Penalties being considered for the Pats - UPDATED 1/1/2020

[QuantumMechanic]

Whether or not this turns out to be innocent, there need to be some firings for abject stupidity, starting with the management of Kraft Sports Productions.

And if it turns out it wasn't innocent, everyone on the football side of the house who knew about it needs to be fired, no matter how far up the food chain that goes. One, for stupidity, and two, for cheating. And if it wasn't innocent, BB needs to be suspended even if he didn't know about it. Institutional control/"the buck stops here"/whatever you want to call it.

(Now, I for now think it was innocent. Seems beyond crazy to take this kind of risk to film the Bengals of all teams. But it sure does look sketchy.)

 

[SVN]

 

[TB_Helmet]

Whether or not this turns out to be innocent, there need to be some firings for abject stupidity, starting with the management of Kraft Sports Productions.

And if it turns out it wasn't innocent, everyone on the football side of the house who knew about it needs to be fired, no matter how far up the food chain that goes. One, for stupidity, and two, for cheating. And if it wasn't innocent, BB needs to be suspended even if he didn't know about it. Institutional control/"the buck stops here"/whatever you want to call it.

It’s 100% innocent, so why even bother speculating what should happen if it isn’t?

 

[sb1]

His point is that for all we know they may have taped 30 minutes or the whole game if they hadn’t gotten discovered. You can’t attempt to minimize it by saying “they only taped 8 minutes” because they didn’t stop taping on their own.

It’s not like they stopped taping after 8 minutes, were packing things up, and then got challenged.

In any event, even if the league exonerates BB and football ops, there will be punishment to the team which will likely be a big fine and more loss of draft choices.

Yeah a punishment like that is a certainty. They admitted guilt.

I think it’s important to see the tape to know what exactly what they were doing for those 8 minutes.

 

[Sicilian]

Yes, but...

What do you need 8 minutes of sideline B-roll for? (And it would have been more than 8 minutes if they hadn’t been discovered, remember.) It’s not like this is a 5 hour documentary they were producing.

I'm not in video production, but I've worked closely with enough of them to know that 8 minutes is basically nothing. When you're putting together a 5 minute segment, and you need 8 seconds of perfect b-roll for a particular scene (and these producers are VERY particular about what kind of thing does and doesn't work for whatever mood they're trying to convey), you film as much as you can and pour through it later. The last thing you want is to find out you don't have what you need after it's too late to recreate the environment.

 

[Tunescribe]

Yes, but...

What do you need 8 minutes of sideline B-roll for? (And it would have been more than 8 minutes if they hadn’t been discovered, remember.) It’s not like this is a 5 hour documentary they were producing.

I've posted this already but it is common for filmmakers to compile a lot more footage than they end up using -- just like photographers take hundreds of shots planning to use the best one or two. Eight minutes boiled down to 20 seconds of usable footage wouldn't be unusual.

 

[WesternMAPatsfan]

Yes, but...

What do you need 8 minutes of sideline B-roll for? (And it would have been more than 8 minutes if they hadn’t been discovered, remember.) It’s not like this is a 5 hour documentary they were producing.

That parts pretty easy to explain, although no one is going to buy it. You tape for hours and hours and edited down to 30min of usable footage for the documentary.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Do they mention how much was filmed overall (besides the 8 minutes)? And was it just continuous shots of the sideline, not panning back and forth from the supposed signal to a play on the field or scoreboard?

 

[SVN]

Curran: Why believe Belichick? The Mona Lisa Vito press conference

There’s a lot of meat on the bone in that 120-word response — especially the sideswipe mention of a lot of other teams doing the same thing — but what I focus in on is the end of the statement.

“We never did it again. We're never going to do it again and anything else that's close, we're not going to do, either."

Taping opposing sidelines and deciphering hand signals was never, ever worth the time, effort, headache, scandal, fine, embarrassment and reputation stain it caused.

It just didn’t produce fruit. Belichick once told me, “If there were 100 things to do to get ready for a game, that stuff was about 99 on the list. It wasn’t a priority.”

 

[BradyFTW!]

Whether or not this turns out to be innocent, there need to be some firings for abject stupidity, starting with the management of Kraft Sports Productions.

And if it turns out it wasn't innocent, everyone on the football side of the house who knew about it needs to be fired, no matter how far up the food chain that goes. One, for stupidity, and two, for cheating. And if it wasn't innocent, BB needs to be suspended even if he didn't know about it. Institutional control/"the buck stops here"/whatever you want to call it.

(Now, I for now think it was innocent. Seems beyond crazy to take this kind of risk to film the Bengals of all teams. But it sure does look sketchy.)

