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Patriots may have missed their guy at 72?


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This thread is full of people who despite years of following this team still have no clue about how BB operates during drafts. Go listen to Lombardi or read some books on that. If there was a player that really was "their guy" (e.g. in the "starter" category of players) they would have gotten him by using some of their assets to move up - especially after the Mitch Morse debacle in the 2015 draft. Usually, they learn from that ****.

In reality, Feeney was most probably slightly higher rated than Garcia but in the same "potential starter" group of players.
 
This thread is full of people who despite years of following this team still have no clue about how BB operates during drafts. Go listen to Lombardi or read some books on that. If there was a player that really was "their guy" (e.g. in the "starter" category of players) they would have gotten him by using some of their assets to move up - especially after the Mitch Morse debacle in the 2015 draft. Usually, they learn from that ****.

In reality, Feeney was most probably slightly higher rated than Garcia but in the same "potential starter" group of players.
What exactly was "the Mitch Morse debacle"
 
Now that I've thought about it, I'm pretty sure that I'm remembering 2012. The player was Lavonte David, and it was the second round. BB had been sitting on the next to last pick in the round, and Tampa (Schiano?) traded into the #58 spot to scoop up David.

BB immediately traded all the way back to #90 at the end of the 3rd (with GBY), the pick that became Bequette.
Thats a nightmare scenario
 
Not sure, but if it has anything to do with leaving the 2015 draft with Jordan Richards instead of Mitch Morse, that would certainly qualify as a debacle.
I don't think it's a debacle to miss an OL who was drafted 15 spots before you had a pick.
 
What exactly was "the Mitch Morse debacle"

Go listen to or read Lombardi. I will not summarize things that are available online at various outlets and have been discussed here a month ago.

I don't think it's a debacle to miss an OL who was drafted 15 spots before you had a pick.

You are missing the entire point.
 
Go listen to or read Lombardi. I will not summarize things that are available online at various outlets and have been discussed here a month ago.



You are missing the entire point.
The point that you think you are too good to describe. Mmmmkay.
 
Another factor to keep in mind with this recent draft, is that due to the vindictiveness of the NFL* penalty, BB didn’t have the normal flexibility to move around in the 4th round, and he may not have wanted to risk missing out completely on a player like Garcia, so made the move to get him in the 3rd round.

Most NFL* fans know that the Pats had their 4th round pick taken, but I suspect few realized just how impactful the clause of losing their highest pick in the round, really was.
 
Another factor to keep in mind with this recent draft, is that due to the vindictiveness of the NFL* penalty, BB didn’t have the normal flexibility to move around in the 4th round, and he may not have wanted to risk missing out completely on a player like Garcia, so made the move to get him in the 3rd round.

Most NFL* fans know that the Pats had their 4th round pick taken, but I suspect few realized just how impactful the clause of losing their highest pick in the round, really was.

Even so, I thought BB did a masterful job of working around it.
 
This. I think it more likely that the Pats were targeting a pass rusher and, as you say, when they traded down, there were still four edge players on the board and that they felt one of them would still be there at 83.

Love the picks but if they were targeting an edge guy, the trade really could have backfired with the run on edge players after they traded out of 72. Basham was my binky. Looking back, wondering if we could have gotten both Rivers and Basham.
 
if that's true it means we indeed were trying to upgrade the C position...and even w/ extension still would be

He seems to only have experience at guard and some tackle. While center makes sense maybe they were not happy with how the guard position looks either.
 
I you believe that BB was targeting Dan Freeney at #72, that puts a face on the Ealy trade.

Pats acquired Ealy for a trade back from #64 to #72. In retrospect, either of Freeney and Elflein would have been available to them at #64. Missing the shot at Freeney is, in effect, the Opportunity Cost of acquiring Ealy.

More rigorously, the various trades down and up work out to be:

#64 (2nd) = Ealy + #72 (3rd)
#72 (3rd) + #200 (6th) = #83 (Rivers) + #124 (4th)
#96 (3rd)+ #124 (4th) = #85 (Garcia)

which reduces to ... Ealy, Rivers (3rd), Garcia (3rd)
at the cost of... Freeney, #96 (3rd) and a #200 (6th)

We'll have to pin this and check in four years to vote which side of this equivalency looks better. If Freeney is a perennial All Pro and Ealy washes out in Foxboro, Rivers and Garcia will need to justify BB's reputation as a shrewd judge of talent and value.
 
This thread is full of people who despite years of following this team still have no clue about how BB operates during drafts. Go listen to Lombardi or read some books on that. If there was a player that really was "their guy" (e.g. in the "starter" category of players) they would have gotten him by using some of their assets to move up - especially after the Mitch Morse debacle in the 2015 draft. Usually, they learn from that ****.

In reality, Feeney was most probably slightly higher rated than Garcia but in the same "potential starter" group of players.

This is a weird post. You write how unlikely it is that they would miss their guy...then in the same sentence, point out how that happened the previous year.

So if they really wanted to do it, they would have. Except when they didn't. Which was a year before.

I'm not saying it did happen, or it didn't. We can't possibly know, unless BB or Nick want to tell us (wouldn't hold my breath on that one).

More than likely, from listening to the Ringer podcasts with Lombardi and seeing bits and pieces over the years, it feels like the team has a very limited draft board, then works around to get some of those guys. If there's a guy who is head and shoulders above, they may move up for him, otherwise they're content to let the draft come to them.

It also seems like they try to work out a trade back at every pick, then wait to see who is available before figuring if it's worth it or not. That scenario was described with Malcolm Brown, where there was a potential trade-down, but the value seemed too good to pass up.

What is clear is that the value they had in trading back was higher than any player on the board. What we can't say with any conclusiveness is if one of the players selected ahead would have changed that value equation if they had dropped to 72.
 
If there is one thing I have learned from BB is "Ignore the Noise".

BB didn't trade down to get his choice at DE. He went in the first pick in the Draft to the Browns. What utter nonsense, and would make a good enuf story for the papers. And as full of sound and fury signifying absolutely... nothing.

BB needed a DE and got a couple in the draft after getting a couple in FA. this off-season. He wanted but did not need, some LOT talent to develop. He traded up twice, and got a a pair of raw LOT candidates after signing a few IOL vets too, where the need was even less.
 
Reiss's latest quick-hit thoughts and notes references Mike Lombardi's podcast earlier in the week about teams sometimes moving down to get a chance to regroup when they miss someone.

If not for Senior Bowl, Patriots might have shied away from top draft picks



For those who didn't listen, I'd highly recommend listening to this specific episode, lots of draft war room stories from Lombardi's time with the Raiders and Patriots including another tidbit about Jimmy G which is also covered in Reiss's piece.



He also talks about the Senior Bowl and it's impact on our draft. Overall, good article and podcast to check out for those who haven't.
Approximately at what minute is the Garopplo info?
 
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