Our #4 and #5 Wide Receivers

[mgteich]

Our #4 and #5 receivers get reps when there are injuries. Almost all the reps go the first three. In four wide sets, Vereen is often one of the receivers, or Gronk or Hooman.
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COMPETING FOR OUR #4 and #5 WIDE RECEIVER POSITIONS
Thompkins, Boyce, Collie (probably), Harrison, Moe, low-level free agent

Perhaps this is not good enough for Belichick. I suspect that it is, IF we can get a tight end.
====

As DI has said, Amendola and Dobson are two of our top three. The third is Edelman or his replacement.

 

[patsinthesnow]

KT could be anywhere from our #2 WR to off the roster. I hope he's not the next Sterling Moore. He really was impressive during TC/preseason and the Falcons game.

 

[Deus Irae]

My hope is that the WR group that's put together is good enough to actually go 5-wide (even 4 plus Gronk), like the good ol' days. With

Amendola (injury rehab)
Edelman (FA situation)
Dobson (Needs significant 2nd year bounce)

they are 3/5 of the way there, if it all breaks right. Unfortunately, the FA WR cupboard is pretty bare as of now. It's down to ideas like taking a flier on Danario Alexander, or seeing what Jerricho Cotchery is asking, or something along those lines.

 

[50-yard-line]

My hope is that the WR group that's put together is good enough to actually go 5-wide (even 4 plus Gronk), like the good ol' days. With

Amendola (injury rehab)
Edelman (FA situation)
Dobson (Needs significant 2nd year bounce)

they are 3/5 of the way there, if it all breaks right. Unfortunately, the FA WR cupboard is pretty bare as of now. It's down to ideas like taking a flier on Danario Alexander, or seeing what Jerricho Cotchery is asking, or something along those lines.

They might be further along than we think. Yeah, you have to resign Eldeman or replace him (Sanders?), but...

Demaryus Thomas:
2010, started 2 games, played in 10 and caught 22 balls for 283 yards.*
2011, started 5 games, played in 11 and caught 32 balls for 551 yards.

* Remember, he was a first-rounder, taken 22nd overall!

Eric Decker:
2010, never started, played in 14 and caught 6 balls for 106 yards.
2011, started 13 games, played in all 16 and caught 44 balls for 612 yards.

Julius Thomas:
2011, started 1 game, played in 5 and caught one pass for 5 yards.
2012, never started, played in only 4 and caught...nothing.

In comparison:

Aaron Dobson:
2013, started 9 games, played in 12 and caught 37 balls for 519 yards.

Kembrell Thompkins:
2013, started 8 games, played in 12 and caught 32 balls for 466 yards.

Josh Boyce:
2013, started 3 games, played in 9 and caught 9 balls for 121 yards.

If you've got Gronk, a healthy Amendola and Edelman/Sanders playing, seems like 2 of these 3 make for a great 4 or 5 option.

 

[supafly]

KT could be anywhere from our #2 WR to off the roster. I hope he's not the next Sterling Moore. He really was impressive during TC/preseason and the Falcons game.

You are a lot more patient than I am, my friend.

I have fully 100% given up on the thought of Thompkins being anything more than a WR4/5 next year (at best). He will need to have a strong TC to even make the team in my opinion.

We're talking about a guy who produced 11 total catches in the last 3 months of the season, and likely made it due to a lack of talent + the weird circumstances that surrounded our season. He served his purpose early in the season for 2013, but even that is a stretch.

 

[supafly]

They might be further along than we think. Yeah, you have to resign Eldeman or replace him (Sanders?), but...

Demaryus Thomas:
2010, started 2 games, played in 10 and caught 22 balls for 283 yards.*
2011, started 5 games, played in 11 and caught 32 balls for 551 yards.

* Remember, he was a first-rounder, taken 22nd overall!

Eric Decker:
2010, never started, played in 14 and caught 6 balls for 106 yards.
2011, started 13 games, played in all 16 and caught 44 balls for 612 yards.

Julius Thomas:
2011, started 1 game, played in 5 and caught one pass for 5 yards.
2012, never started, played in only 4 and caught...nothing.