Yeah, I have to stress the same caveat. I'd be really surprised if this wasn't innocent, because it's just too stupid to be a coordinated effort. But I'm still really pissed off for exactly that reason: it's hard to fathom KSP being so stupid that they recreated a notorious scandal out of sheer carelessness.

With this one action alone, KSP in its entirety has proven more trouble than it's worth. Fire literally everybody there for gross incompetence, because anyone involved in okaying this without explicitly seeking NFL approval and having an NFL staffer on site to verify that everything was in the clear should not have a job. This is mind-bogglingly simple stuff.

 

[Froob]

I'm not in video production, but I've worked closely with enough of them to know that 8 minutes is basically nothing. When you're putting together a 5 minute segment, and you need 8 seconds of perfect b-roll for a particular scene (and these producers are VERY particular about what kind of thing does and doesn't work for whatever mood they're trying to convey), you film as much as you can and pour through it later. The last thing you want is to find out you don't have what you need after it's too late to recreate the environment.

Oh god

"and up next film maker Steven Spealburg on first take with an in-depth take on the Patriots documentary cheating scandal and what to make of the Patriots lies."

 

[Clonamery]

I've posted this already but it is common for filmmakers to compile a lot more footage than they end up using -- just like photographers take hundreds of shots planning to use the best one or two. Eight minutes boiled down to 20 seconds of usable footage wouldn't be unusual.

Will it be on Netflix?

 

[BradyFTW!]

That parts pretty easy to explain, although no one is going to buy it. You tape for hours and hours and edited down to 30min of usable footage for the documentary.

Yup, there is a very simple and totally innocent explanation for why a documentary crew would want 8 minutes of footage. If you're going to use 8 seconds of b roll on the sidelines, it's totally reasonable to tape for a lot longer than that in hopes of finding the best possible sequence. You tape when you can and sort through it later, digital storage isn't exactly expensive so you shoot as much as you can because it's a nonissue.

There absolutely isn't an explanation for why KSP was too dumb to coordinate with the league to have them verify at every step of the way that what whey were doing was legitimate.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Do they mention how much was filmed overall (besides the 8 minutes)? And was it just continuous shots of the sideline, not panning back and forth from the supposed signal to a play on the field or scoreboard?

It would be nice to know the details wouldn’t it?

 

[NashuaPats]

Whether or not this turns out to be innocent, there need to be some firings for abject stupidity, starting with the management of Kraft Sports Productions.

And if it turns out it wasn't innocent, everyone on the football side of the house who knew about it needs to be fired, no matter how far up the food chain that goes. One, for stupidity, and two, for cheating. And if it wasn't innocent, BB needs to be suspended even if he didn't know about it. Institutional control/"the buck stops here"/whatever you want to call it.

(Now, I for now think it was innocent. Seems beyond crazy to take this kind of risk to film the Bengals of all teams. But it sure does look sketchy.)

If it does turn out to be innocent, firing people with modest incomes would be bs. The real stupidity is from the league and media's handling of this, far more than the pr team and film crew.

 

[BradyFTW!]

If it does turn out to be innocent, firing people with modest incomes would be bs. The real stupidity is from the league and media's handling of this, far more than the pr team and film crew.

he specifically said management, ie the people who couldn't figure out that it was probably a good idea to dial the league in and let them know that they needed to get some sideline footage for a documentary they were making. That simple step alone would have ended this whole 'controversy' before it even started.

That said, I take the far more aggressive stance that the entirety of KSP should be laid off on account of it rendering itself more trouble than it's worth in a span of about 8 minutes.

 

[Sicilian]

Oh god

"and up next film maker Steven Spealburg on first take with an in-depth take on the Patriots documentary cheating scandal and what to make of the Patriots lies."

If they really want to pile on in the court of public opinion, they should ask George Lucas about the whole thing. He was notorious for, "We do one, MAYBE two takes. If it doesn't work, we'll fix it in post."

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

It would be nice to know the details wouldn’t it?

yep, so i guess this is all thats been trickled thus far? Of course its just enough information to create further suspicion and not really answer anything!

 

[venecol]

People going “oh it was only 8 minutes” are kind of ignoring that the only reason why it’s only 8 minutes is because they were accosted and stopped from continuing by Bengals staff.

8 minutes is all you need. It's a known fact that gingers are nose pickers. Ernie must've developed a game plan based algorithm on # of times the Red Rifle picked his nose on the sideline in those 8 minutes. This is serious.

 

[lancerman]

If it does turn out to be innocent, firing people with modest incomes would be bs. The real stupidity is from the league and media's handling of this, far more than the pr team and film crew.

No screw that. At some point you need to live in reality and know the microscope you are under