1 or 2 starts... Starr (2), Dawson (2), Favre (2), Stabler, Unitas, Marino, Esiason, Young, Rodgers, Brees... I'm probably omitting a few but that brings us to 66 out of 112 for elite HOF quarterbacks. That's 50% of all SB starts by elite HOF quarterbacks.

Many other quarterbacks were at least above average... Morrall (MVP season), Anderson (MVP season), Gannon (MVP season), Ryan (MVP season), Newton (MVP season), Lamonica, Morton, McNabb, McNair, Eli, Wilson, Newton, Stafford, Burrow, Hurts.

Yes, the QB is most important position in professional team sports. Having an elite QB is the number one predictor for a team's chances of reaching the Super Bowl.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I named 11 bad quarterbacks (out of 112) to play in the Super Bowl.

Here's a list of elite quarterbacks to play in 3 or more Super Bowls:

Tom Brady (10)
John Elway (5)
Joe Montana (4)
Terry Bradshaw (4)
Roger Staubach (4)
Peyton Manning (4)
Jim Kelly (4)
Fran Tarkenton (3)
Bob Griese (3)
Troy Aikman (3)
Kurt Warner (3)
Ben Roethlisberger (3)
Patrick Mahomes (3)

That's 53 starts out of 112 for elite HOF quarterbacks. That's 43% of all SB starts by 13 elite HOF quarterbacks with 3 or more appearances.

Adding elite QBs with 1 or 2 starts... Starr (2), Dawson (2), Favre (2), Stabler, Unitas, Marino, Esiason, Young, Rodgers, Brees... I'm probably omitting a few but that brings us to 66 out of 112 for elite HOF quarterbacks. That's 50% of all SB starts by elite HOF quarterbacks.

Many other quarterbacks were at least above average... Morrall (MVP season), Anderson (MVP season), Gannon (MVP season), Ryan (MVP season), Newton (MVP season), Lamonica, Morton, McNabb, McNair, Eli, Wilson, Newton, Stafford, Burrow, Hurts.

Yes, the QB is most important position in professional team sports. Having an elite QB is the number one predictor for a team's chances of reaching the Super Bowl.

If Patrick Mahomes switched from the Chiefs to almost any other team in the NFL, that team would become instant Super Bowl favorites while the Chiefs would drop to middle/bottom odds. But what do oddsmakers know anyway? They're just hedging the risk of a multi-billion dollar industry. They're not enlightened enough to post in this thread.

 

[Steve102]

They're not enlightened enough to post in this thread.

 

[VectorPrime]

 

[Tunescribe]

I already explained that there are limitations for even the greatest of all time. Brady wasn't a perfect 10-10 in the Super Bowl, he lost 3.

Obviously a lot takes place in any game, but especially one with a record combined 1151 yards of offense, and 74 points. You have difficulty with this concept but if I'm looking for the top reason why the Patriots lost the game, then it's the Malcolm Butler benching. He had started every game that season and led the defense in snap%. Yet 0 defensive snaps in the Super Bowl, despite being dressed, standing on the sideline, and playing on ST.

The decision by Belichick to bench Malcolm was made even more egregious with the injuries the defense was dealing with. Benching Malcolm had a debilitating ripple effect on the defense, not only removing their CB1, but giving snaps to Bademosi and Richards (who is the single worst player I have ever seen in the NFL).

Brady was terrific in this SB: 505 yards, 3 TDs, 115.4 passer rating... I mean what more can you expect? Still, it wasn't enough because the defense was horrendous and reason number 1 for that was Belichick benching Malcolm Butler.

That's a copout. I answered all your questions. You couldn't even acknowledge getting things blatantly wrong.

Wozzy gave you a 'thumbs up!' despite arguing against it everywhere else. In his world all 3 phases are equally important, like exactly 33.3333333333% for each phase... it takes a team with 53 equal portions.

As I was saying...

That's right, I forgot about that impressive list of long snappers who won SB MVP.

I named 11 bad quarterbacks (out of 112) to play in the Super Bowl.

Here's a list of elite quarterbacks to play in 3 or more Super Bowls:

Tom Brady (10)
John Elway (5)
Joe Montana (4)
Terry Bradshaw (4)
Roger Staubach (4)
Peyton Manning (4)
Jim Kelly (4)
Fran Tarkenton (3)
Bob Griese (3)
Troy Aikman (3)
Kurt Warner (3)
Ben Roethlisberger (3)
Patrick Mahomes (3)

That's 53 starts out of 112 for elite HOF quarterbacks. That's 43% of all SB starts by 13 elite HOF quarterbacks with 3 or more appearances.

Adding elite QBs with 1 or 2 starts... Starr (2), Dawson (2), Favre (2), Stabler, Unitas, Marino, Esiason, Young, Rodgers, Brees... I'm probably omitting a few but that brings us to 66 out of 112 for elite HOF quarterbacks. That's 50% of all SB starts by elite HOF quarterbacks.

Many other quarterbacks were at least above average... Morrall (MVP season), Anderson (MVP season), Gannon (MVP season), Ryan (MVP season), Newton (MVP season), Lamonica, Morton, McNabb, McNair, Eli, Wilson, Newton, Stafford, Burrow, Hurts.

Yes, the QB is most important position in professional team sports. Having an elite QB is the number one predictor for a team's chances of reaching the Super Bowl.

 

[Guts]

sorry @crawhammer

 

[crawhammer]

sorry @crawhammer

Doesn't really mean anything. He can request reinstatement at any time. Which seems doubtful at this point but filing retirement paperwork doesn't exclude anything.

This does wipe out the opportunity for a phony one-year deal with the Bucs who are now on the hook for a $35 mil dead cap hit in 2023 for Brady.

 

[VectorPrime]

Yes you can undo this decision but if there's really any doubt in your mind you just don't file because it's not necessary except for pension purposes years down the line. So he's done unless something really unanticipated occurs MAYBE for 2024. But no chance in hell he's playing this season.

 

[1960Pats]

There's a good chance Malcolm doesn't catch it if Russell Wilson doesn't drill the pass into his chest. Or better yet, Wilson should have checked out of the play altogether, or called a timeout, or maybe pulled back on the throw as the play was being immediately blown up. Wilson has escaped way too much criticism for this play.

Butler was behind the WR and the play looked open from Wilson's angle. If I'm handing out criticism it's to the WR who allowed Butler to muscle into the play from behind. Another thing that gets overlooked is how Seattle blew two timeouts just before that decisive play and were more or less forced to pass.

 

[venecol]

There are 32 teams, only one team wins the Super Bowl.

Joe Gibbs won three different Super Bowls with three different journeyman QB’s… did the spirit of the holy ghost inhabit everyone of those QB’s bodies for the postseason because Gibbs was a prophet of god?

Average/merely good QB’s win Super Bowls… that shoots holes in the elite QB list nonsense.

Aaron Rogers was the league MVP last year, this year with a couple of rookie WR’s and retreads he didn’t even make the playoffs… was it because Rogers was “less than” he was last season or was it his team? Just absurd…

Wussies take: football is a team sport. It takes the entire team to win. The team includes coaches, cheerleaders, training staff, water boys. They all contribute to the wins. You don't even need elite players. Anyone can win because it takes a team to win.

Real deep analysis there my dude. Bravo.