In comparison:

Aaron Dobson:
2013, started 9 games, played in 12 and caught 37 balls for 519 yards.

Kembrell Thompkins:
2013, started 8 games, played in 12 and caught 32 balls for 466 yards.

Josh Boyce:
2013, started 3 games, played in 9 and caught 9 balls for 121 yards.

If you've got Gronk, a healthy Amendola and Edelman/Sanders playing, seems like 2 of these 3 make for a great 4 or 5 option.

Nice job with the stats and everything, but there is really no comparison whatsoever with these guys and their first years with Tebow throwing them the ball.

On top of that, they all blend together nicely due to the fact that they have so many explosive weapons out there. That isn't going to be the case here.

 

[ATippett56]

Our #4 and #5 receivers get reps when there are injuries. Almost all the reps go the first three. In four wide sets, Vereen is often one of the receivers, or Gronk or Hooman.

Time to restock the tight end position via the 2014 NFL Draft:

NFL Draft - 2014 NFL Draft Prospects - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

Bon appetit

 

[supafly]

Our #4 and #5 receivers get reps when there are injuries. Almost all the reps go the first three. In four wide sets, Vereen is often one of the receivers, or Gronk or Hooman.
=====
COMPETING FOR OUR #4 and #5 WIDE RECEIVER POSITIONS
Thompkins, Boyce, Collie (probably), Harrison, Moe, low-level free agent

Perhaps this is not good enough for Belichick. I suspect that it is, IF we can get a tight end.
====

As DI has said, Amendola and Dobson are two of our top three. The third is Edelman or his replacement.

In a perfect world, (or one where we really improve the offense) we would have Aaron Dobson as a WR4, who is big play capable (or that is the hope anyway), but still has some room to grow and be blended in one more year. I don't care how much offseason training and film study he'll be doing, I still don't trust him in our offense as a main target that we have to depend upon, at least not yet anyway. Let him continue to grow, see 25-30 snaps a game, have some plays designed to get him the ball, and see where we're at there. It isn't like he's costing that much. We shouldn't be "forced" to use him just because we chose him in the 2nd round anymore than we've be forced to use Tavon Wilson, Darius Butler, Jermaine Cunningham, etc.

I don't like the idea of forcing him the ball as our big play guy anymore than I did this year, and I am not as high on him as many others. I think he'd be an excellent candidate for the WR4 position, with the potential to be more for 2015.

I want another option for Edelman (or either Sanders/Amendola--depending on free agency). If that means overpaying a bit for 2014 and then asking Amendola to restructure or move on in 2015, then so be it. We need a better receiving option on the putside, and if that means taking a bit more of a chance than usual in terms of the salary cap, then so be it. Normally, I do not advocate such a move, but after seeing 3 straight AFCCG appearances leading to nothing at all, I am getting a bit more impatient. I am definitely not asking for the extreme side of the spectrum, like some of these "Larry Fitzgerald threads" either; just a realistic option to win.

Improve the depth across the board, and have Dobson as the WR4. Let Collie, Thompkins, etc compete for the 5th and 6th spots. Yes, I realize the salary cap implications of such a move, but that also doesn't mean that we'd need to spend as much as it would appear right off the bat either. Bring in some competition...make a move for a one year deal. Consider the possibility of parting with a 3rd/4th rounder in a trade...something. There are no guarantees of going to a 4th consecutive AFCCG, and we'll already likely have to overcome the law of averages as it is to do so. I am getting a bit ansy at this point in terms of remaining opportunities with Brady/Belichick, and that is for the first time ever.

 

[supafly]

Time to restock the tight end position via the 2014 NFL Draft:

NFL Draft - 2014 NFL Draft Prospects - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

Bon appetit

That may be a more realistic option to what I am suggesting, especially since I believe (right or wrong) that the TE position can be a bit easier for rookies to learn, due to the fact that they can be blended in a bit throughout the year with additional assignments and responsibilities.

We saw this happen with Gronk/Hernandez in 2010. While I'm not meaning to claim that it's by any means "easy," I do believe that we improve our odds when compared to bringing in an additional WR rookie.

