Question on improving Mac's arm strength

[skinnydog]

It might be splitting hairs, but saying his arm is "weaker than average" while having above-average accuracy doesn't compute when evaluating his season statistically. He ranked 14th in yards per attempt and averaged about 235 yards per game; overall, his QBR placed him at 15 among active quarterbacks. I'd say his arm is "average," all indicators pointing to a capable game-manager skill level. Unquestionably, improved arm strength will be required for Mac to become a genuine difference maker who can carry a team and come from behind down multiple scores.

Mac can get the ball downfield despite having a weaker than average arm because he puts more loft on those passes than some other QBs. At times that’s fine. At times it allows the safety to make a read and get to the ball. On sideline out patterns it can allow a defender a chance to recover and break up the pass or step in front for an interception. I actually think that for the most part Josh did a great job putting the rook in situations where he was not exposed. They had to open the playbook a little more down the stretch and he got exposed a little. And overall these are nitpicks. I think the Pats hit a home run drafting him.

 

[BigPeteG]

Having a strong throwing arm has very little to do with distance.

You totally skipped physics class didn't you? LMAO. Give it up.

Brady's arm was never weak. Scouts don't give a flying **** about some guy projected to go in the sixth round. Most never saw the guy play. Because Mac Jones was projected to go as high as 3 - they watched his pro day - they talked with people. The combed through his games. And low and behold Mac's arm is well below average for an NFL QB.

This false equivalence is tiresome - and its unfair to Mac. If Mac does improve his arm strength and does great in the NFL - it will be a tremendous achievement for him. It's not par for the course. Danny Weurffel had a great college career. He was very hard working and never improved his arm. Or at least didn't improve it enough to make it in the NFL.

Again this is why teams will pass on guys who they believe have low arm strength. Tom Brady will tell you he could always sling it. I believe him. That's why he had such amazing confidence even in his rookie year when he didn't play.

 

[sb1]

Brady was drafted as a catcher to MLB. IMO if his arm was always weak he would have no chance in baseball at that position at any level.

 

[BigPeteG]

Mac can get the ball downfield despite having a weaker than average arm because he puts more loft on those passes than some other QBs. At times that’s fine. At times it allows the safety to make a read and get to the ball. On sideline out patterns it can allow a defender a chance to recover and break up the pass or step in front for an interception. I actually think that for the most part Josh did a great job putting the rook in situations where he was not exposed. They had to open the playbook a little more down the stretch and he got exposed a little. And overall these are nitpicks. I think the Pats hit a home run drafting him.

Great post. I like Mac. The guy did a great job and Josh did well giving him options that he could make. Maybe Mac can add some zip in the offseason and make it harder for DBs and Safeties to punish him after he makes the throw. It's going to be fun to find out.

And if he does improve - he deserves credit. It's far from guaranteed.

 

[Pats1971]

You totally skipped physics class didn't you? LMAO. Give it up.

Brady's arm was never weak. Scouts don't give a flying **** about some guy projected to go in the sixth round. Most never saw the guy play. Because Mac Jones was projected to go as high as 3 - they watched his pro day - they talked with people. The combed through his games. And low and behold Mac's arm is well below average for an NFL QB.

This false equivalence is tiresome - and its unfair to Mac. If Mac does improve his arm strength and does great in the NFL - it will be a tremendous achievement for him. It's not par for the course. Danny Weurffel had a great college career. He was very hard working and never improved his arm. Or at least didn't improve it enough to make it in the NFL.

Again this is why teams will pass on guys who they believe have low arm strength. Tom Brady will tell you he could always sling it. I believe him. That's why he had such amazing confidence even in his rookie year when he didn't play.

Arm strength is always one of those hot buttom things and people usually get it wrong. A Qb that can throw 80 yards means nothing because how often in a year do QB's throw 80 yard passes in a game? This year there were 29 passes in the entire NFL that were completed 50+ yards in the air. 2 Over 60 in the air, 0 for 70. So basically 29 times out of thousands and thousands and thousands of passes....29 over 50. Where you want arm strength is to get balls in tight windows. To throw those long outs quickly before defense gets there. If you can throw quick and accurate in tight windows, your arm strength is fine. Its about the zip on the ball and accuracy. Now how far you can throw over a receivers head on a go route.

 

[BigPeteG]

Brady was drafted as a catcher to MLB. IMO if his arm was always weak he would have no chance in baseball at that position at any level.

This big part of why Brady was so pissed off. Not to go too off track is people read Brady all wrong.

He totally believes in his athletic ability and always has.

