The more time that goes on, the more I have trouble rooting for Kraft

[Armchair Quarterback]

this is easy........because I don't give a **** what Kraft thinks of me......which is reciprocated by the fact that I think the whole notion of rooting for/against the owner is silly

Yet you are extremely concerned with what others think of Kraft.

Newsflash here, I doubt anyone in this thread gives a **** of what Kraft thinks of them (whatever you mean by that) or roots for or against the owner. It's about a particular action that he chose that went against the best interests of the team.

 

[OhExaulted1]

Suing in court would be the last step, not his only option. First step would be to appeal, which he choose not to do.

A fruitless appeal to the scumbag Goodell and then the nuclear option that could blow up in his face. That's the plan your laying forth.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

You forgot the 2 instances of tampering where forced draft pick swaps were enforced. Of course the Jets tampering with Revis was met with less penalty (the $100k joke) If you need any evidence that Roger treats NE completely different then the other 31 here it is:

Kraft was up against a stacked deck:
https://nflpaweb.blob.core.windows.net/media/Default/PDFs/Media Resources/7.29.15 petition to vacate.pdf
lll. Because the Competitive Integrity Policy has never been given to players, no player in NFL history has ever been disciplined---or even investigated-for violating this Policy, let alone for being generally aware of someone else's violation of this Policy. Rather, only Clubs and Club personnel have been subject to discipline tlereunder. For example, in 2009, the NFL suspended a member of the New York Jets equipment staff after he "attempted to use unapproved equipment to prep the K[icking] Balls prior to" a Jets game against the New England Patriots. NFLPA Ex.209 at l. According to the NFL in imposing the discipline, the equipment personnel's"attempt to use unapproved materials to prep the Klicking] Balls could [have] easily be[en] interpreted as an attempt to gain a competitive advantage." 1d. However, the Jets' |icker-the player who could have benefitted from the alleged ooattempt to gain a competitive advantage" (id.)-was not investigated, let alone disciplined. tlr'g Tr. 25A:7-12 (Vincent). This was perfectly consistent with the Competitive Integrity Policy's application to Clubs, not players, as well as the fact that even if the Jets kicker was "generally aware" of the infraction, general awareness is not a basis for discipline.6 ll2. The only other two incidents conceming potential ball tampering in recent years similarly resulted in no player investigation or player discipline. On November 30, 6 The Award states that "[t]here was no evidence of any player involvement" in this situation, NFLPA Ex.2lO, Award at 15, but fails to acknowledge that there was also no League investigation of any player involvement. 37 CASE 0:15-cv-0316

The Jets were fined $9,600 for the incident. I now it's total BS, but Kraft can't sue without HUGE risk:
3) The league bylaws [3.11(C)] prevent members of the league from seeking damages due to a decision by the commissioner and the league.

4) This would isolate Kraft from the other franchises because he would effectively be suing the other owners.

5) If the Patriots circumvent the bylaws, 8.13(B)(1) would allow the other owners on the Executive Committee (the owners he would be suing) to force Kraft to forfeit his franchise if they receive 24 votes.
DeflateGate: Why Robert Kraft Had to Give Up

Stamping feet and screaming to the heavens still won't appease the soap-box 20/20 hindsight keyboard evangelists here anyway even when shown reason.

If only posters here were able to seperate perception from fact and reality. Of course, just like our picks, that's unlikely to happen.

Roger Goodell unfairly stole draft picks from the Patriots. Kraft did not just "give" them away. It's just plainly not as simple as that.

They could use that in the appeal process and then in court if it got that far. It would be a slam dunk.

You can't honestly believe Kraft would lose the franchise over bringing this to court.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Kraft's mistake was his very vocal support of the Omissioner's numerous arbitrary punishments over the years. He set himself up a spot where he couldn't complain about the punishment when the hammer swung in the Pats' direction again - otherwise he'd look like quite the tool. Now he looks like a tool anyhow.

A lot of us hated this long term pattern of support way before DeflateGate ever happened. He propped up a bad hire and ultimately paid the price for that support, unfortunately for us fans.

Yep...this is a very overlooked piece of Deflategate. It's now a well-known fact that many of the owners resent Kraft...some, like Jerry Jones, are reported to have stuck it to him. Jones was hit with a salary cap penalty for overspending during the uncapped year, but Jones disputed the penalty. Kraft's answer: just take it because it will appease everyone and won't rock the boat.

That, in my opinion, sowed the very seeds for the fiasco and is at the heart of what bothers people about Kraft. If he felt that Jones was wrong, he should have told him. If he felt that Jones was right, he should have supported his fight against cap sanctions. When the tables were turned, it's hard to feel any sympathy for Kraft.