Potentially improving upon the likes of Mulligan/Hooman as more viable receiving options shouldn't be that hard. It's not like we're asking for the world here.

 

[ATippett56]

Improve the depth across the board, and have Dobson as the WR4. Let Collie, Thompkins, etc compete for the 5th and 6th spots. Yes, I realize the salary cap implications of such a move, but that also doesn't mean that we'd need to spend as much as it would appear right off the bat either. Bring in some competition...make a move for a one year deal. Consider the possibility of parting with a 3rd/4th rounder in a trade...something. There are no guarantees of going to a 4th consecutive AFCCG, and we'll already likely have to overcome the law of averages as it is to do so. I am getting a bit ansy at this point in terms of remaining opportunities with Brady/Belichick, and that is for the first time ever.

Too early to panic.

The New England Patriots offense with Rob Gronkowski active during the 2013-14 NFL Season:

27, 27, 55, 20, 34, 34, 27 points scored

Rob Gronkowski Career Game Log - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Draft a tight end in the first round of the 2014 NFL Draft, restore the two tight end offense, replace the meathead at offensive center via the 2014 NFL Draft, run the football against seven man defensive fronts, and take out the best cornerback on the Denver Broncos roster next season with a "legal pick".

 

[Deus Irae]

Too early to panic.

The New England Patriots offense with Rob Gronkowski active during the 2013-14 NFL Season:

27, 27, 55, 20, 34, 34, 27 points scored

Rob Gronkowski Career Game Log - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Draft a tight end in the first round of the 2014 NFL Draft, restore the two tight end offense, replace the meathead at offensive center via the 2014 NFL Draft, run the football against seven man defensive fronts, and take out the best cornerback on the Denver Broncos roster next season with a "legal pick".

If they draft a TE in the first round, the GM should be fired before the second round pick is made.

 

[supafly]

Too early to panic.

The New England Patriots offense with Rob Gronkowski active during the 2013-14 NFL Season:

27, 27, 55, 20, 34, 34, 27 points scored

Rob Gronkowski Career Game Log - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Draft a tight end in the first round of the 2014 NFL Draft, restore the two tight end offense, replace the meathead at offensive center via the 2014 NFL Draft, run the football against seven man defensive fronts, and take out the best cornerback on the Denver Broncos roster next season with a "legal pick".

I like the thought of drafting a TE in the first 3-4 rounds. I don't think that our priorities would point to needing to take one in the first round unless there is a guy who just jumps off the board like no one's business, though.

I really want another safety. Picks on either side of the ball in the trenches are another way to go too, as is the possibility of another cornerback, should we let Talib move on.

To be honest with you, as long as those issues are addressed through a blending of FA/draft, I really don't care how it all shakes out. That's why Belichick makes 1/2 a million per game. I must admit that I'm personally hoping for a good secondary player though.

 

[supafly]

And as much as I like to think that "don't panic" makes a ton of sense, I still think that we need a much more capable wide receiver on the outside to fully take advantage of the outside, the TE with Gronk, and the slot with Edelman (or Amendola/Sanders).

We'll likely never have the weapons that DEN has at the moment, but we could make a decent case with a much more physical or at least capable outside threat. Some feel that Dobson is already the answer, and as much as I hope they are right, I just think that we should pursue a more immediately ready option for the upcoming season.

I'd love to have some flexibility to make the defense really have to choose their poison, which would not only allow everyone to fully flourish in their roles, but it'd also solve our problem regarding the lack of outside talent that we've been dealing with for awhile now.

 

[Sticky Caulk]

I like the thought of drafting a TE in the first 3-4 rounds. I don't think that our priorities would point to needing to take one in the first round unless there is a guy who just jumps off the board like no one's business, though.

If the best player available happens to be a TE, I wouldn't be against taking him. The offense is way better when a star TE is in the line-up and can absolutely destroy anyone in the NFL with two. What I just typed is far from a revelation, but true.

I really want another safety. Picks on either side of the ball in the trenches are another way to go too, as is the possibility of another cornerback, should we let Talib move on.

