Question????

[Born_a_Patriot]

It seems clear Tom isn't having the success he's enjoyed the last five years, at least early this season.

My question is to all those Pat fans that think Tom Brady was 90% responsible for the SB success of the past three SB's and labling him one of the best QB's ever, he seems quite normal and not very spectacular so far this season which leads me to believe it was more about the Pats as a team that won three SB's and not "God ol Brady".

As I've stated in previous threads, Brady was an important part of those SB's, but not any more important then any other part of the Pats "TEAM". There is no way Brady will ever be half the QB Dan Marino was and if Brady had to suffer through the years and teams Marino had Brady would not only never reach one single milestone Marino reached, but most definately never have a single SB.

Now before you people start crying, and looking to sling insults this thread was not intended to do so, it was intended to prove without the caliber of caoching and talent that Brady has had the fortune to have around him and the fans have had the pleasure of watching there would be no SB's rings in NE.

There are some fans here that are reasonable enough to understand that it took an entire team effort to win three SB's in 5 years, but they are few and far between. I still think the Pats are the best team in the division....for the moment, but I also believe the division is up for grabs. NE could very well turn it all around and start to pull away and win the division with ease, but they could also continue down this path of just plain average.

So before you Pat fans get your panties in a knot and think this was a smack thread, it's not! It's just a thread to say Football is a team sport and anyone here who thinks Brady was the main reason for the success in NE the last five seasons you should be shot as football fans, because there were a whole lotta good football players that played in NE the last five years that are getting little respect for their efforts. The reason Peyton Manning hasn't won a SB yet is because his entire team isn't good enough to win it all, it sure isn't because Peyton isn't good enough.

No one man can do it all. Brady was not out there wining three super bowls by him self. But that doesn't take away the pain you have felt of us dominating the NFL since 2001. I know it hurts.

Payton Manning is the Dan Marino of this generation. Phil Simms.

 

[zippo59]

Payton Manning is the Dan Marino of this generation. Phil Simms.

That was Boomer Esiason.

 

[Kdo5]

Who did Brady have last year he doesn't have this year?? Brady threw the ball 55 times last night, it was the lack of talent for the gameplan. Brady isn't magic, it's a combination of may things, the more things you lose, the tougher it is to win. NE's strength is now running, lets see how they adjust.

I agree 100%. Brady must get used to his recievers. Maroney cant start popping out 100 yard games without Dillon in there. If we want our running game to look great it involves Dillon. Without Dillon I could see us sitting at 0-3 right now. We need him, otherwise I dont feel good about this.

 

[TomBrady'sGoat]

Yeah, I have to agree that 3 bad games against two great defenses and the Jets proves that Tom Brady is just a system quarterback. Nevermind the previous five years. Nevermind the fact the team had Antwain Smith running the ball 3 of those years, and Dillon was hurt most of another. Nevermind that Brady lost his #s 1 & 2 receivers and hasnt had any time to work with their replacements due to injuries and Gabriel being acquired late. Nevermind the fact that the guy we've seen so far looks nothing like the guy from the last 5 years.

Small sample size be damned; this is an obvious trend. Tom Brady's career as a great QB is over. The smoke has cleared and the mirrors are broken. Maybe we can get a 4th rounder for him since Culpepper got a 2nd and the new Brady is half the quarterback he is.

/sarcasm off

Btw, the tone and derisive sarcasm isn't because you're a Dolphins fan. It's because the thinking behind the original post is stupid. Also stupid is the statement "The Pats can't continue to be the team with the most cap space and expect to win year in and year out" because you take a team which has consistently and wisely spent to the cap, wait for the year where there is a $15M bump to the cap and a correlating overpriced free agent market, and call the team out for not foolishly spending to the cap. The Seahawks also had a ton of cap room until they decided to pay Deion Branch $7M a year. That might make them dedicated to winning this year, but it also puts them at a disadvantage in years to come.

*edit* As for the team stuff, I do wholeheartedly agree that Brady wins nothing without the team. I also know that the team wins nothing without Brady. He was and is the single most important player on the Patriots. That being said he never made St. Louis's receivers afraid to go over the middle. He's never sacked Manning at the most opportune time. He never kicked a game winning field goal. So many different guys have stepped up and every team is a team win and every loss is a team loss. Quarterbacks just happen to be like pitchers and goalies and are more integral to winning than their teammates.