He didn't try to game the combine like most other guys did because he was so full of confidence. Most guys coming up actually get a coach and work on the specific events like the 40, the bench press, and they diet to lower their body fat etc.

I think Mac was pretty ticked off at being called a statue. LOL. So maybe Rex's pea shooter comment lights a fire under him.

 

[BigPeteG]

Arm strength is always one of those hot buttom things and people usually get it wrong. A Qb that can throw 80 yards means nothing because how often in a year do QB's throw 80 yard passes in a game? This year there were 29 passes in the entire NFL that were completed 50+ yards in the air. 2 Over 60 in the air, 0 for 70. So basically 29 times out of thousands and thousands and thousands of passes....29 over 50. Where you want arm strength is to get balls in tight windows. To throw those long outs quickly before defense gets there. If you can throw quick and accurate in tight windows, your arm strength is fine. Its about the zip on the ball and accuracy. Now how far you can throw over a receivers head on a go route.

Not this again. Yes people rarely make 80 yard passes. But Josh Allen was making them on his pro day to show off his arm strength. Arm strength is directly related to how far you can throw the ball. This is basic physics. Same with Mac.

They need to prove they have an NFL arm so they launch very long passes. If you understand physics you will know that this indicates you have a big arm. For shorter throws you do not launch the ball at such a high angle - and thus you can sling the ball in there with good velocity on out routes.

But the long throw is a visible signal to the coach, scouts etc that you have a big arm. Again if you watch pro days you see all almost all QBs do this. You don't have to run 40 yards in a straight line that often either in the NFL - but they do this to demonstrate their speed.

If you watch Josh's pro day highlights - everyone was raving about his arm strength. And they were right. The guy has a great arm. I don't think he has thrown one ball in the air 80 yards in the NFL. But it doesn't matter - he showed he has a strong arm and that is the idea.

 

[‘Mondre]

Look at that first one. Throw it like that in the bills game 1st qtr.

 

[TheRainMaker]

If he were on any other AFC or especially an AFCE team, he’d be laughed at for he’s lack of arm strength. But because he’s a Patriot, it’s all good.

Some posters are in denial in that he doesn’t need to improve and I’ve seen blame on O-line and skill players. His sideline passes at times take forever giving defenders that extra split second to make a play while the WR has to wait to catch the ball and not enough time to turn up field to make a play. His deep passes rainbow at times and when he puts some mustard into it, it looks like he has to put a lot of effort into it.

There’s a reason an AFC Exec and media say he has a weak arm, ex coach calling him “pea shooter” and a former Patriot QB expects him to improve his arm strength like he said he had to. This former QB found Tom House. Who am I referring to? There’s a trivia question for the board.

 

[borg]

Mac's training is underway...16 ounce curls

Mac Jones, Hunter Henry & David Andrews Crushing Beers at the Bruins Game is the Symbol of Hope We All Need | Barstool Sports

 

[JarOfMayo51]

There's nothing wrong with Mac's arm strength. The problem is simple. He needs time to get his timing perfect with his WR options, and he could use a top notch slot guy to help push the ball down the field and let Meyers play the hybrid Troy Brown style role he was born for.

Honestly feel like Jones sees the field better right now than Brady did in 01. He's a very good game manager and his arm is better than people think. Just got to take the time to gain experience and get used to the nuances of NFL play.

I'm very positively surprised at how productive Jones already is when you compare him to his classmates. He came advertized as the most pro ready QB of the group and he delivered that. But even he needs time to finish off his development. We'll be rewarded for allowing him that time.

BTW I wouldn't put Burrow level expectations on Jones. The good news is we probably don't have to, unlike the Bengals the Patriots know how to build a team around their QB and we should be in the playoff hunt, at the very ,east, for the next few years, whether or not Jones breaks through.

For the record, I think it's almost inevitable that Jones does eventually break through. It may not be on our shedule however.

Its just the new age way people think... If you don't have Elite arm strength, then you're a noodle arm scrub.. Can't accept anything in between, you're either the absolute best in the world or you're nothing for some people

His arm strength is fine, very few negative plays this year resulted because Mac didn't have enough heat on the ball... He has average arm strength and unbelievable touch and accuracy... Thats a great foundation to work from, and im sure with technique and strength training, he can improve it even more

 

[jimnance]

Not this again. Yes people rarely make 80 yard passes. But Josh Allen was making them on his pro day to show off his arm strength. Arm strength is directly related to how far you can throw the ball. This is basic physics. Same with Mac.

They need to prove they have an NFL arm so they launch very long passes. If you understand physics you will know that this indicates you have a big arm. For shorter throws you do not launch the ball at such a high angle - and thus you can sling the ball in there with good velocity on out routes.

