Patriots Front 7

[Snooky97]

We’re a few solid/good guys away from being very good.

Offensively we need to look at Slot guys who have good hands. Outside guys be able to stretch the field. Another TE/WR mode.. I am still trying to find an Aaron Hernandez replacement but dam he was a talent...

One of my bigger questions is was HT ever that “athletic” LB?

Personally I can see HT going to the DE/Edge as I think that gives him the best chance to be successful.

Bentley will be our HT replacement in the LB area. I’d like us to Bring in a more mobile LB. Two monster DT who are solid against the Run. I like Guy but we need a rotation.

Secondary I’m happy with. JC Jackson looks like he could become an Elite corner with Gilmore.

I’d like to see a Chung replacement coming soon maybe Obi will be that guy. Another guy who we should look at is Landon Collins, he could play that Safety/LB role of the Star Position as it’s known as.

 

[TennisBallHead]

Every team is a few solid guys away from being good.

The Weekend at Bernie's crew is the worst in the NFL.

 

[Uptown]

 

[Uptown]

Yea...we need Shelton back. Hopefully he’s effective this go round.

 

[tasmlab]

Missing on both Easley and Brown seems to be where he wasted the DL draft capital.

 

[Deus Irae]

So now you all think Hightower sucks? From our front 7 , Flowers and Hightower are both solid and Wise is developing and needs some more time. I wouldn't say we are the worst in the league, that's a stretch.

• Hightower is a shell of himself.
• Wise should be a low use backup.
• Brown has gotten worse instead of better.
• Shelton is so bad that he can't crack the lineup even with the group of stiffs he's competing against.
• Van Noy, Flowers, and Guy are the only players in the front 7 who are really playing like starter level players, right now, and Guy should be a borderline 2/3 in a rotation, not a top man, while Van Noy (who's definitely playing better this year) is still a player who should be at LB3/LB4, not your LB1.

The above would be problem enough if the secondary was playing at a high level, which it's not.

 

[maineman209]

Fact noted but Shelton appears to be on Belichick's do not play list.

We don't really know why, though.

The Pats also have appeared to be emphasizing QB pressure while playing more dime. Shelton has never been a guy who generated pressure, even back in college. More playing time for Butler, ultimately. Also, allowing both new special teamers (Humber and McClellan) to be active - which appears to have helped ST quite a bit.

 

[sb1]

Pathetic.

Worse run defense than 2002. Never though I’d ever say that as that was a very low bar to set but it’s true.

 

[maineman209]

Missing on both Easley and Brown seems to be where he wasted the DL draft capital.

Easley was a clear miss on a high-injury-risk prospect. Brown has been a solid player for the Pats, just not as dynamic as people were expecting him to be (even though he was never that in college). AMong the DTs drafted after Brown in 2015, only Grady Jarrett has exceeded Brown's overall production. None of the rest have come close to matching it.

The Pats needed a guy to play a specific role on the DL, and they got him - taking him before someone else could.

 

[203Pat]

Lots of wasted picks on the D-line (as well as many other spots) in the last few years have really bottomed out this year. Easley was a major bust who in theory would’ve been giving us Trey Flowers production. Malcolm Brown has been below average for where he was picked. Vincent Valentine, Grissom, and Rivers have all been busts. Wise is best suited for a rotational DE ala Jarvis Green. Combine that with average (Chris Long, Sheard, Clayborn) to flat out busts (Shelton, Ealy) in fee agency and you get this completely unathletic, sloppy, manhandled bunch.

 

[Deus Irae]

Since those "gold ole days", the Pats haven't had the kind of draft capital that was required to snag Seymour (#6 overall, after a 5-11 season), or Warren (#13 overall, after a 9-7 season) or Wilfork (#21 overall after trades).

The Pats drafted those guys into an almost pure base 3-4 (generally better against the run than most 4-3 variations) with LB and DB support provided by guys who were drafted before BB arrived. It was also in the era before NFL rules changed to emphasize passing.

This hasn't been about draft position, though drafting higher certainly helps when it comes to hitting on players, particularly elite players.

Jones was drafted at #21, same as Wilfork. They also could have packaged picks and/or players to move up in the drafts. In 2017, for example, they traded their #1 pick for Cooks, when they could have gone in the other direction and traded up a few spots for TJ Watt and helped the LBs. They could have drafted Tuitt instead of Easley. They could have drafted Goldman instead of Brown.

So, just to point out the personnel possibilities (not going to argue about working in practice, since we're just talking picks), this team could have had

Jones (De)
Tuitt (De)
Goldman (DT)

Watt (LB)

Just by keeping Jones around (and even with letting him go, for that matter), drafting a bit differently, and trading up rather than out, they could have had a much better front 7. Instead, they let Jones walk, drafted Easley and Brown, and traded for one year of Cooks.

Could they have traded up for Vander Esch, instead of drafting Wynn? Again, playing "What if"..

What if the LB corps was Watt, Vander Esch, Van Noy and Hightower, instead of the current group?

The point is that things could easily have been much better with just a couple of relatively inexpensive trades and some different draft choices. And, that we can't be honest in crying about draft position when the team moved on from Jones (I'm not complaining about the decision, but it does need to be noted).



*Just a note: None of the above would have been shocking, and most of it, if not all, was bandied about here on this forum.

 

[PatsFan2]

Missing on both Easley and Brown seems to be where he wasted the DL draft capital.