I hate to say it, but I suspect that the corrupt and arbitrary nature of the NFL has a lot to do with Kraft. Goodell is a commissioner who was hired to serve the will of the owners. That's nothing new; in fact, all commissioners must serve their owners. But many commissioners are elected because they are expected to act on principle, sometimes take the minority's side, and do what is right. History is filled with commissioners who did not always cave into public opinion and instead used their own moral compasses and belief in what was right.

Deflategate is a perfect example of a commissioner without principles. Most of the owners did not even read the Wells Report and just relied on Goodell, but Goodell relied on the opinions of several power owners with an axe to grind. A competent commissioner certainly would have put his foot down early on in the process and told both the Patriots and their persecutors, "look, I know you are mad, but I am going to make this judgement based on the facts." We know that didn't happen. Goodell is just a politician who serves the whims of whichever owners can offer him longer survival in his role...and again, a lot of this is brought about by a culture of compromise and pragmatism, with no regard to right and wrong. Can't say I believe Kraft is not responsible for any way in the way the league office has fallen to such low depths. He has proven to be someone who does whatever is necessary to keep the income flowing and diffusing conflict, even if it flies in the face of justice and fairness.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

A fruitless appeal to the scumbag Goodell and then the nuclear option that could blow up in his face. That's the plan your laying forth.

As opposed to what? Giving up? Yes. You don't give up the right to appeal from the start. It leaves you without any other options.

 

[IllegalContact]

Yet you are extremely concerned with what others think of Kraft.

Newsflash here, I doubt anyone in this thread gives a **** of what Kraft thinks of them (whatever you mean by that) or roots for or against the owner. It's about a particular action that he chose that went against the best interests of the team.

not at all......I'm just making light of the incredible ignorance displayed with the notion that it is hard to root for Kraft because he doesn't get up and make a fool of himself

the most ridiculous thing is how much importance you place on making sure everyone here understands how angry you are

 

[IllegalContact]

As opposed to what? Giving up? Yes. You don't give up the right to appeal from the start. It leaves you without any other options.

and yet almost a year after the option of an appeal has passed, here you are.......how long you gonna keep this vigil going?

EDIT: And then there the real pathetic ones like @ReverendMaynard and @flasox27

 

[OhExaulted1]

As opposed to what? Giving up? Yes. You don't give up the right to appeal from the start. It leaves you without any other options.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

not at all......I'm just making light of the incredible ignorance displayed with the notion that it is hard to root for Kraft because he doesn't get up and make a fool of himself

the most ridiculous thing is how much importance you place on making sure everyone here understands how angry you are

Not angry at all. It's called having an opinion and it is being discussed in an appropriate Patriots forum. You simply can't debate a topic intelligently without name calling and exaggerations.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I think we've reached the point where people can just agree to disagree. This thread is just a recycling of the greatest hits from a handful of posters.

 

[IllegalContact]

I think we've reached the point where people can just agree to disagree. This thread is just a recycling of the greatest hits from a handful of posters.

next time think twice about starting this garbage

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

next time think twice about starting this garbage

LoL...says the guy who spends every waking second like a possessed zombie waiting to re-post the same points hundreds of times. You should be thanking me for providing you with an outlet for all of your pent up rage and aggression for a full week. I don't know what's next for you...maybe you can just re-read this thread over and over again for eternity?

 

[IllegalContact]

LoL...says the guy who spends every waking second like a possessed zombie waiting to re-post the same points hundreds of times. You should be thanking me for providing you with an outlet for all of your pent up rage and aggression for a full week. I don't know what's next for you...maybe you can just re-read this thread over and over again for eternity?

WTF do you expect when you keep trying to make the same meaningless point

do you think smashing your head on a rock once more will yield the same result........you're the one still going off about something thats almost a year old

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

WTF do you expect when you keep trying to make the same meaningless point

do you think smashing your head on a rock once more will yield the same result........you're the one still going off about something thats almost a year old

Here's some advice: if you don't like the thread and the premise, don't click on it. In fact, just use the option to ignore the thread. Clearly the thread provided you with plenty of room to voice your opinion, which was strangely very important to reiterate considering how little you claim you care about something that happened so long ago. If you want to disagree with the premise, go ahead. If you want to ***** and moan that people are creating threads and posting ideas not to your liking, or are no longer relevant, or have already been discussed, you come across as petty.