 

[feelthepain]

Yeah, I have to agree that 3 bad games against two great defenses and the Jets proves that Tom Brady is just a system quarterback. Nevermind the previous five years. Nevermind the fact the team had Antwain Smith running the ball 3 of those years, and Dillon was hurt most of another. Nevermind that Brady lost his #s 1 & 2 receivers and hasnt had any time to work with their replacements due to injuries and Gabriel being acquired late. Nevermind the fact that the guy we've seen so far looks nothing like the guy from the last 5 years.

Small sample size be damned; this is an obvious trend. Tom Brady's career as a great QB is over. The smoke has cleared and the mirrors are broken. Maybe we can get a 4th rounder for him since Culpepper got a 2nd and the new Brady is half the quarterback he is.

/sarcasm off

Btw, the tone and derisive sarcasm isn't because you're a Dolphins fan. It's because the thinking behind the original post is stupid. Also stupid is the statement "The Pats can't continue to be the team with the most cap space and expect to win year in and year out" because you take a team which has consistently and wisely spent to the cap, wait for the year where there is a $15M bump to the cap and a correlating overpriced free agent market, and call the team out for not foolishly spending to the cap. The Seahawks also had a ton of cap room until they decided to pay Deion Branch $7M a year. That might make them dedicated to winning this year, but it also puts them at a disadvantage in years to come.

I also said, NE could win the divison easily.

 

[wrangler]

As has been said elsewhere, transition is a hard thing.

2005-2006, for the Pats, is probably the hardest time any team in the NFL has had to adjust to, or will have to adjust to, unless you are totally rebuilding,?

We shall see who the Pats really are in the coming weeks.?

Mores the point, who is Tom Brady, BB, et all.?

Who are the Patriots?????

We shall see.

My concern is the coordinators, if they are concerned with looking bad,......
they, by thier own decisions, will be bad. BB, turn them loose, let the chips fall.

After the bye, let it all hang out. jmo.

 

[CheerforTom]

Yeah, I have to agree that 3 bad games against two great defenses and the Jets proves that Tom Brady is just a system quarterback. Nevermind the previous five years. Nevermind the fact the team had Antwain Smith running the ball 3 of those years, and Dillon was hurt most of another. Nevermind that Brady lost his #s 1 & 2 receivers and hasnt had any time to work with their replacements due to injuries and Gabriel being acquired late. Nevermind the fact that the guy we've seen so far looks nothing like the guy from the last 5 years.

Small sample size be damned; this is an obvious trend. Tom Brady's career as a great QB is over. The smoke has cleared and the mirrors are broken. Maybe we can get a 4th rounder for him since Culpepper got a 2nd and the new Brady is half the quarterback he is.

/sarcasm off

Btw, the tone and derisive sarcasm isn't because you're a Dolphins fan. It's because the thinking behind the original post is stupid. Also stupid is the statement "The Pats can't continue to be the team with the most cap space and expect to win year in and year out" because you take a team which has consistently and wisely spent to the cap, wait for the year where there is a $15M bump to the cap and a correlating overpriced free agent market, and call the team out for not foolishly spending to the cap. The Seahawks also had a ton of cap room until they decided to pay Deion Branch $7M a year. That might make them dedicated to winning this year, but it also puts them at a disadvantage in years to come.

*edit* As for the team stuff, I do wholeheartedly agree that Brady wins nothing without the team. I also know that the team wins nothing without Brady. He was and is the single most important player on the Patriots. That being said he never made St. Louis's receivers afraid to go over the middle. He's never sacked Manning at the most opportune time. He never kicked a game winning field goal. So many different guys have stepped up and every team is a team win and every loss is a team loss. Quarterbacks just happen to be like pitchers and goalies and are more integral to winning than their teammates.

Great post. Especially the part about the 4th rounder, we should look into that. Come on, we took him in the 6th, good deal!

 

[feelthepain]

My entire point to this thread was to point out if the Pats are going to win the division and go deep into the playoffs, they need to forget about expecting Brady to do it. Watching every Pats game this year the Pats strength on O....at least early isn't throwing the ball, it could change, but for now running the ball is where you deepest in talent. No big deal, so Brady doesn't throw for 4,000 yards or even 3,000 yards, will you care if the running game dominates instead of Brady?? I don't think so. So it brings me back to my original post.

