Reading the Tea Leaves on Mayo and Wolf (Personal Speculation)

[TheRainMaker]

By 1996, I would've done the exact thing that Kraft did regarding Parcells.

Posters have mentioned that Kraft didn't like the FA's Parcells was bringing in. Not sure what they had to do with the drafts because Parcells had one of the best drafts in team history in 1995.

Remember, in 1995, Parcells met with the Jets PRIOR to the NFL draft. After coming back from the meeting with them, Parcells went to Kraft and asked that Kraft reduce his contract to 1 yr and his buyout clause. Kraft did that. But there were rumors about Parcells and the Jets already. It would have been madness to allow the future head coach of your arch rival to select your players when you had very high draft picks.

Were the NFL rules for tampering lenient back then? That's pretty ****ty move by Parcells.

Add to that Will McDonough's contention that Parcells intended to draft a dud like Cedric Jones over Terry Glenn, and we should be happy that Parcells slammed the door on his way out of the draft room.

He may have wanted Jones, but he was taken before the Pats pick so it was a moot point. Most believe it was Tony Brackens that Parcells wanted. While the Glenn pick ignited their Super Bowl run, keeping Parcells happy would've been the better long term move. He would've made up for it as he did in his prior drafts and proven with his drafts with the Jets.

I'll speculate a couple of things that make me suspicious of both men: Parcells has always been a guy who wants to leave teams early. He tried to break out of his Giants contract. He did it with the Patriots. He did some dastardly stuff to Belichick at the end with the Jets. Then he bolted the Jets GM position to coach the Cowboys.

What did he do to Belichick? How did they appoint BB to HC when he didn't ask for it? Did he have a successor clause like Mayo?

That's the only thing I didn't like about Parcells is that he tapped out of teams too early. He took his anger out on the Pats leading up to the Super Bowl and quit on the Jets just because. The only exception was his time in Dallas as Jerry was starting to not like being 2nd in the spot light to Parcells. He wanted to take control back and that's why Bill left. That was a massive mistake by Jerry as that 2007 team would've made the Super Bowl with Parcells.

 

[Grogan1980]

My first choice would be Ben Johnson and you bring former Patriot and assistant GM Ray Agnew with him as the GM.

My second choice is Vrabel. Knows the town, can fix the defense, etc. I'd make sure you can align the GM to him so there's a good working relationship.

My third choice is Brian Flores. He got a raw deal in Miami and I think he's going to make somebody an excellent HC. He would also come in and fix the defense.

They're in the perfect position to trade down, get a haul for #1 and do a major fast overhaul when you couple that with how much cap space they have. The time is now. If Roberts screws this up we'll waste that opportunity and all of Drake Maye's rookie deal. As much as I think Mayo needs to go the front GM and scouting department need to go more.

 

[TheRainMaker]

His first 2-3 years were fine drafting-wise. After that is was BB esque.

I blame ownership and Robinson on the Brown trade.

Yep, 2020-2022 were really bad.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Was Kraft the point of blame on Martin or Bobby Grier? In fact, it might have been Grier and not Kraft who bragged about keeping Martin on the RFA tender.

And I don't look at Parcells, Martin, or Brady being emotional decisions. It was emotional for Parcells, Martin, and Brady, but I don't see how it was for Kraft.

Kraft sided with Grier about who was shopping for the groceries. Parcells was pissed he was over ruled.

The Pats made a business decision to squeeze on more year out of Martin before giving him a new deal (something Belichick would have done dispassionately) and Martin felt disrespected.

Brady wanted a longer term deal. Kraft sided with Belichick about not giving him a long term deal because of his age. If anything, the emotional part of it was giving Brady an out where he could walk after one year when he didn't have to. It was Brady who was upset his entire last year here and left as soon as he could because he felt slighted.

The point was that Kraft has made emotional decisions after his business decisions failed. He needed someone to blame. We will find out soon who he blames after he fires Mayo.

 

[Ross12]

Great points. Love Flo. Thought he got a bad rap in MIA. Chris Grier is a POS.

You might be right about Maye. Def isn't as much of a 'dona like Tua.

I like him too. He’s a masterful DC and really feels like the second coming of Bill in some ways. He brings the culture with him. He’s a serious hardass but he also seems like guys can relate to him since he is younger. He’s also his own guy and isn’t just trying to be like Bill. My one concern would be that he didn’t really handle the OC situation very well in Miami. Hopefully he would have a better plan this time.

And not for nothing, but if Kraft has some level of reservations about firing a black coach after 1 year to replace him with a white coach, hiring another black coach maybe makes him more comfortable? Just trying to put myself in his mind.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I like him too. He’s a masterful DC and really feels like the second coming of Bill in some ways. He brings the culture with him. He’s a serious hardass but he also seems like guys can relate to him since he is younger. He’s also his own guy and isn’t just trying to be like Bill. My one concern would be that he didn’t really handle the OC situation very well in Miami. Hopefully he would have a better plan this time.

And not for nothing, but if Kraft has some level of reservations about firing a black coach after 1 year to replace him with a white coach, hiring another black coach maybe makes him more comfortable? Just trying to put myself in his mind.

