Patriots Cap situation

[BobDigital]

New England Patriots Salary Cap | Over the Cap

Just some interesting things to look at. As of now the top 51 are at 162M. That puts them about 14M under the cap and probably more like 11M when you factor in the final 2 spots and practice squad.

In that top 51 are Dwayne Allen 5M and Cordarrelle Patterson 3.25M with no guarantees at this point. Both of them are overpaid for what they give you and they could easily redo these contracts using that leverage or cut both players.

Assuming a few rookies make it over other players even more money can be saved.

This gives the Patriots some options to make a trade for a player with a bigger contract this year if they wanted to. Maybe trading one of their 2nd or 3rd round picks for an impact player at a need position wouldn't be such a bad idea.

 

[maineman209]

New England Patriots Salary Cap | Over the Cap

Just some interesting things to look at. As of now the top 51 are at 162M. That puts them about 14M under the cap and probably more like 11M when you factor in the final 2 spots and practice squad.

In that top 51 are Dwayne Allen 5M and Cordarrelle Patterson 3.25M with no guarantees at this point. Both of them are overpaid for what they give you and they could easily redo these contracts using that leverage or cut both players.

Assuming a few rookies make it over other players even more money can be saved.

This gives the Patriots some options to make a trade for a player with a bigger contract this year if they wanted to. Maybe trading one of their 2nd or 3rd round picks for an impact player at a need position wouldn't be such a bad idea.

Allen and Patterson may be "overpaid" from our perspective, but I can't be certain that the Pats hold the same view. In both cases, they traded for a player and his contract, and I default to the notion that they knew what they were taking on in both respects. Maybe that view has changed wrt Allen as the result of his 2017 contributions; maybe it hasn't. In any case, the Pats will have even more leverage with Allen after they've seen how he performs now compared to Niklas, Hollister, Tye and Izzo in actual practice during the next OTA session.

However, it's difficult to believe that the Pats think that Patterson is overpaid, otherwise why trade for him just a few weeks ago in the first place? Anyway, Patterson has yet to practice even a single play with the offense, so how would they be able to make an updated contract value judgment?

In terms of the cap in general, the Pats seem to have comfortable working room at the moment, so they may not have any sense of urgency about adjusting the contracts/cap hits of Allen or Patterson. After Rookie Camp (May 10th), odds are that 1-2 UDFA are shed, and a spot may be filled with one of the UFA Safeties or LBs who are still available. The Pats have sufficient cap space to do that.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Cap savings will come at RB, LB and maybe WR

 

[WinstonSmith]

Cap savings will come at RB, LB and maybe WR

If Mike Gillislee and his 2.1 million in cap savings is on the team come September then something terrible happened to several of his position mates.

 

[Ring 6]

If Mike Gillislee and his 2.1 million in cap savings is on the team come September then something terrible happened to several of his position mates.

Or he had a great offseason and camp.

 

[WinstonSmith]

Or he had a great offseason and camp.

I don't think that he'll make it at his current cap number. He's a decent back and would love to see him earn a spot on merit, but think that his skill set is made somewhat redundant by the other backs.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Annnnnd we drafted a RB who runs through people when there's no hole, and doesn't get fancy when there is a hole.

So maybe Gillislee had better have the camp of his life.

Just don't lead the league in touchdowns. We know what happens to you on a Pats roster if you do that.

 

[Snooky97]

If IZZO can compete with Allen could be interesting to see what happens.. Can't see Allen going though as looks like our Run game could be dominate this year!

 

[Ring 6]

I don't think that he'll make it at his current cap number. He's a decent back and would love to see him earn a spot on merit, but think that his skill set is made somewhat redundant by the other backs.

The cap number will have impact on the decision. It’s peanuts.

 

[WinstonSmith]

The cap number will have impact on the decision. It’s peanuts.

We agree in that I don't think that it will come down to money as I believe that the other backs will add more production value to the team.

And... if it's peanuts then it's a barrel full of peanuts as he currently has the 22nd largest salary on the team. Bill will make decisions based on both production and cost just like he always does, and will factor in how to best invest the 2.1 million dollars worth of peanuts when deciding his fate.

 

[Ring 6]

We agree in that I don't think that it will come down to money as I believe that the other backs will add more production value to the team.