The Pats won three SB in 5 years as a TEAM, not because Brady is the best QB ever. If the Pats need to adjust to their strengths to win, thats what they'll do. Brady's a great QB no one with an ounce of football knowledge will disagree, but if you don't have the supporting talent, it doesn't matter who the QB is. So far this year, your WR haven't done the job. Could that change?? Sure, is it a guarantee?? No. If your team continues to struggle I'll bet a million dollars BB will make more of an effort to run the ball, and the Pats will be successful at it because the Pats didn't lose all their talent just some of their talent.

 

[OldEnglandPatriot]

Reread his opening post and if you find anything reasonable in it go f--k yourself.

I find his opening post (in this thread, I assume you mean) pretty reasonable, at least as opinion.

The ONLY thing I can see in it to get snarly about is the assertion that TB will never be as good as Marino.

Now, clearly I don't agree... but Marino is going to the Hall of Fame (er, did he go in this year? I forget already) despite never winning a Superbowl ring, and was a stunning passer.

 

[feelthepain]

The ONLY thing I can see in it to get snarly about is the assertion that TB will never be as good as Marino.

Now, clearly I don't agree... but Marino is going to the Hall of Fame (er, did he go in this year? I forget already) despite never winning a Superbowl ring, and was a stunning passer.

Not to mention a first ballot HOF'er, You have to understand why I don't think Brady will ever be on Marino's level (As a QB). Marino when he retired owned a very large part of every record ever owned by a QB, will Brady retire owning any QB records??? Maybe, will he own a very large part of those records??? No chance, it's not a knock on Brady, it's a testiment to Marino. Brady doesn't have the same ability's as Marino, again not a knock on Brady, it's just the way it is.

Brady will without a doubt be a first ballot HOF'er even though the SB victories weren't all Brady!! They were team victories, and it starts from game one of the pre-season right through the last snap in the SB,to do it three years out of 5, is an amazing feat, it's just not all because of Brady. I think you could make a claim for a QB being the reason for one single season and a SB victory, but three years out of five, it's clear the Pats as a team was the reaosn NE owns three rings.

Marino never won a SB and only made one apperance in a SB, but has done things that NO QB will ever match. No QB will ever retire with the stats at their position that Marino did, QB's will retire with better stats in some areas but not 90% of those sortable stats. If we are to talk about the QB position and what the individual does.....NOT what the team does because we are talking about the QB not the team. Then you can't even compare Brady to Marino. Below is Marino's reume'.

 

[feelthepain]

All-League Teams

All-Pro: 1984 (AP, PFWA, NEA, SN, PW); 1985 (AP, PFWA, SN); 1986 (AP, PFWA, SN, PW)
All-Pro Second Team: 1983 (AP); 1985 (NEA); 1986 (NEA); 1988 (NEA); 1992 (NEA); 1994 (AP); 1995 (AP)

All-AFC: 1983 (UPI, PW); 1984 (UPI, PW); 1985 (UPI); 1986 (UPI, PW); 1992 (UPI, PW); 1994 (UPI, PW)

All-AFC Second Team: 1995 (UPI)

Pro Bowls

(9) - 1984*, 1985, 1986*, 1987*, 1988*, 1992*, 1993, 1995*, 1996*

* Did not play

All-League Teams

In the NFL Record Book (at time of his retirement following 1999 season)

