Roster Acquisitions - Next Step: Defense

[Ring 6]

No games today but we have no money and very little defense. Finding $10M under the seat cushions and rearranging the deck chairs will not turn this group into a defense that can challenge for the division imo. Having trouble with unfamiliar settings to recalibrate expectations. Fire away.

Defense will be fine. It always has been.
Top 10 in 15 of the last 16 years, top 5 in 7 of them.

 

[jimnance]

I like when the old timers reminisce. I'm one of them. When I was a kid growing up in the suburbs of the 50s and 60s, we used to challenge the street opposite ours in a version of the Olympics. We were South and they were North. Between the two streets we must have had two dozen kids all around the same age. Now when I go back to visit there I don't think there are ten kids total of all ages living on those streets combined.

I started watching NYFL games in the 50s when we were force-fed Giants' games. But one look at Jimmy Brown and I became a Browns fan. I'm pretty sure that @DarrylS travelled that same path. Once the Pats came to be I was a fan and I'm still one today. It's been a great ride.

That's funny. When the Pats were created,they got my loyalty. I also dumped the NYG and became a Browns fan cuz of Jim Brown. But once the SBs came along, I hated the NFL, like most AFL fans. The only time I ever pulled for the Jests was that SB. They represented all of us. It took many years b4 my NFL hate died.
Only those who lived through it know what I'm talking about

 

[patfanken]

Since I am ALSO "of that age" who can remember watching the giants on TV growing up, but still rooting for the Browns in there often epic battles with the NY team. But my allegiance to the Browns was mostly because the had a player from UMass whose name I forget. I was a wicked homer back then and still am. I always root more for someone who had local roots.....and hate AL NYC teams rabidly.

But getting back to the Pats defense. I am a Hicks/Flowers guy, and EVERY day that goes by lowers their cost. I'm hoping we can eventually get a deal that would bring BOTH to NE for about $10MM combined for the 2022 season Granted we currently can't even sign our draft picks with our cap space so hopefully we start to hear some players getting their contracts readjusted to the create space needed so sign a few more FA's

I DON'T think we will be in the market for a guy like Clowney, but Ogunjobi and Ferrell COULD be in the picture (good job @DW Toys) for all the reasons Toys mentioned. Bottom line there still are some very good options out there that could improve the talent level of the Pats DL.

BTW- I'm actually more than a little excited about the face of our current LB group. Between McMillan McGrone, Uche and Wilson we have 4 guys who can really fly around the 2nd level, something we haven't see from a Pats LB group in.......FOREVER. I'm not entirely sure it will work but it will be VERY interesting to follow. As well as the progress of Perkins and Jennings

I don't get the Wise hate. Wise had developed into a pretty good SITUATIONAL player. I don't see him as a full time starter though, but as a situational player he has performed pretty well in my opinion.

As for in house additions, Cowart and Anderson coming back from IR COULD provide a big upgrade to the DL IF they pan out. I always thought the early loss of Anderson was a bigger loss than it was made to be seen.

 

[venecol]

Hicks signs with Bucs. So much for that. As I've been saying, don't see Pats signing anyone else aside from middling bargains.

 

[venecol]

What about Suh? He's still got gas and doesn't miss games.

 

[mgteich]

Hicks signs with Bucs. So much for that. As I've been saying, don't see Pats signing anyone else aside from middling bargains.

I don't know, but I don't think that Belichick was willing pay as much. Besides, maybe Hicks like the idea of playing the TB defense.

 

[venecol]

I don't know, but I don't think that Belichick was willing pay as much. Besides, maybe Hicks like the idea of playing the TB defense.

