PostGame Thread Official Post Game Thread- Pats beat the Colts

[VJCPatriot]

I think he must be thinking of ME when it comes to Thornton. Love his "potential", but he hasn't shown me **** so far, though I'll rewatch the game tomorrow. He had what some might considered TWO drops today. Now its true both were throws at his knees, but the good WR's in the league make those catches. STILL not seeing any evidence of his "explosive" speed, or any great evidence he's getting separation, at least not the kind you expect of a guy with 4.2 speed.

Now I don't believe in making blanket statements so soon, especially since Thornton missed 6 week with the broken collar bone. He's a rookie who seems to be smart AND hardworking. Very few WR's come into the league and immediately become impactful. There are a LOT of good prospects who became very good WR's AFTER a few years of development.

Well it's too early to call him the next Bethel Johnson. But the Patriots need to call his number on plays where they exploit his speed.

What happened to the Jet Sweep play? He scored a TD on one of those.

Oh I forgot, Patricia is our playcaller, his only style is predictable and easily contained play calls.

 

[VJCPatriot]

It's Belichick's offense. The past 2 weeks they've faced very tough defenses without their starting center or #1WR, vs teams with faulty offenses. BB played those games very conservatively, letting the D and Folk win them. MP doesn't have a lot to do with it.

You're telling me we have a #1 WR? Who pray tell would that be? Why hasn't he made himself known to the NFL. Because I sure haven't seen him! LOL Please someone get Ace Ventura on the case right away! Our #1 WR is hiding in a crowd. It's like Where's Waldo right now!

 

[tasmlab]

Schooler keeps popping up on good plays throughout on special teams. I think we are in good hands once Slater calls it quit.

Does Schooler play the same role as Slater? (I confess I don't know much about coverage units). Schooler is on TV a lot, which means he's always around the ball (good), doing something (good), or I just recognize his long hair (eh).

 

[VJCPatriot]

Critical game vs the Jets in 2 weeks. We need the fans to come out in force.

The fans will be there. But will the offense?!

 

[mgteich]

My quick takeaways:

1) The defense needs to be consistent. They can't continue to play games like this one week and then be like a deer in the headlights anytime they face a somewhat mobile QB. Not sure if it's the scheme or personnel or both, but more consistency needed

2) Special teams was mostly very good, outside of some horrible punts by Jake Bailey. That dude needs to get it together fast. Brendan Schooler on the other hand has been a revelation on special teams and isn't getting enough praise imho.

3) Our passing game sucks at the minute. Mac Jones has tunnel vision, seems jittery and can't get into a rhythm because of how poor the OL is playing. It's like he wants to take deep shots and is holding the ball waiting for guys to get open, but our WR's don't really seperate. Mac needs to calm down, and take what's given rather than waiting for things to develop. I would like to see Thornton utilised more, whether on deep shots or end arounds or slants or whatever. That God given talent he has needs to be utilized in some fashion. It's tantamount to negligence to have a 4.26 WR out there mostly blocking

DEFENSE
I have a different take. I believe that our defense is strong, and I believe that it is indeed consistent.

As has been case for 20 years, we have trouble dealing with running backs who play quarterback. This has been very, very consistent. Belichick doesn't know how to effectively defend quarterbacks who are primary running backs (sometimes the team's best running back).

BAILEY
is injured. I don't see how folks don't realize that this is the case.

 

[mgteich]

The fans will be there. But will the offense?!

Yup, the fans will be there in force, ready to call for Zappe.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

If I was in an NFL scouting department, I'd start ignoring dudes who are known for just being fast (negated by NFL level speed) or who are contested catch specialists (to me, that means they couldn't get open vs college level DBs). Start putting more priority on the guys who have scouting reports that say 'just knows how to get open'.

 

[VJCPatriot]

There could be something to that he is not used to playing with Ferentz and plays better with Andrews. Seems like a big coincidence that his play has dropped since Andrews went out. I asked Andrew Callahan this very same question on his podcast, but he thought it was Strange just not playing well.

Specifically, we're not getting good play from the RT, C and LG, if that continues, we're not going to be able to do much on offense going forward.

Wait could it be that our high draft pick investment isn't paying off... OR we might have been better off NOT investing a 1st round pick in a freaking OG!?

Good article here on Dante Scarnecchia chiming in on the Patriots developments in the OL department: Guregian: Dante Scarnecchia opens up about Patriots’ new offense, coaching staff

It's a shame we lost such a legendary coach to retirement. Nobody since then has lived up to Scar's standard of achievement.

Do you blame the woeful performance this week on the OL coach, who also goes by the name Matt Patricia, or the personnel, or the people picking the groceries? The blame has to be shared among all of them doesn't it. And it don't look good.

I suppose this best describes the Patriots offense under Matt Patricia, Joe Judge, and Mac Jones this year:

 

[SlowGettingUp]

Does Schooler play the same role as Slater?