 

[OhExaulted1]

I think we've reached the point where people can just agree to disagree. This thread is just a recycling of the greatest hits from a handful of posters.

Agreed. I thought it was a worthwhile debate, nonetheless.

I think we can all agree on one thing: Roger Goodell is most hated person in all of Patriot Nation.

He's responsible for the very reason this almost 600 post thread even existed.

 

[flasox27]

and yet almost a year after the option of an appeal has passed, here you are.......how long you gonna keep this vigil going?

EDIT: And then there the real pathetic ones like @ReverendMaynard and @flasox27

Telling the truth is only pathetic to people like yourself without any cajones to fight for principles. By the way did anyone ever teach you grammar? You should use an adverb "really" to modify an adjective like "pathetic"not another adjective like real.

 

[IllegalContact]

Telling the truth is only pathetic to people like yourself without any cajones to fight for principles. By the way did anyone ever teach you grammar? You should use an adverb "really" to modify an adjective like "pathetic"not another adjective like real.

English my second language......you don't know what the truth is.....run along and play with the dislike button

 

[IllegalContact]

Here's some advice: if you don't like the thread and the premise, don't click on it. In fact, just use the option to ignore the thread. Clearly the thread provided you with plenty of room to voice your opinion, which was strangely very important to reiterate considering how little you claim you care about something that happened so long ago. If you want to disagree with the premise, go ahead. If you want to ***** and moan that people are creating threads and posting ideas not to your liking, or are no longer relevant, or have already been discussed, you come across as petty.

The same can be said about Kraft....if you don't like him, don't talk about him.....the thread starts out petty, so there's nowhere for it to go.....Except for pointing the sheer futility/stupidity out

 

[IcyPatriot]

The concept/reality of what the team is .... that's very different to Kraft than it is to the fans ... for better or worse ownership means a marriage to 31 other interests that directly effect each other. Add to that the petty jealousy rampant amongst other owners and it's amazing that they can even co-exist with each other for profit. I'm in the minority of those who believes Mr. Kraft deserves more respect from some fans ... whatever ...

I'll get some more disagrees for that opinion ... a badge of honor IMO. Older fans such as I have some different opinions than younger fans. I never expected to win a Super Bowl ... we have 4 of them in addition to other titles. Mr. Kraft is a huge part of that and he's had missteps along the way in the eyes of some ... well nobody is perfect. Loss of a draft pick ... that's like a blackhead amongst a face of sits - trivial.

.... and since when are any corporations run 100% by barometer of morality?
They all have danced with the devil so to speak .. some more and some less.

Brady and the patriots are 100% innocent .... no question.
However reading the rules to the refs before every game wasn't the brightest move either.

 

[Jackson 2]

The concept/reality of what the team is .... that's very different to Kraft than it is to the fans ... for better or worse ownership means a marriage to 31 other interests that directly effect each other. Add to that the petty jealousy rampant amongst other owners and it's amazing that they can even co-exist with each other for profit. I'm in the minority of those who believes Mr. Kraft deserves more respect from some fans ... whatever ...

I'll get some more disagrees for that opinion ... a badge of honor IMO. Older fans such as I have some different opinions than younger fans. I never expected to win a Super Bowl ... we have 4 of them in addition to other titles. Mr. Kraft is a huge part of that and he's had missteps along the way in the eyes of some ... well nobody is perfect. Loss of a draft pick ... that's like a blackhead amongst a face of sits - trivial.

.... and since when are any corporations run 100% by barometer of morality?
They all have danced with the devil so to speak .. some more and some less.

Brady and the patriots are 100% innocent .... no question.
However reading the rules to the refs before every game wasn't the brightest move either.

I'm also a guy who has been around seemingly forever. I just keep wondering how long Bob Kraft is going to be vilified here. What do his critics want? For him to petition Goodell and the NFL for the return of the picks? Not happening, too late. For him to sell the team in shame? Not happening. For sonny boy Jonathan to take over and kick ass? Not happening. And believe me, no sane Pats fan wants that to happen right now. Bob Kraft f##### up. He's acknowledged that. Believe me, no one was more pissed off than I was when Kraft went to that microphone and capitulated. But, the idiotic mindset that calls for him to step aside and the more idiotic mindset that discredits everything good that he's done since buying this team is disgraceful and moronic. Those late to the show who've only known success since 2001 are entitled to be entitled. What they aren't is entitled to is to claim that Bob Kraft is a ****ty owner. He isn't. In fact, his entire body of work suggests that he is one of the greatest owners in the history of the NFL. When it comes to this topic, this thread has largely resembled what one would expect from an infants' nursery.