And... if it's peanuts then it's a barrel full of peanuts as he currently has the 22nd largest salary on the team. Bill will make decisions based on both production and cost just like he always does, and will factor in how to best invest the 2.1 million dollars worth of peanuts when deciding his fate.

The cap hit difference isn’t significant

 

[maineman209]

If IZZO can compete with Allen could be interesting to see what happens.. Can't see Allen going though as looks like our Run game could be dominate this year!

The Pats' run game will be more dominant with Allen than without him - unless two of Niklas, Izzo, Tye, Hollister, and Wimann turn out to be better blockers.

 

[mgteich]

The Pats' run game will be more dominant with Allen than without him - unless two of Niklas, Izzo, Tye, Hollister, and Wimann turn out to be better blockers.

I think that the 3rd TE isn't relevant unless we have a blocking TE as our #3. The backup blocking TE may not be active. We have used an OT in the jumbo running set for years.

The #3 TE will likely be a special teamer or a mover TE (like Hollister).

So, I am rooting for Izzo, who nfl.com ratied very highly as a blocking TE.
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As an aside, I favor keeping a backup blocking TE over a backup move TE, who is very unlikely to be used. Hollister was fine, but for me, he was a special teamer who happened to play TE for a few reps last year.

 

[Snooky97]

The Pats' run game will be more dominant with Allen than without him - unless two of Niklas, Izzo, Tye, Hollister, and Wimann turn out to be better blockers.

From what i've read seems like Izzo could be a very good blocker, but not sure if he is Allen Standard! I don't mind keeping Allen especially with how we can dominate within the next few years with the run game

 

[WinstonSmith]

The cap hit difference isn’t significant

Maybe it's not to a fan but fortunately it is to Bill and his staff. He won't be cut simply for cap relief, but it will be a factor in making a final decision. For example: A 700k difference in cap hits (Hill), while not a cap windfall, is significant. The salary of each of the last men considered for a position group also influences the decision.

 

[Ring 6]

Maybe it's not to a fan but fortunately it is to Bill and his staff. He won't be cut simply for cap relief, but it will be a factor in making a final decision. For example: A 700k difference in cap hits (Hill), while not a cap windfall, is significant. The salary of each of the last men considered for a position group also influences the decision.

No. The better player will make the team, if either do, and 700k will not change that. Never has.
We will have to agree to disagree.

 

[maineman209]

I think that the 3rd TE isn't relevant unless we have a blocking TE as our #3. The backup blocking TE may not be active. We have used an OT in the jumbo running set for years.

The #3 TE will likely be a special teamer or a mover TE (like Hollister).

So, I am rooting for Izzo, who nfl.com ratied very highly as a blocking TE.
===========
As an aside, I favor keeping a backup blocking TE over a backup move TE, who is very unlikely to be used. Hollister was fine, but for me, he was a special teamer who happened to play TE for a few reps last year.

WRT Hollister ... Last pre-season, after Lengel was injured and O'Shaughnessy turned out to be no better at blocking than Hollister (and only marginally better as a receiver), I think that the Pats decided that there was more value in trying to develop young Hollister (who had already more or less matched O'Shaughnessy on ST, anyway) than in keeping O'Shaughnessy.

However, by the end of last season, Hollister didn't appear to have developed much, and was contributing almost exclusively on ST. Thus, I think that, if Hollister doesn't make a significant 2nd-year leap in blocking ability (and/or receiving ability), it may be that his only chance to make the final roster is as a special-teamer.

In any case, I don't think that a 3rd blocking TE is particularly irrelevant.

It seems to me that the Pats' extensive use of an OL (e.g., Fleming) as a substitute for a 3rd TE/blocker has been more a matter of necessity, rather than of preference, and been mainly the result of a 3rd blocking TE (a sufficiently good one) simply not being available to include on the roster. As I recall, the Pats have consistently made extensive pre-season efforts to find/acquire/retain a 3rd good blocking TE for the roster and, in every season in which they've been able to to do so, all three "blocking TEs" (including Gronk) have been active for every game.

IMHO, if a 3rd good blocking TE emerges from among the current candidates (Niklas, Izzo, Wimann), and is retained on the 53-man, he'll have an active role every game. The caveat this season is whether or not the Pats see a greater need to keep a 9th OL over a 3rd TE on the 53-man for 2018.