Malcolm Butler!!!

[RayClay]

Did I not claim in my post that Butler would likely be active at times in both a depth AND special teams role?

If he's a regular on special teams, he's always available as a defensive back. I wouldn't say that's the case with Slater. I don't see how Slater affects, at all, how many receivers we carry. You did mention cutting down on the receivers.

To fully answer your question, I would throw it right back at you and ask "do you really see 5-6 WRs active on gameday (including Slater)?" It's the same exact principle.

I don't think it's the same because, Slater is never,"not" going to be on the roster because he's the ST Captain, but Butler, if on the team for special teams will actually help (IMO) if we need another DB.

 

[supafly]

If he's a regular on special teams, he's always available as a defensive back. I wouldn't say that's the case with Slater. I don't see how Slater affects, at all, how many receivers we carry. You did mention cutting down on the receivers.

I didn't think I necessarily mentioned cutting down on receivers, but I did mention the fact that all 6 WRs aren't going to be active every single game. In a regular situation where no one is suspended or injured (which was the premise of my whole entire comment), we're not going to see all WRs or all CBs active on gameday every week.

Things will change when Browner returns if there aren't any injuries. If there are, as I said in the comment--these "July/August questions" have a way of solving themselves later on in the real season through injuries etc.

I don't think it's the same because, Slater is never,"not" going to be on the roster because he's the ST Captain, but Butler, if on the team for special teams will actually help (IMO) if we need another DB.

I see Butler's current role as something close to that of the old Marquice Cole role, which is active on special teams and the low man on the depth chart (or close to it) at CB. Of course...again, that's in a regular type of situation, which does not apply for weeks 1-4 due to the Browner suspension.

Whether you agree or not, I do think that you should take into account the context of my comments, which were in response to mgteich's question of "who" is inactive.

 

[RayClay]

I didn't think I necessarily mentioned cutting down on receivers, but I did mention the fact that all 6 WRs aren't going to be active every single game. In a regular situation where no one is suspended or injured (which was the premise of my whole entire comment), we're not going to see all WRs or all CBs active on gameday every week.

Things will change when Browner returns if there aren't any injuries. If there are, as I said in the comment--these "July/August questions" have a way of solving themselves later on in the real season through injuries etc.





I see Butler's current role as something close to that of the old Marquice Cole role, which is active on special teams and the low man on the depth chart (or close to it) at CB. Of course...again, that's in a regular type of situation, which does not apply for weeks 1-4 due to the Browner suspension.

Whether you agree or not, I do think that you should take into account the context of my comments, which were in response to mgteich's question of "who" is inactive.

I agree with all that. I might have come into the conversation late today, as i'm not interested in all the "Butler's starting" in the hall of fame stuff. He seems like a heady player, but this team is loaded, so he'll need to make his bones on ST. I personally love all the special teams players that can actually play some if needed and i include Chung and Wilson there. They aren't starters, but i still crimge to think of the special teams "
safeties" that almost threw away the Carolina super bowl. There are lots of degrees between incompetent and complete starter, though some think not.

 

[supafly]

I agree with all that. I might have come into the conversation late today, as i'm not interested in all the "Butler's starting" in the hall of fame stuff. He seems like a heady player, but this team is loaded, so he'll need to make his bones on ST. I personally love all the special teams players that can actually play some if needed and i include Chung and Wilson there. They aren't starters, but i still crimge to think of the special teams "
safeties" that almost threw away the Carolina super bowl. There are lots of degrees between incompetent and complete starter, though some think not.

Actually, my comment that you quoted was from right around the 3rd preseason game or so, which may help to explain why I wasn't fully on board with the thought that Malcolm Butler was automatically going to overtake proven, veteran starters after only 2 preseason games.

 

[RayClay]

Actually, my comment that you quoted was from right around the 3rd preseason game or so, which may help to explain why I wasn't fully on board with the thought that Malcolm Butler was automatically going to overtake proven, veteran starters after only 2 preseason games.