It's sad to think skin color factors into hiring decisions but I don't think you are wrong.

 

[Rob0729]

If your criteria to hire a coach is what he has won? Outside of McVay and Reid then we shouldn’t hire anybody.

Vrabel has been voted coach of the year, has been to an AFCCG and has been the 1 seed with Tannehill and beat a Brady/Belichick team multiple times. That’s better than 80% of the coaches in this league

I wasn't the one who put that he won as a reason to qualify him or disqualify him. I am responding to someone who did. I don't necessarily use that as a criteria.

My biggest want for the next Patriots head coach is to modernize this offense and bring the Patriots to the 2020s to what it takes to win in today's NFL. That means more offense. Not sure if that is Vrabel. I really defensive head coach unless he comes with an offensive genius OC.

 

[Rob0729]

He is a 10x upgrade over Mayo. I'd like to see him with an actual QB.

He is an upgrade. Doesn't mean that is what I am looking for in a head coach. As I said in my last post, I don't want Vrabel unless he brings in a great OC who can innovate this offense and build around Maye.

Everyone is saying pair Vrabel with McDaniels. That would make me sick to my stomach. I love McDaniels, but his style of offense is getting outdated and doesn't play into Maye's strengths.

 

[Rob0729]

The point was that Kraft has made emotional decisions after his business decisions failed. He needed someone to blame. We will find out soon who he blames after he fires Mayo.

Again what emotional decision did he make after Parcells, Martin, or Brady left? He did fire Belichick four years after Brady left. But was that emotional? He even let Belichick make Patricia the OC in between which was a fire-able offense in itself.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Again what emotional decision did he make after Parcells, Martin, or Brady left? He did fire Belichick four years after Brady left. But was that emotional? He even let Belichick make Patricia the OC in between which was a fire-able offense in itself.

His decisions to part with Parcells and Martin led to the Pats having embarrassing home loses to the Jets in 1998 and 1999. The Jets tormented them between 1997-1999. That and them missing the playoffs in 1999 led to Kraft firing Carroll.

His decision to let Brady walk over minimum wage QB salary led to the firing of BB. Many seem to forget how embarrassing it was for the Pats when Brady won in Tampa in 2020.

 

[Family]

One of Belichick's associates (I guess Lombardi) revealed a parting shot from Belichick maybe a month later after he was fired. Belichick said the Krafts "think they know football..."

Either you do or you don't. I trust Belichick's assessment that they don't.

Until you get someone who knows what they're doing, things aren't likely to change.

Coaches have to have expertise. You can't just stick anyone in there. But the fact you fired Belichick and installed an incapable person because you thought you knew football, well that doesn't bode well for the future. There will be absolutely no confidence at all in anything the Kraft's do until someone who knows football is there to make the decisions.

I compare this to the Bills. They kept firing their coaches until the very moment they let someone else make the decisions, and then instantly they found a guy who could coach.

No owner knows football. It's not their job. It's an unfair rap.

In about a week we will know if they know enough to put their trust into someone else.

The judgement the first time was flawed. OK. They made a mistake. But they knew enough to stay out of BB and Brady's way for 6 Super Bowls.

So they deserve some slack until we know what they do.

 

[Rob0729]

His decisions to part with Parcells and Martin led to the Pats having embarrassing home loses to the Jets in 1998 and 1999. The Jets tormented them between 1997-1999. That and them missing the playoffs in 1999 led to Kraft firing Carroll.

His decision to let Brady walk over minimum wage QB salary led to the firing of BB. Many seem to forget how embarrassing it was for the Pats when Brady won in Tampa in 2020.

Kraft never decided to part with either Parcells or Martin. Parcells and Martin both decided to leave based on emotions. Parcells gave Martin a poison pill contract (illegal today) to Martin to make it so the Pats couldn't match the Jets' offer.

And them going to the Jets did not lead to Carroll's firing (which was one of the best things that happened to the Patriots in the last three decades because without that firing, no Belichick). Carroll's firing was because he was a weak leader who the players didn't respect and undermined him with Bobby Grier. It had nothing to do with Kraft's emotions or Parcells or Martin. You do realize that the Pats went 9-7 and 8-8 in the 1998 and 1999 seasons and only played the Jets twice each year? And the Pats went 1-1 against the Jets in 1999. And the Pats won the AFC East in 1997.

Brady left the Patriots in 2020. Belichick was fired in 2024. Stop it. Belichick wanted Brady gone anyway. Belichick, not Kraft, wanted Brady gone.

You are now rewriting history.

 

[Hyped]

I agree that the Krafts are waiting until after Sunday’s finale to make an evaluation.

I agree that whatever they decide to do..it has to be done on Monday because we need to interview head coaches to meet the Rooney mandates. And that is only if we clean house.

As for replacing coordinators….not sure about that. Yeah, the offense looked terrible…but I am OK with AVP. That 3rd and 1/4th and 1 in Arizona wasn’t his fault….an average offense should be able to convert a single yard on two tries. And I fear that a new coordinator will stun Maye’s development much like it did for Mac Jones (McD to Patricia/Judge to BoB). So, if we are gonna replace AVP and Covington….then I’d rather clean house.

