The Official Patriots Draft (Day 1) thread

[jmt57]

Anybody else think TE is the next pick?

Huge hole there.

No.

Go back a page and look at the number of tight ends still available on post#1186, and compare that to other positions. Supply and demand, my guess is they go elsewhere with the next pick. I think the Pats can wait for a TE - but then, I also thought that a DB was about the 6th most likely position to be drafted with the first pick.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm just amazed by the McCourty pick i just saw. He is an amazing talent. How did he make that interception?

I dont know what that means.

 

[Ring 6]

No.

Go back a page and look at the number of tight ends still available on post#1186, and compare that to other positions. Supply and demand, my guess is they go elsewhere with the next pick. I think the Pats can wait for a TE - but then, I also thought that a DB was about the 6th most likely position to be drafted with the first pick.

I wasn't surprised it was a corner, I suggested it on this board a while back (but in fairness I think I said 'don't rule out)
Its one of the most important positions, we have one steady starter, one 2nd year guy we have high expectations for, then questions.
If you really look at the last 5 years, corner, or actually 'pass coverage' has been maybe our single largest weakness.
I'm thrilled with this pick.

 

[JFK]

I dont know what that means.

I'm just messing around. However i am puzzled by the player we drafted. Hopefully it works out. If it doesn't, I'll start questioning BB a lot more.

 

[Patspsycho]

Not necessarily true.
The Jets are not good pass rushers by any means.
They pressure with scheme, not individual ability.
Corners that can play man allow you to blitz.

This is part of what I don't get about Pats fans.
Bill Belichick has never,ever shown that a one-dimensional pass rusher is a good fit in his defense.
He has ALWAYS shown that VERSATILE players who can do everything required of their position is what he wants.
He has always shown that pass rush comes from scheme not one on one ability. In fact he plays a base defense that instructs his 'pass rushers' to ENGAGE the blocker first while reading the play.
You simply cannot effectively run a 2 gap defense with TEAM defense and consistency and conservatism as the cornerstones with one-dimensional players.
Like it or not, there is never going to be an all-out effort by BB to sell out his concept to get a 15 sack guy, because he needs more out of his defenders than to be as one-dimensional as you need to be to be that guy. That is why every OLB he has ever acquired (that does not include Burgess because he was a sub package only player) was a very good run defender.

I realize that sacks are the end all and be all for many fans, but they are just a piece of the puzzle in our system, and frankly not nearly the biggest piece.

I don't think it's ideal to compare our system to the Jets who do one gap and overload a great deal on pass-rushing. We have stopgaps built into our system, the Jets frequently engage in an all-or-nothing approach.

My belief is that a strong backfield does not substitute for pressuring the QB or collapsing the pocket. This is why we fare terribly against those patient enough to engage in dink and dunk, and moving downfield in incremental chunks.

 

[jmt57]

I wasn't surprised it was a corner, I suggested it on this board a while back (but in fairness I think I said 'don't rule out)
Its one of the most important positions, we have one steady starter, one 2nd year guy we have high expectations for, then questions.
If you really look at the last 5 years, corner, or actually 'pass coverage' has been maybe our single largest weakness.
I'm thrilled with this pick.

Perhaps the idea is if offenses are going to 3-WR sets as their base formation, then perhaps defenses should counter with 3-CB sets as their base formation. The rules, 'points of emphasis', and what penalties are (and are not) called has changed dramatically the last few years. It's becoming increasingly difficult for safeties to cover a wide receiver.

 

[SEA_Pat]

What about those who say a first round pick should be a 3 down player?

Add the majority of snaps on the defense in the Nickle to the snaps playing the most critical non-kicking role in punt returns, kick returns and opponent's field goal and point after attempts and what do you have?

 

[DaBruinz]

Well, from everything I've heard, McCourty was the pick the Pats wanted regardless. They clearly think he's a step up over Wheatley and Wilhite. I think that McCourty will have an immediate impact in the return game, at the very minimum. Clearly one of Wheatley or Wilhite are probably gone at the end of training camp. I can't see the Pats keeping 7 CBs.

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

No need to cry.
My point was that you gave your analysis of the player and said you would give BB the benefit of the doubt. You said it as if you were his peer.
Are you telling me that anyone doesnt make draft mistakes? Do you even know WHY Wheately has been a mistake?
Do you accept you have about 1% of the information available to you that BB does?
Do you truly believe that you have an equal ability to judge the player if you did?
Thats the way you came off. You listed your assessment and were 'willing to give BB the benefit of the doubt'
I just find that type of arrogance comical. Maybe its just me.

I'm the one that comes off as arrogant? Take a look in the mirror buddy. You talk down to many people like you are so superior, when in reality, you are a homer who just toots your Pats/Belichick horn all day. Everything Belichick does is always right, he's never been wrong, and none of the guys he drafts are busts.

I said "willing to give BB benefit of the doubt" as in I am willing to go into the season with an open mind even though I'm not particularly fond of this draft pick. because of how good he's been in the past. That was meant to be more of a positive statement, yet you are turning it into more of a negative one. It's ridiculous how people like you rip into posters for having their own opinions. Isn't that what a forum is for? Just because I'm not a big fan of a BB draft pick doesn't mean that I'm arrogant. It's a shame that some people can't be more objective and separate emotions from their opinions.