That's just it, Belichick isn't willing to pay as much for anyone. The cash spigot has been shut closed. Kraft told him to make it work with his former draftees and whomever he could bring in under the cap. That's why the Mason trade happened. The Parker trade as well. Swapping Wino for Wilson. Somehow getting Brown to agree to a low ball offer, etc. Pats have $500k in cap space and mini camp starts next week. Sure, there's plenty of time to pull something off but all signs indicate it won't be a talented player that has interest from other teams. He's probably waiting to finalize a trade for Harry a/o Agholor to free more cap space. This roster is basically it. Very few talented vets left anyway.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

That's just it, Belichick isn't willing to pay as much for anyone. The cash spigot has been shut closed. Kraft told him to make it work with his former draftees and whomever he could bring in under the cap. That's why the Mason trade happened. The Parker trade as well. Swapping Wino for Wilson. Somehow getting Brown to agree to a low ball offer, etc. Pats have $500k in cap space and mini camp starts next week. Sure, there's plenty of time to pull something off but all signs indicate it won't be a talented player that has interest from other teams. He's probably waiting to finalize a trade for Harry a/o Agholor to free more cap space. This roster is basically it. Very few talented vets left anyway.

Probably middling FAs as you say. The Offense is a year away so BB will save the cap room until 2023 and spend it then to fill out the team once he sees what he has. Lots of LBs, but the DL has Godchaux and Guy who are on expiring contracts. Wise (28 this year) and Barmore are left. Maybe Flowers (29 this year) since he is this side of thirty for 2 years, but $10M (that is up to $10M which could mean anything) for Hicks is really high. I thought the Bucs were bringing back Suh (but he is 35 years old so that is a real stretch). BB will not sign a 35 year old DL when the Pats are a year away with their offense - BB will save the money for next year.

 

[1960Pats]

I also became an NFL fan by watching the Browns, while the Giants were continually available, there was something about that storied franchise with Jim Brown that caught my eye. Also the influence of my best friends father played a huge role in helping me understand the game who was a Browns fan. Stayed loyal to Cleveland until the Jets won the Superbowl in 1969, then I knew the AFL was for real, so I became a die hard Pats fan.

Some of the early escapades of the Pats did not entice me to become a loyalist, many incidents verged on comical. No home, recruiting players from the stadium etc. etc.

One of the worse episodes as a long time fan was in the 90's when I would go to work on Sunday and all the Giants fans and Dallas fans would be there in their "puff coats", there was no Pats gear available... in '85 there were a few "Squish the Fish T-Shirts" available, but that was about it. I always brought my walkman to work, as the games were blacked out due to low attendance. Admired the jobs that Gil & Gino did announcing in the 90's. Guys I worked with thought I was a degenerate gambler, but I was just an avid fan.

Sorry I missed this response the first time. I knew we travelled a similar path. The only difference was that by the time the Jets played in the SB I was anti NFL and pulling hard for the Jets. After they won and KC followed that up the following year with another SB win I was in 7th heaven after years of the AFL being mocked.

On Sundays during the seasons when there were blackouts our pretty large golf group played at courses that were outside the blackout distance. We usually played in NH. We found a way to watch other than skipping golf and going to the game.

Looking back on it all now I'd say that us Pats fans finished way ahead in the overall scheme of things. The Pats can make a legitimate claim to being the greatest team in NFL history and no other original AFL team is even close. Thanks to them all.

 

[1960Pats]

Bill seldom asks my opinion. He did say it was okay for me to have one.

He's such an interesting guy. In any dream foursome for a round of golf he'd be there.

 

[p8ryts]

Sorry I missed this response the first time. I knew we travelled a similar path. The only difference was that by the time the Jets played in the SB I was anti NFL and pulling hard for the Jets. After they won and KC followed that up the following year with another SB win I was in 7th heaven after years of the AFL being mocked.

On Sundays during the seasons when there were blackouts our pretty large golf group played at courses that were outside the blackout distance. We usually played in NH. We found a way to watch other than skipping golf and going to the game.

Looking back on it all now I'd say that us Pats fans finished way ahead in the overall scheme of things. The Pats can make a legitimate claim to being the greatest team in NFL history and no other original AFL team is even close. Thanks to them all.