As for replacing Wolf…..who would replace him? Who is out there? And we would still be using Wolf’s draft board as well as the input from our scouts who have been working for the past year…..

For me, it is a 100% clean house or staying the course…..and it has to be done quickly and decisively.

 

[Family]

I really don't see a better outcome or something remotely palatable to the Krafts.

Kraft is on record as saying he liked the operation that was in place but felt there needed to be more distribution of power. I think Vrabes would be OK with that.

Kraft loves Josh.

Also I think Kraft is a little paranoid about being stabbed in the back if things go bad, which is a risk if he goes outside of his comfort zone of choices.

 

[Family]

I am not sure that Brady wanted a piece of the Patriots. But if he did and Kraft refused to give it to him, it is another example of Kraft putting business over emotions. Selling part of the team unless you need money is a bad business decision.

Kraft couldn't have given him a piece of the team because of salary cap considerations.

I've never heard it mentioned, but with Brady always giving up salary, maybe it was too risky to allow him ownership in the team later on.

 

[Rob0729]

Kraft couldn't have given him a piece of the team because of salary cap considerations.

I've never heard it mentioned, but with Brady always giving up salary, maybe it was too risky to allow him ownership in the team later on.

I think it was after he retired that he was talking about.

But the fact is few owners want minority owners if they don't need them. Having Brady as a minority owner is for PR reasons more than anything else. Hence why teams like the Raiders and Dolphins do it when most don't. Both are in areas where celebrity and showmanship is king.

Personally, I don't think Brady ever really liked New England. Not the team or fans, but living in the area. I don't think he wants to come back there on a regular basis. I think being in Vegas is conducive to his single lifestyle more. I tend to think owning part of the Patriots was never in his wish list.

 

[upstater1]

What did he do to Belichick? How did they appoint BB to HC when he didn't ask for it? Did he have a successor clause like Mayo?

Belichick was offered the HC position with the Raiders in 1998, but Parcells and the Jets lured him back by paying him the highest amount ever for an assistant at the time ($1m a year) and assuring him he would be the HC when Parcells retired (Parcells already had one foot out the door).

People interpret this as a succession plan but from Belichick's perspective, it wasn't that at all. He simply didn't want to go coach under Al Davis in what would likely have been his final chance to coach in the NFL.

 

[upstater1]

No owner knows football. It's not their job. It's an unfair rap.

In about a week we will know if they know enough to put their trust into someone else.

The judgement the first time was flawed. OK. They made a mistake. But they knew enough to stay out of BB and Brady's way for 6 Super Bowls.

So they deserve some slack until we know what they do.

??

Belichick was supposed to have said "they think they know football."

He wasn't criticizing them for not knowing football.

I also don't think Kraft stayed out of BBs way. That much was evident in the Dynasty.

 

[upstater1]

I think it was after he retired that he was talking about.

But the fact is few owners want minority owners if they don't need them. Having Brady as a minority owner is for PR reasons more than anything else. Hence why teams like the Raiders and Dolphins do it when most don't. Both are in areas where celebrity and showmanship is king.

Personally, I don't think Brady ever really liked New England. Not the team or fans, but living in the area. I don't think he wants to come back there on a regular basis. I think being in Vegas is conducive to his single lifestyle more. I tend to think owning part of the Patriots was never in his wish list.

He built a huge house in Brookline

 

[TheRainMaker]

Kraft never decided to part with either Parcells or Martin. Parcells and Martin both decided to leave based on emotions. Parcells gave Martin a poison pill contract (illegal today) to Martin to make it so the Pats couldn't match the Jets' offer.

The poison pill contract never happens had the Pats been more aggressive to retain Martin. Bob was bragging to the media in 1997 that Martin was "cheap labor". The only reason Parcells stepped in was because he knew the Pats had no intention of signing him long term. If you were one of the best RB's in the league, but offered 6 years $12M (mediocre RB money), that would upset you too.

And them going to the Jets did not lead to Carroll's firing (which was one of the best things that happened to the Patriots in the last three decades because without that firing, no Belichick). Carroll's firing was because he was a weak leader who the players didn't respect and undermined him with Bobby Grier. It had nothing to do with Kraft's emotions or Parcells or Martin.

The locker room was divided on Carroll, only because they were used to Parcells hard approach and the rest of the AFC was starting to catch up to them by 1998. They would've been the #2 seed and in the AFCCG game in 1997 had Martin, Glenn and McGinest not been injured during the season. The roster had deteriorated by 1999 and yet they were 2 missed kicks away from being 10-6. In Carroll's words, he was screwed over.

Brady left the Patriots in 2020. Belichick was fired in 2024. Stop it. Belichick wanted Brady gone anyway. Belichick, not Kraft, wanted Brady gone.

You are now rewriting history.

Brady gave Bob a chance to pay him what he wanted, but he didn't do it. Bill wasn't going to throw a fit and leave because Brady was going to stay for 2 more years. That's ridiculous. Tom got fed up and demanded he franchise tag clause be removed after the 2019 season or he was going to sit out (according to Brian Hoyer) and Bob obliged.