BB has already passed on the Fifth year Options on both Brown and Shelton. If you are a Teaming looking for a Run Stuffing DT look else where. Those guys did not help themselves in FA 2019 both will be Street Jags soon enough their tapes are just bad.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Missing on both Easley and Brown seems to be where he wasted the DL draft capital.

I still can’t believe we drafted Brown over Landon Collins...

 

[203Pat]

This hasn't been about draft position, though drafting higher certainly helps when it comes to hitting on players, particularly elite players.

Jones was drafted at #21, same as Wilfork. They also could have packaged picks and/or players to move up in the drafts. In 2017, for example, they traded their #1 pick for Cooks, when they could have gone in the other direction and traded up a few spots for TJ Watt and helped the LBs. They could have drafted Tuitt instead of Easley. They could have drafted Goldman instead of Brown.

So, just to point out the personnel possibilities (not going to argue about working in practice, since we're just talking picks), this team could have had

Jones (De)
Tuitt (De)
Goldman (DT)

Watt (LB)

Just by keeping Jones around, drafting a bit differently, and trading up rather than out, they could have had a much better front 7. Instead, they let Jones walk, drafted Easley and Brown, and traded for one year of Cooks.

Could they have traded up for Vander Esch, instead of drafting Wynn? Again, playing "What if"..

What if the LB corps was Watt, Vander Esch, Van Noy and Hightower, instead of the current group?

The point is that things could easily have been much better with just a couple of relatively inexpensive trades and some different draft choices. And, that we can't be honest in crying about draft position when the team moved on from Jones (I'm not complaining about the decision, but it does need to be noted).

I agree the “they always draft late” narrative is a load of crap. Are you going to end up with Von Miller or Todd Gurly every year? No of course not but you should be drafting a Pro Bowl player more often than not late in the first or even in the second. We are barely even ending up with the starters. The drafts the last few years have been flat out awful. I’d say the first decade of Bill’s drafting absolutely crushes the last decade.

 

[PatsFan2]

This hasn't been about draft position, though drafting higher certainly helps when it comes to hitting on players, particularly elite players.

Jones was drafted at #21, same as Wilfork. They also could have packaged picks and/or players to move up in the drafts. In 2017, for example, they traded their #1 pick for Cooks, when they could have gone in the other direction and traded up a few spots for TJ Watt and helped the LBs. They could have drafted Tuitt instead of Easley. They could have drafted Goldman instead of Brown.

So, just to point out the personnel possibilities (not going to argue about working in practice, since we're just talking picks), this team could have had

Jones (De)
Tuitt (De)
Goldman (DT)

Watt (LB)

Just by keeping Jones around (and even with letting him go, for that matter), drafting a bit differently, and trading up rather than out, they could have had a much better front 7. Instead, they let Jones walk, drafted Easley and Brown, and traded for one year of Cooks.

Could they have traded up for Vander Esch, instead of drafting Wynn? Again, playing "What if"..

What if the LB corps was Watt, Vander Esch, Van Noy and Hightower, instead of the current group?

The point is that things could easily have been much better with just a couple of relatively inexpensive trades and some different draft choices. And, that we can't be honest in crying about draft position when the team moved on from Jones (I'm not complaining about the decision, but it does need to be noted).

Excellent Post BB is Great Coach and I like his personalty but his shopping for the Groceries leaves a lot to be desired. BB speaks very highly of JJ Watt if you could draft his brother of course not the same player but decent enough wouldn't you go all out?? Last Draft for instance both Matt Patricia and Mike Vrabel Traded up and got better Players than the Patriots in the 2018 Draft. BB got Out Drafted in the spring and Out-coached by both in the regular season embarrassing.

 

[Ring 6]

Since 2009, they’ve drafted 12 DE/DT in rounds 1-4 and only Flowers and Chandler Jones panned out. Two first round duds, and a bunch of 2nd-4th rounders (Brace, Cunningham, Bequette, Rivers, Wise, Crable, Valentine, Grissom)

Not much investment in big bodies, just the pair of 1st round flops and two useless overdrafted nose tackles.

The inability to build a young, talented DL has been an issue for over a decade. They’ve occasionally been able to patch things together with vets (2016 being one such year) but it’s been a perennially weak unit most years

Malcom brown started for his entire contract. That’s not a bust.
You are going back 10 years to call 3rd and 4th rounders missed picks. What do you expect from a 3rd or 4th rounder?

 

[TheRainMaker]

“they always draft late”

That excuse is used on here.....a lot.

 

[Deus Irae]

That excuse is used on here.....a lot.

It's a useful cop out for the apologists.

 

[Jimke]

Excellent Post BB is Great Coach and I like his personalty but his shopping for the Groceries leaves a lot to be desired. BB speaks very highly of JJ Watt if you could draft his brother of course not the same player but decent enough wouldn't you go all out?? Last Draft for instance both Matt Patricia and Mike Vrabel Traded up and got better Players than the Patriots in the 2018 Draft. BB got Out Drafted in the spring and Out-coached by both in the regular season embarrassing.

Both Patricia and Vrabel traded to get ahead of the Patriots who were interested
in the same player.

 

[Username]

The front 7 are just so slow. Physically slow and slow to react. Trey Flowers is good and Van Noy is decent to good, but the rest of them, including Hightower, offer next to nothing.

We have a very big off-season coming up.