[1st] Highest Passer Rating, Rookie Season - 96.0 (1983)
[1st] Most Seasons Leading League, Pass Attempts - 5 (1984, 1986, 1988, 1992, 1997)
[1st] Most Passes Attempted, Career - 8,358
[1st] Most Seasons Leading League, Pass Completions - 6 (1984, 1985, 1986, 1988, 1992, 1997)
[1st] Most Passes Completed, Career - 4,967
[1st] Highest Pass Completion Percentage, Rookie Season - 58.45 (1983)
[1st] Most Yards Gained Passing, Career - 61,361
[1st] Most Seasons 3,000 or More Yards Passing - 13
[1st] Most Yards Gained Passing, Season - 5,084 (1984)
[1st] Most Games, 400 or More Yards Passing, Career - 13
[1st] Most Games, 400 or More Yards Passing, Season - 4 (1984)
[1st] Most Games, 300 or More Yards Passing, Career - 63
[1st] Most Touchdown Passes, Career - 420
[1st] Most Touchdown Passes, Season - 48 (1984)
[1st] Most Games, Four or More Touchdown Passes, Career - 21
[1st] Most Games, Four or More Touchdown Passes, Season - 6 (1984)
[1st] Most Consecutive Games, Four or More Touchdown Passes - 4 (1984)
[Tied for 1st] Most Seasons Leading League, Passing Yards - 5 (1984, 1985, 1986, 1988, 1992)
[Tied for 1st] Most Consecutive Games, 400 or More Yards Passing - 2 (1984)
[Tied for 1st] Most Games, 300 or More Yards Passing, Season - 9 (1984)
[Tied for 1st] Most Consecutive Seasons Leading League, Pass Completions - 3 (1984-1986)
[2nd] Most Consecutive Seasons Leading League, Passing Yards - 3 (1984-1986)
[2nd] Most Games, 400 or More Yards Passing, Season - 3 (1986)
[2nd] Most Touchdown Passes, Season - 44 (1986)
[2nd] Most Consecutive Games With a Touchdown Pass - 30 (1985-1987)
[2nd] Lowest Percentage, Passes Intercepted, Rookie Season - 2.03 (1983)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Seasons Leading League, Passing Touchdowns - 3 (1984, 1985, 1986)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Consecutive Seasons Leading League, Passing Touchdowns - 3 (1984-1986)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Games, Four or More Touchdown Passes, Season - 5 (1986)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Fumbles Recovered, Season, Own and Opponents - 8 {7 own, 1 opp} (1988)
[3rd] Most Passes Completed, Season - 385 (1994)
[3rd] Most Yards Gained Passing, Season - 4,746 (1986)
[3rd] Most Touchdown Passes, Rookie Season - 20 (1983)

Super Bowl Records

[2nd] Most Pass Completions, Game - 29 (SB XIX, vs. San Francisco)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Pass Attempts, Game - 50 (SB XIX, vs. San Francisco)

Post-Season Records

[1st] Most Consecutive Games With Touchdown Pass - 13 (1983-1995)
[2nd] Most Pass Attempts, Career - 687
[2nd] Most Passes Completed, Career - 385
[2nd] Most Touchdown Passes, Career - 32
[Tied for 2nd] Most Pass Attempts, Game - 64 (vs. Buffalo, Dec. 30, 1995)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Passes Completed, Game - 33 (vs. Buffalo, Dec. 30, 1995)
[3rd] Most Yards Gained, Career - 4,510
[3rd] Highest Average Gain Passing, Game - 13.16 (vs. Pittsburgh, Jan. 6, 1985)
[3rd] Most Passes Intercepted, Career - 24
[Tied for 3rd] Most Games, 300 or More Yards Passing, Career - 4
[Tied for 3rd] Most Consecutive Games, 300 or More Yards Passing - 2 (1984)
[Tied for 3rd] Most Touchdown Passes, Game - 4 (vs. Pittsburgh, Jan. 6, 1985)

 

[feelthepain]

Team Records

Dolphins' records held by Marino at the time of his retirement following the 1999 season