I know a lot of people are okay with Gregory, but I would love to see him replaced. I believe that would be the biggest possible upgrade for the defense, assuming Wilfork is back, which I am going to say he is until otherwise stated by the team.

Denver attacked the safeties with great success. McCourty didn't have a great game, but Gregory is too easily found out of position or slow to the area of the pass. To be fair to them both, the pass rush screwed the secondary, badly.

 

[patsfan-1982]

if Edelman is back they are set at the slot. if Dobson and Thompkins can step up next year and become that 50 and 70 rec each guys like branch and givens were with a star TE in Gronk and Danny and Edelman in the Slot with Vereen coming out the back field,

when Gronk Vereen and Edelman were in there this year as the main guys the offense was great the key is will we ever see all 3 at 100% come playoff time. if yes then the pats can get by with Dobson, Thompkins and Danny being the roll players that they were this season, if no then one of does guys has to make a big jump to a 90 rec 1000 yard 10 TD type WR

 

[50-yard-line]

Nice job with the stats and everything, but there is really no comparison whatsoever with these guys and their first years with Tebow throwing them the ball.

On top of that, they all blend together nicely due to the fact that they have so many explosive weapons out there. That isn't going to be the case here.

It was Orton, too, not just Tebow for the years in question. And that's still beside the point - Decker and J. Thomas were 3rd and 4th rounders. The fact of the matter is that very few receivers come out of college and contribute immediately. Keenan Allen stayed healthy and was in a system that got him a lot of targets. Hopkins had a couple of really good games, but wasn't consistent. In both of those cases, they were the only break-in WR the QB had to contend with.

Picking near the bottom of the 1st round again, I doubt the draft will help us much at the position in the immediate future.

Have you looked at the FA list? Who do you see on it that would help? Boldin, Nicks, Maclin, Cooper, Sanders? I doubt Boldin would come here. Can Nicks stay healthy (and if he's coming on the cheap, the Giants won't let him walk)? At least one of Maclin and Cooper will stay in Philly. And Sanders - I like the kid a lot - hasn't really shown that he'll be a substantial upgrade.

I'm sure BB is looking for cap casualties, but do you really see anyone out there who might be brought in to help?

 

[upstater1]

They absolutely need another outside the numbers guy. If Dobson is injured, they are back in this year's hell. You need a top outside guy, a #1 or a #2.

Say Dobson is the #1.

I don't think you can draft a guy, but that #2 receiver needs to be FA.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Unless Boyce really doesn't get it, he'll be in, he showed athleticism you can't teach in the brief glimpse.

As I have said elsewhere, I am really hoping Mark Harrison shows something, he's bigger than Dobson and has even better overall athleticism. If he's an extreme longshot I would draft someone in this very deep WR draft to compete with KT. I don't know if he was hurt more than I realized or if time just caught up to him but there was nothing after the first Denver game (I know he hurt his hip in Houston).

I can't say I'm thrilled with Dobson, Boyce, Harrison/KT but we have to keep Amendola (cap) and I can't see not bringing Edelman back. I do expect we'll find that Amendola was never close to 100% which should make things better next year.

As for TE, I would personally solve that problem by drafting Amaro or Ebron in Round 1 than come right back with CJ Feder(something) in Round 2. CJ would be a legit backup to Gronk and could play with him in power sets. It's a lot on TE but we have nothing in the cupboard there other than Gronk and it's a key position.

 

[ripatsfan91]

Solution to fix offense

1. Resign Edelman
2. Draft Amaro (Ebron or ASJ if he is gone)
3. Develop Dobson and rest of rookie receivers (if one of them can have a big second season, we ll be fine)
4. Get amendola completely healthy (guy has to have a healthy season sometime, right? Even if just by fluke)

Call me crazy but I have no problem with collie being our 4th receiver, he gets open and can move the chains. Doesn't have a problem with drops and comes up with big plays in key situations

 

[ripatsfan91]

Moving mark Harrison to a move tight end role would be awesome too. Guy that big who has 4.3 speed, I would imagine they would just need to teach him how to block