Yes, at least on punt returns. They both play gunner (on opposite sides of the field) and try to get to the kick at the same time the returner does. Slater often gets double-teamed, but I doubt opponents can afford to double-team both of them.

This Patriots Rookie Already Looking Like Elite Special Teamer

Pick out any standout special teams play from this Patriots season, and there's a good chance Brenden Schooler was somehow involved.

nesn.com

 

[Rob0729]

You don't think the play calling is a problem? The Colts were calling out the Pats' plays before they ran them yesterday.

 

[Joker]

You don't think the play calling is a problem? The Colts were calling out the Pats' plays before they ran them yesterday.

I observed that it was all on Patricia's playcalling yesterday. NOW it proves out. The fatal flaw all along.

 

[mgteich]

Does Schooler play the same role as Slater? (I confess I don't know much about coverage units). Schooler is on TV a lot, which means he's always around the ball (good), doing something (good), or I just recognize his long hair (eh).

Belichick puts great emphasis on ST play, often carrying 7 or more players who are primarily STers.

Last year, our leaders were Slater and Bethel. Schooler beat out Bethel. Schooler became even more important when Cody Davis was put on IR.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

I don't think there's any 'tells' necessarily. It's just very predictable.

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

I don't think there's any 'tells' necessarily. It's just very predictable.

this problem has been going on for 2-3 years imo. We are not really explosive and create big plays and deep passes. Opposing defenses are stacking the box a lot. Quit a lot checkdowns and short passing which makes it easier for other teams to stack the box bc they don't need to account for a lot of intermediate/deep stuff. Patricia is supposedly trying to do more vertical stuff which should enlighten the box a bit but our o-line can't hold enough and our qb lacks this deep throw accuracy this season.

 

[PScottman]

this problem has been going on for 2-3 years imo. We are not really explosive and create big plays and deep passes. Opposing defenses are stacking the box a lot. Quit a lot checkdowns and short passing which makes it easier for other teams to stack the box bc they don't need to account for a lot of intermediate/deep stuff. Patricia is supposedly trying to do more vertical stuff which should enlighten the box a bit but our o-line can't hold enough and our qb lacks this deep throw accuracy this season.

The Patriots don't seem to be good at bunch and pick play execution either. While I know blatant picks are illegal, the "run right beside and then across another teammate's route so the defense has to either switch or fight through (causing separation)" happens all the time in today's NFL.

Those rub routes would seem tailor made for a guy like Thornton who can make one step equal three pretty quickly. I'll have to check the all-22 as in counter thought - I haven't seen as many of those run against the Pats ether this year so maybe defenses are getting better at defending them, they are being called tighter, or some other reason why they're not being used.

 

[VJCPatriot]

You don't think the play calling is a problem? The Colts were calling out the Pats' plays before they ran them yesterday.

Matt Patricia is PAINFULLY predictable. The defense sees his plays coming a MILE away!

 

[Bill Lee]

I think he must be thinking of ME when it comes to Thornton. Love his "potential", but he hasn't shown me **** so far, though I'll rewatch the game tomorrow. He had what some might considered TWO drops today. Now its true both were throws at his knees, but the good WR's in the league make those catches. STILL not seeing any evidence of his "explosive" speed, or any great evidence he's getting separation, at least not the kind you expect of a guy with 4.2 speed.

Now I don't believe in making blanket statements so soon, especially since Thornton missed 6 week with the broken collar bone. He's a rookie who seems to be smart AND hardworking. Very few WR's come into the league and immediately become impactful. There are a LOT of good prospects who became very good WR's AFTER a few years of development.

Let's try to avoid showing ****. TYVM.

 

[Bill Lee]

Snap count time:

At least Agholor's playing time is falling off.

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

The Patriots don't seem to be good at bunch and pick play execution either. While I know blatant picks are illegal, the "run right beside and then across another teammate's route so the defense has to either switch or fight through (causing separation)" happens all the time in today's NFL.

Those rub routes would seem tailor made for a guy like Thornton who can make one step equal three pretty quickly. I'll have to check the all-22 as in counter thought - I haven't seen as many of those run against the Pats ether this year so maybe defenses are getting better at defending them, they are being called tighter, or some other reason why they're not being used.

good point, i see them on very different teams although i don't know any stats on those formations and only watch highlight videos on other games. We need to get thornton involved and more creative. We barely make play-action these days at least this is what i remember. When you are running that much esp. on first down, play-action seems like an obvious thing to integrate more. I thought they are practicing roll-outs etc. as well during TC but i can't see a lot of this "new" stuff

 

[ashley]

At least Agholor's playing time is falling off.

Honestly, I didn't even notice him on the field one time. Not that I expected him to make a lot of plays, but the fact that he didn't hurt us in any way with a fumble or a dropped pass is a step in the right direction, I guess.