[1st] Most Seasons - 17
[1st] Most Games Played, Career - 242
[1st] Most Games Started, Career - 240
[1st] Most Pro Bowls - 9
[1st] Most Pro Bowl Starts - 7
[1st] Most Yards Passing, Career - 61,361
[1st] Most Yards Passing, Season - 5,084 (1984)
[1st] Most Yards Passing, Game - 521 (vs. N.Y. Jets, Oct. 23, 1988)
[1st] Most Yards Passing as a Rookie, Season - 2,210 (1983)
[1st] Most Yards Passing as a Rookie, Game - 322 (vs. Buffalo, Oct. 9, 1983)
[1st] Most Passes Attempted, Career - 8,358
[1st] Most Passes Attempted, Season - 623 (1986)
[1st] Most Passes Attempted, Game - 64 (at Buffalo, Dec. 30, 1995 playoff)
[1st] Most Passes Completed, Career - 4,967
[1st] Most Passes Completed, Season - 385 (1994)
[1st] Most Passes Completed, Game - 39 (at Buffalo, Nov. 16, 1986)
[1st] Most Completions as a Rookie, Game - 25 (vs. L.A. Rams, Oct. 30, 1983)
[1st] Most Consecutive Pass Completions - 15 (Nov. 8, 1992 at Indianapolis through Nov. 16, 1992 vs. Buffalo)
[1st] Most Touchdown Passes, Career - 420
[1st] Most Touchdown Passes, Season - 48 (1984)
[1st] Most Touchdown Passes as a Rookie, Season - 20 (1983)
[1st] Most Consecutive Games With a Touchdown Pass - 30 (1985-1987)
[1st] Most Passes Intercepted, Career - 252
[1st] Most Passes Intercepted, Season - 23 (1986, 1988)
[1st] Most Consecutive Attempts Without Pass Interception - 156 (1997)
[1st] Lowest Interception Rate, Career - 3.02
[1st] Highest Completion Percentage, Career - 59.4
[1st] Highest Completion Percentage, Season - 64.2 (1984)
[1st] Highest Completion Percentage As A Rookie - 58.4
[1st] Highest Passer Rating, Career - 86.4
[1st] Highest Passer Rating, Season - 108.9 (1984)
[1st] Highest Passer Rating By A Rookie, Season - 96.0 (1983)
[1st] Most Passes Attempted, Game - 60 (vs. N.Y. Jets, Oct. 23, 1988; at New England, Nov. 23, 1997)
[1st] Most Consecutive 300-Yard Passing Games - 3 (1984, 1988, 1994, 1998)
[1st] Most 300 Yard Passing Games, Career - 63
[1st] Most 300 Yard Passing Games, Season - 9 (1984)
[Tied for 1st] Most Touchdown Passes, Game - 6 (at N.Y. Jets, Sept. 21, 1986)
[Tied for 1st] Most Touchdown Passes as a Rookie, Game - 3 (vs. Buffalo, Oct. 9, 1983; at N.Y. Jets, Oct. 16, 1983; vs. Cincinnati, Nov. 28, 1983)
[Tied for 1st] Most Passes Intercepted, Game - 5 (vs. N.Y. Jets, Oct. 23, 1988; at, Dallas, Nov. 25, 1999)
[Tied for 1st] Most Consecutive Games Without Interception - 4 (1997)
[2nd] Most Yards Passing, Season - 4,746 (1986)
[2nd] Most Yards Passing, Game - 473 (vs. New England, Sept. 4, 1994)
[2nd] Most Yards Passing as a Rookie, Game - 279 (vs. L.A. Rams, Oct. 30, 1983)
[2nd] Most Passes Attempted, Game - 57 (vs. L.A. Raiders, Dec. 2, 1984; vs. N.Y. Jets, Oct. 13, 1998)
[2nd] Most Passes Attempted, Season - 615 (1994)
[2nd] Most Passes Completed, Season - 378 (1986)
[2nd] Most Passes Completed, Game - 38 (at New England, Nov. 23, 1997)
[2nd] Most Completions as a Rookie, Season - 173 (1983)
[2nd] Most Consecutive Pass Completions - 14 (Nov. 17, 1996 at Houston through Nov. 25, 1996 vs. Pittsburgh)
[2nd] Most Touchdown Passes, Season - 44 (1986)
[2nd] Most Touchdown Passes, Game - 5 (at Washington, Sept. 2, 1984; at Green Bay, Dec. 8, 1984; at L.A. Rams, Dec. 14, 1986; at N.Y. Jets, Nov. 27, 1988; vs. New England, Sept. 4, 1994)
[2nd] Most Passes Intercepted, Season - 22 (1989)
[2nd] Lowest Interception Rate, Season - 2.00 (1993)
[2nd] Highest Completion Percentage, Season - 64.1 (1995)
[2nd] Highest Average Gain Passing, Game - 11.92 (vs. St. Louis, Sept. 30, 1984)
[2nd] Highest Passer Rating, Season - 96.0 (1983)
[2nd] Highest Average Gain Passing, Career - 7.34
[2nd] Highest Average Gain Passing, Season - 9.01 (1984)
[2nd] Most 300 Yard Passing Games, Season - 6 (1985, 1986, 1988)
[2nd] Longest Pass Plays - 85 (to Mark Duper, vs. Baltimore, Nov. 20, 1983; to Mark Duper, vs. Houston, Nov. 2, 1986)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Consecutive Pro Bowl Starts - 4
[3rd] Most Consecutive Starts - 95
[3rd] Most Yards Passing, Season - 4,453 (1994)
[3rd] Most Yards Passing, Game - 470 (vs. L.A. Raiders, Dec. 2, 1984)
[3rd] Most Passes Attempted, Season - 606 (1988)
[3rd] Most Passes Attempted as a Rookie, Season - 296 (1983)
[3rd] Most Passes Completed, Season - 362 (1984)
[3rd] Most Passes Completed, Game - 35 (vs. L.A. Raiders, Dec. 2, 1984; vs. N.Y. Jets, Oct. 23, 1988; vs. Atlanta, Dec. 3, 1995)
[3rd] Most Touchdown Passes, Season - 30 (1985, 1994)
[3rd] Most Passes Intercepted, Season - 21 (1985)
[3rd] Lowest Interception Rate, Season - 2.01 (1997)
[3rd] Highest Passer Rating, Season - 95.9
[3rd] Most 300 Yard Passing Games, Season - 5 (1989, 1994)
[3rd] Highest Average Gain Passing, Game - 11.43 (vs. Baltimore, Nov. 20, 1983)
[Tied for 3rd] Most Consecutive Pro Bowls - 5 (1983-1987)
[Tied for 3rd] Most Passes Attempted, Game - 55 (vs. N.Y. Jets, Sept. 24, 1989)
[Tied for 3rd] Most Consecutive Pass Completions - 13 (vs. Indianapolis, Nov. 10, 1996)
[Tied for 3rd] Longest Pass Plays - 80 (to Mark Duper, vs. Indianapolis, Sept. 23, 1984; to Ferrell Edmunds at N.Y. Jets, Nov. 27, 1988; to Tony Martin, vs. Washington, Oct. 4, 1993)