My fandom had a similar trajectory. The Jets Super Bowl win remains one of my favorite games. The 60's Pats will always be the "Little Engine That Could". The San Diego blowout will always be one of my least favorite games.

 

[venecol]

 

[mgteich]

That's just it, Belichick isn't willing to pay as much for anyone. The cash spigot has been shut closed. Kraft told him to make it work with his former draftees and whomever he could bring in under the cap. That's why the Mason trade happened. The Parker trade as well. Swapping Wino for Wilson. Somehow getting Brown to agree to a low ball offer, etc. Pats have $500k in cap space and mini camp starts next week. Sure, there's plenty of time to pull something off but all signs indicate it won't be a talented player that has interest from other teams. He's probably waiting to finalize a trade for Harry a/o Agholor to free more cap space. This roster is basically it. Very few talented vets left anyway.

Please list the teams that have spent more on free agents in the last two years. Please especially note the playoff teams that have spent more than we have.

It is total fiction to believe that patriots haven't been spending since Brady has been gone.

 

[mgteich]

The patriots move money into the future cap years (make space) when they need the cap money.

There is $22.5M available through six restructures. This just reduces the cap money for the future. On issue is that we could be negotiating extensions with these players rather than restructures with these players and others. There is no reason to restructure just so that message board posters see that the money is available. There is flexibility in waiting.

Our cap situation does NOT restrict Belichick from making any signing that he believes is right for the team.

 

[venecol]

Please list the teams that have spent more on free agents in the last two years. Please especially note the playoff teams that have spent more than we have.

It is total fiction to believe that patriots haven't been spending since Brady has been gone.

I'm talking about this season. Clearly, but that's the point, Belichick shot his load last season and Kraft said make it work w/ what you have and any other moves within the cap. If this isn't apparent I don't know what to tell you.

 

[venecol]

The patriots move money into the future cap years (make space) when they need the cap money.

There is $22.5M available through six restructures. This just reduces the cap money for the future. On issue is that we could be negotiating extensions with these players rather than restructures with these players and others. There is no reason to restructure just so that message board posters see that the money is available. There is flexibility in waiting.

Our cap situation does NOT restrict Belichick from making any signing that he believes is right for the team.

Well they obviously will have to do something since they have the lowest cap space available ($482k) so they can finish signing their draft class.

What flexibility is there in waiting? The last few remaining talented FAs are being signed while we maintain our flexibility.

Restructures is not the only way they can use to clear cap space. They can also cut or trade players, which is probably more likely the way I see it.

 

[Zuma]

Kraft said make it work w/ what you have and any other moves within the cap.

Really ?

 

[mgteich]

Well they obviously will have to do something since they have the lowest cap space available ($482k) so they can finish signing their draft class.

What flexibility is there in waiting? The last few remaining talented FAs are being signed while we maintain our flexibility.

Restructures is not the only way they can use to clear cap space. They can also cut or trade players, which is probably more likely the way I see it.

I'll try one more time.

If Belichick had a deal to sign today, there would be a restructure posted by 4PM.

To me, it is downright silly to restructure someone instead continue to negoatiate a possible extension, hich will also free up cap space.

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

Clearly Belichick has acknowledged some thing we all know. The patriots will not be seriously contending for AFC championship or Super Bowl this year. He wants to see what he has with the players that he has and next year will be the time for a big free agency splash. What is the point in signing expensive veterans for one year deals when you and I and everyone on this board knows they likely will not even make the playoffs. So it all makes sense.

 

[venecol]

I'll try one more time.

If Belichick had a deal to sign today, there would be a restructure posted by 4PM.

To me, it is downright silly to restructure someone instead continue to negoatiate a possible extension, hich will also free up cap space.

I'll try one more time.

It doesn't look like they want to push money into 2023, so an extension or restructure is less likely than a cut or trade.

Who do you think Belichick would sign at this point? You keep saying he'll probably sign a vet for OL or DL depth. Who are these vets?