But the long throw is a visible signal to the coach, scouts etc that you have a big arm. Again if you watch pro days you see all almost all QBs do this. You don't have to run 40 yards in a straight line that often either in the NFL - but they do this to demonstrate their speed.

If you watch Josh's pro day highlights - everyone was raving about his arm strength. And they were right. The guy has a great arm. I don't think he has thrown one ball in the air 80 yards in the NFL. But it doesn't matter - he showed he has a strong arm and that is the idea.

Baloney

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Not this again. Yes people rarely make 80 yard passes. But Josh Allen was making them on his pro day to show off his arm strength. Arm strength is directly related to how far you can throw the ball. This is basic physics. Same with Mac.

They need to prove they have an NFL arm so they launch very long passes. If you understand physics you will know that this indicates you have a big arm. For shorter throws you do not launch the ball at such a high angle - and thus you can sling the ball in there with good velocity on out routes.

But the long throw is a visible signal to the coach, scouts etc that you have a big arm. Again if you watch pro days you see all almost all QBs do this. You don't have to run 40 yards in a straight line that often either in the NFL - but they do this to demonstrate their speed.

If you watch Josh's pro day highlights - everyone was raving about his arm strength. And they were right. The guy has a great arm. I don't think he has thrown one ball in the air 80 yards in the NFL. But it doesn't matter - he showed he has a strong arm and that is the idea.

 

[Ivan]

There is no doubt in my mind that Mac Jones can and will develop his arm strength over the next couple of years.

 

[*ChungFu*]

There is no doubt in my mind that Mac Jones can and will develop his arm strength over the next couple of years.

That's when the scareleaders will change the narrative to his height really being 5'9".

 

[‘Mondre]

View attachment 40239

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

I just don't see it. Mac's arm strength looks fine to me.

And didn't Jamarcus Russell have fantastic arm strength? This is a non issue I think.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Arm strength is directly related to how far you can throw the ball.

For shorter throws you do not launch the ball at such a high angle - and thus you can sling the ball in there with good velocity on out routes.

 

[ahmed]

There is a big difference between having a below average arm for a QB from a strong arm to a massive arm.

Massive arm is someone who can sling it with great zip with not much effort. Think Flacco. You don't need this to be a top QB. However it is a nice bonus.

A strong arm is where you can make all the throws with the zip you need. This is critical because in NFL, windows are small and defenders close them quickly. Without this you get a lot of incompletions on short to intermediate routes or even interceptions. This is what makes or breaks an out route for example.

Mac clearly had a weaker arm. It is very obvious on his intermediate throws on tight windows. There were a lot of throws where defenders were able to get there and cause incompletions. What I can't speak to is if there were any throws he did not even attempt because of that.

This does not mean he is not going to get there. That is TBD as that can obviously be improved. Also he clearly has good accuracy and touch.

My other issue is he held ball too long or threw when he should given up or taken a sack but that can be improved with experience.

As to Brady, he had a strong arm from day one with plenty of zip. He got flack because of his build. He improved his arm over time with better mechanics and conditioning. However he never had a massivs arm.

 

[Stu Pidassle]

The Brady weak arm thing is, and always has been, inaccurate. And the executive's remarks are spot on, unless and until Jones' arm strength improves significantly enough that he can make all the throws, hopefully with power.


It is what it is.

To say the least, history has proven that Brady's arm strength was good enough. Initially he did not have success with the deep ball, there were ongoing concerns about his limitations during his first few years in the league. He worked his butt off to overcome his physical limitations as a 21 year old kid to be the best QB of all time. Mac has similar work habits and should be able to make himself better as well. The only thing that is off the table is the ability to grow 2 inches to be as tall as Brady. Despite all of the rhetoric the team has a rough gem at the most important position who has shown that he can lead the team. It is extremely unlikely that Mac will reach Brady's current level of excellence. Realistically, he just needs to get to early Brady level (pre 2007) for the team to be successful. As we have witnessed the low ceiling label does not mean much if a QB has the mental capacity and works hard to improve, hopefully Mac will make a big 2nd year jump.

It is hard to remember the early years of Brady's career where he was a piece to the puzzle vs. THE piece to the puzzle as he is now. Here is the combine profile for the GOAT to provide perspective on what the same experts are saying about our rookie QB now.
--Poor build
--Skinny
--Lacks great physical stature and strength
--Lacks mobility and ability to avoid the rush
--Lacks a really strong arm
--Can’t drive the ball downfield
--Does not throw a really tight spiral
--System-type player who can get exposed if forced to ad lib
--Gets knocked down easily