Post-Season Records

[1st] Most Yards Passing, Career - 4,510
[1st] Most Yards Passing, Game - 422 (at Buffalo, Dec. 30, 1995)
[1st] Most Pass Attempts, Career - 687
[1st] Most Pass Attempts, Game - 64 (at Buffalo, Dec. 30, 1995)
[1st] Most Pass Completions, Career - 385
[1st] Most Pass Completions, Game - 33 (vs. Pittsburgh, Jan. 6, 1985)
[1st] Most Touchdown Passes, Career - 32
[1st] Most Passes Intercepted, Career - 24
[1st] Highest Completion Percentage, Career - 56.0
[1st] Most 300-Yard Passing Games - 4
[1st] Most Fumbles, Career - 8
[1st] Most Own Fumbles Recovered - 3
[Tied for 1st] Most Touchdown Passes, Game - 4 (vs. Pittsburgh, Jan. 6, 1985)
[Tied for 1st] Most Passes Intercepted, Game - 3 (at Buffalo, Dec. 30, 1995)
[2nd] Most Post-Season Games, Career - 18
[2nd] Most Post-Season Game Starts - 18
[2nd] Most Yards Passing, Game - 421 (vs. Pittsburgh, Jan. 6, 1985)
[2nd] Most Pass Attempts, Game - 50 (vs. San Francisco, Jan. 20, 1985)
[2nd] Most Consecutive Pass Completions - 11 (1991)
[Tied for 2nd] Most Completions, Game - 29 (vs. San Francisco, Jan. 20, 1985)

League/Team Statistical Titles

NFL Statistical Championships
Passing Titles: 1984
Passing Touchdown Leader: 1984, 1985, 1986,

AFC Statistical Championships
Passing Titles: 1983, 1984, 1986, 1994
Passing Touchdown Leader: 1984, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1992, 1994

Team Statistical Championships
Passing Titles: 1983, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999
Passing Touchdown Leader: 1983, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999

Awards and Honors


1983 Rookie of the Year (SN)
1984 Most Valuable Player/Player of the Year (PFWA, AP, NEA, SN, MX)
1984 Offensive Most Valuable Player/Player of the Year (AP, PW)
1994 Comeback Player of the Year (PW)
1994 AFC Offensive Most Valuable Player/Player of the Year (UPI)