He still isn't, really but he might get a flyer long enough to solidify a ST role. He's definitely not a workout warrior, so my guess is he'll force the issue there, and good for him. tough for him that we're loaded at DB, but competition is good for the team.

 

[supafly]

He still isn't, really but he might get a flyer long enough to solidify a ST role. He's definitely not a workout warrior, so my guess is he'll force the issue there, and good for him. tough for him that we're loaded at DB, but competition is good for the team.

I still think it's Dennard or Ryan who starts opposite of Revis for the most part on Sunday, but should an injury or even rotational situation come into play, this may be just what Butler needs to show himself in real game play.

Should that occur, he may solidify his position on the 53 permanently, with a likely focus on the ST role.

I think it's great when you think about how far we've come in CB talent/options from a year or two ago.

 

[mgteich]

I still think it's Dennard or Ryan who starts opposite of Revis for the most part on Sunday, but should an injury or even rotational situation come into play, this may be just what Butler needs to show himself in real game play.

Should that occur, he may solidify his position on the 53 permanently, with a likely focus on the ST role.

I think it's great when you think about how far we've come in CB talent/options from a year or two ago.

I don't follow. If Dennard or Ryan is injured, the other will play opposite Revis, with Arrington as the nickel back in either case. I suppose if there were an injury, Butler would be the dime back instead of the 3rd safety.

 

[supafly]

I don't follow. If Dennard or Ryan is injured, the other will play opposite Revis, with Arrington as the nickel back in either case. I suppose if there were an injury, Butler would be the dime back instead of the 3rd safety.

So, you don't see Malcolm Butler playing at all during the first 4 weeks? I'm not sure what you're saying.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Butler is a rookie. Just making the 53 on a largely veteran team poised for playoff contention is a big accomplishment.

Whether he sticks is up to him. He needs to bring it on ST. But he has also shown comfort level at #2 CB during preseason. So he has much higher ceiling than just another ST guy. Depth is always good to have. Especially DB depth in a pass happy NFL.

 

[patchick]

I don't follow. If Dennard or Ryan is injured, the other will play opposite Revis, with Arrington as the nickel back in either case. I suppose if there were an injury, Butler would be the dime back instead of the 3rd safety.

I have no clue how the coaches rank the CBs, but I don't assume that the rookie is the last resort simply by virtue of being a rookie. Rookies have played -- and started -- plenty under BB. What's more, if Butler had been the exact same player in camp but had been a day 2 draft pick with a strong reputation coming out of college, I think he'd be universally perceived as "in the mix."

Or to put it another way, here's a preview of the Tampa Bay tight end position leading into last year's training camp. The player who ended up being their top TE didn't even rate a mention, because he was an unheralded UDFA (some kid named Tim Wright):

Buccaneers Training Camp Preview 2013: Tight Ends - Bucs Nation

 

[mgteich]

So, you don't see Malcolm Butler playing at all during the first 4 weeks? I'm not sure what you're saying.

If everyone is healthy, I don't see Butler playing at all, other than special teams.

This presumes that Butler is clearly behind Revis, Dennard and Ryan, which I think is the case.

This is NOT a knock on Butler. There are four corners in front of him on the depth chart, three at CB plus another at nickel back.

I see us keeping Butler on the 53 after Game 4, even if he don't play. He is a fine prospect, and may be better than those ahead with a bit more development.

This is best CB situation for the patriots in several decades.

======

Having made my guess that Butler is behind Dennard and Ryan, it is quite possible that Butler is ahead of one or both and will get significant reps. It is very difficult for fans to judge practices and pre-season play.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Manning-Sanders may be 2nd to Big Ben - Brown. BB tested Butler and IMO he held up well. I'm curious to see his targeted stats.

 

[patchick]

Manning-Sanders may be 2nd to Big Ben - Brown. BB tested Butler and IMO he held up well. I'm curious to see his targeted stats.

Even on some of Sanders' completions, Butler was blanketing him and gave Manning an incredibly tight window. He's definitely looking like an NFL cornerback.