 

[SEA_Pat]

Seems to me that:

1. BB had marked out who he wanted and when time for the pick came, he knew the guys in-between the lower pick and his pick weren't going cornerback, so he picked up the change. That's improved draft position 2x for free including a ticket into the 3rd round. Wily.

2. It makes sense to go CB because the marquee elite guys were out of reach unless he traded up with some of his picks. Of the remainder, everyone said after the top 20 or so guys, the next 75-80 were around the same quality because it's such a deep draft. Given that situation, the top corners would be taken first, as they are every year. It's a higher value position and harder to find starter level players. It was proven by the remaining top CBs being snapped up immediately afterwards.

3. BB values Special Teams a hell of a lot more than everyone on the board does. "Just a Special Teamer"? BB constantly and consistently talks about the three phases and the importance of field position and the kicking game. Our return game and coverage was atrocious last year. And the guy has blocked a lot of kicks.

We've got four more picks tomorrow (one more than before and one in a better position) and several other needs to fill. But we've filled an important need with a guy who is versatile, fast and who BB had rated as the best guy for his scheme in his position. He broke down film with him so must have a pretty good idea of his football knowledge and character.

Count me very pleased although I was expecting and wanting a DL. But what do I know?

 

[Ring 6]

I'm just messing around. However i am puzzled by the player we drafted. Hopefully it works out. If it doesn't, I'll start questioning BB a lot more.

I'm sure he is sweating.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't think it's ideal to compare our system to the Jets who do one gap and overload a great deal on pass-rushing. We have stopgaps built into our system, the Jets frequently engage in an all-or-nothing approach.

My belief is that a strong backfield does not substitute for pressuring the QB or collapsing the pocket. This is why we fare terribly against those patient enough to engage in dink and dunk, and moving downfield in incremental chunks.

We are mixing base and 3rd down though. The Jets aren't blitzing on 1st down any more than we are. They are playing run D in order to get to a blitzing situation.

I disagree with you, I think we do great against teams that dink and dunk, and always have. Thats our basis of our D.
We want them to have to make 14 plays to score. In essence we want them to have to make every play and do it the hard way. We are fine with no big plays for either side.
Other defenses believe defense is about stopping the other team by coming up with one big play per defensive drive.

The original point however, is that the Jets do not have good pass rushers. They blitz in obvious passing downs to get an unblocked rusher because they are comfortable leaving their corners one on one (risk giving up the big play to get the big play)
If you looked at every Jet and Patriot pass rush last year you simply would not see better man on man efforts in beating a blocker from the Jets. You would see pressure coming from there being more rushers than blockers.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm the one that comes off as arrogant? Take a look in the mirror buddy. You talk down to many people like you are so superior, when in reality, you are a homer who just toots your Pats/Belichick horn all day. Everything Belichick does is always right, he's never been wrong, and none of the guys he drafts are busts.

I said "willing to give BB benefit of the doubt" as in I am willing to go into the season with an open mind even though I'm not particularly fond of this draft pick. because of how good he's been in the past. That was meant to be more of a positive statement, yet you are turning it into more of a negative one. It's ridiculous how people like you rip into posters for having their own opinions. Isn't that what a forum is for? Just because I'm not a big fan of a BB draft pick doesn't mean that I'm arrogant. It's a shame that some people can't be more objective and separate emotions from their opinions.

I said that BB has more knowledge, access, info and ability to digest and interpret it than you.
How is that arrogant? How does that say he has never been wrong?

I pointed out that it is arrogant of you to post what you did.
You:
Stated your opinion
Implied that meant BB made a bad pick
Gave BB the 'benefit of the doubt'

Maybe I misread (and perhaps I did, because this board is full of people who think they could do a better job that the HC/GM with the best track record in the NFL) but you came off as if you were assured of your opinion, certain yours was more valid than BBs but would throw him a bone and give HIM a chance to prove YOU wrong.

If that isn't arrogant, I don't know what is.
Well, perhaps this last post.
If thats not what you meant, simply say so.

In any event, please refrain from the tired old anyone who doesnt trash everything that happens must be a homer. Its trite, boring and unimaginitive.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Hobbs was a 3rd round pick, and we got more than 3rd round value.
Wheately has not worked out so far.
Wilhite was a 4th and as such has been decent.
Butler? You are complaining about him?

My God, we had 3 #1s on the DL and trade one of them and everyone is crying about the glaring need (even when we have 2 starting caliber players there in Wright and Lewis) at DE.
Yet, since we drafted 4 corners in the 3rd, 4th, 2nd and 2nd over the last 5 years we shouldn't have a need.

Damione Lewis is starter-caliber now? I liked the signing, but I think that your assessment of him might be a little inflated, at this point. Wright, OTOH, is a known quantity, and is a borderline/unremarkable starter at best. Another guy that I like, but in a system that places so much emphasis on dominating the LOS (which is why the Pats had 3 #1 picks there in the first place), I'm not sure that Mike Wright can get the job done as consistently and thoroughly as you want from your starter.

That said, I didn't think that DL was the Pats' biggest need anyways. A bigger need than CB, definitely, but not the biggest.