Year-by-Year Team Records
Year Team W L T Division Finish
1983 Miami Dolphins 12 4 0 (1st)
1984 Miami Dolphins 14 2 0 (1st)
1985 Miami Dolphins 12 4 0 (1st)
1986 Miami Dolphins 8 8 0 (3rd)
1987 Miami Dolphins 8 7 0 (3rd)
1988 Miami Dolphins 6 10 0 (5th)
1989 Miami Dolphins 8 8 0 (3rd)
1990 Miami Dolphins 12 4 0 (2nd)
1991 Miami Dolphins 8 8 0 (3rd)
1992 Miami Dolphins 11 5 0 (1st)
1993 Miami Dolphins 9 7 0 (2nd)
1994 Miami Dolphins 10 6 0 (1st)
1995 Miami Dolphins 9 7 0 (3rd)
1996 Miami Dolphins 8 8 0 (4th)
1997 Miami Dolphins 9 7 0 (2nd)
1998 Miami Dolphins 10 6 0 (2nd)
1999 Miami Dolphins 9 7 0 (3rd)



It took two different post just to post his stats because you're only allowed 13,000 characters per post!!!!That's one helluva career!!!!

 

[PonyExpress]

To the Pats fans who populate this thread and defend "Feel my pain", telling me his views are "rational" and "measured", let's examine what this Miami fraud, reveling in Scadenfrade after a single NE loss, actually said:
"... There is no way Brady will ever be half the QB Dan Marino was and if Brady had to suffer through the years and teams Marino had Brady would not only never reach one single milestone Marino reached, but most definately never have a single SB."

This jackass is being defended by Pats fans? Is this the Invasion of the Body Snatchers or the Patsfans.com forum? Brady has a couple mediocre performances and you defend the guy who says Brady couldn't hold Marino's jock. Oh, and by the way, "Feel my Pain": Football isn't baseball. You don't become great by accumulating stats. Football is about winning, and Marino was too stupid, too egotistical, too poor a teammate, and snorted too much coke to win a SB. Incidentally, Warren Moon would have statistically obliterated Marino if he hadn't been blackballed from the NFL his first few years; And Favre and Peyton Manning will erase Marino's meaningless numbers in the near future. In 15 years people will remember Dandy Dan more for hocking isotoner gloves than his on-field accomplishments. When I think of Marino I think of Tarkenton with fewer SBs and no running ability. One last thing: Marino produced maybe the biggest GAG JOB of all time losing to the Pats in the AFCCG in '85. Try to explain that one away... Don't tell me he didn't have the talent on that team.

 

[OldEnglandPatriot]

To the Pats fans who populate this thread and defend "Feel my pain", telling me his views are "rational" and "measured", let's examine what this Miami fraud, reveling in Scadenfrade after a single NE loss, actually said:
"... There is no way Brady will ever be half the QB Dan Marino was and if Brady had to suffer through the years and teams Marino had Brady would not only never reach one single milestone Marino reached, but most definately never have a single SB."

This jackass is being defended by Pats fans? Is this the Invasion of the Body Snatchers or the Patsfans.com forum? .......

Meh, it's an opinion, and one I said I don't agree with. But it's also not the only thing - or even the main thing - he said in the original post. There was some truth in there, and those not in the midst of an anger-explosion can see it.

I mean.... 'f*** off and die' - ?

 

[PonyExpress]

Sorry OEP; but I have crossed paths with FTP in the past, principally declaring preseason how Culpepper was better than Brady and the Dolphins were going to win the division etc., etc. This is not his first appearance on the gong-show. One has to be astute sniffing out these rats... They couch the true thrust of their posts within platitudes, declaring themselves "reasonable" and "fair", when in fact the gist is foolish and insupportable. Maybe my memory of Marino's horrible big-game performances is too clear; the haze of a decade hasn't erased the impact of seeing horrible INT after INT, a man railing at his team and taking no responsibiluty for his failures. The stats haven't replaced those images in my mind, despite efforts by apologists to replace reality with lies borne of statistics. What better lies are there? And Tom deserves a bit more support after a couple stinkers. Maybe Montana's still in the distance but Marino was left in the dust a couple years ago. No need to resurrect that discredited phantom.