Impact WR….whom do you want?

[crawhammer]

Here are the best WR corps in the NFL:

Cincinnati (Burrow) - Ja' Marr Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd
Miami (Tua) - Tyreek Hill, Jaylen Waddle, Braxton Berrios
Philadelphia (Hurts) - A.J. Brown, DeVonta Smith, Quez Watkins
San Francisco - Deebo Samuel, Brandon Aiyuk, Jauan Jennings
Minnesota (Cousins) - Justin Jefferson, K.J. Osborn, Jalen Reagor
Buffalo (Allen) - Stefon Diggs, Gabe Davis, Khalil Shakir
LA Chargers (Herbert) - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Joshua Palmer
Arizona (Murray) - DeAndre Hopkins, Marquise Brown, Rondale Moore
Seattle (Geno) - DK Metcalf, Tyler Lockett, Dee Eskridge
LV Raiders (Garoppolo) - Davante Adams, Jakobi Meyers, Hunter Renfrow
LA Rams (Stafford) - Cooper Kupp, Allen Robinson, Van Jefferson
Tampa Bay (Mayfield) - Mike Evans, Chris Goodwin, Russell Gage
Denver (R. Wilson) - Jerry Jeudy, Courtland Sutton, Tim Patrick
Dallas (Dak) - CeeDee Lamb, Brandon Cooks, Michael Gallop
NYJ (Rodgers) - Garrett Wilson, Corey Davis, Allen Lazard
Detroit (Goff) - Amon-Ra St. Brown, Josh Reynolds, Jameson Williams

That's the top half of the league (roughly in order).

Should the Patriots be wedged in there somewhere or are they in the bottom half?

NEP (Mac) - JuJu S-S, DeVante Parker, Kendrick Bourne

 

[Steve102]

Here are the best WR corps in the NFL:

Cincinnati (Burrow) - Ja' Marr Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd
Miami (Tua) - Tyreek Hill, Jaylen Waddle, Braxton Berrios
Philadelphia (Hurts) - A.J. Brown, DeVonta Smith, Quez Watkins
San Francisco - Deebo Samuel, Brandon Aiyuk, Jauan Jennings
Minnesota (Cousins) - Justin Jefferson, K.J. Osborn, Jalen Reagor
Buffalo (Allen) - Stefon Diggs, Gabe Davis, Khalil Shakir
LA Chargers (Herbert) - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Joshua Palmer
Arizona (Murray) - DeAndre Hopkins, Marquise Brown, Rondale Moore
Seattle (Geno) - DK Metcalf, Tyler Lockett, Dee Eskridge
LV Raiders (Garoppolo) - Davante Adams, Jakobi Meyers, Hunter Renfrow
LA Rams (Stafford) - Cooper Kupp, Allen Robinson, Van Jefferson
Tampa Bay (Mayfield) - Mike Evans, Chris Goodwin, Russell Gage
Denver (R. Wilson) - Jerry Jeudy, Courtland Sutton, Tim Patrick
Dallas (Dak) - CeeDee Lamb, Brandon Cooks, Michael Gallop
NYJ (Rodgers) - Garrett Wilson, Corey Davis, Allen Lazard
Detroit (Goff) - Amon-Ra St. Brown, Josh Reynolds, Jameson Williams

That's the top half of the league (roughly in order).

Should the Patriots be wedged in there somewhere or are they in the bottom half?

NEP (Mac) - JuJu S-S, DeVante Parker, Kendrick Bourne

Dallas should be higher, but I am not sure if you ranked them or just compiled a list.

 

[BTTA]

I want a double dip. Trade for Hopkins and then draft a WR in the first round. This would give them the offensive weapons they need to put up enough points to be competitive every week.

Half the WR room wouldn't dress on game day.

 

[crawhammer]

Dallas should be higher, but I am not sure if you ranked them or just compiled a list.

I listed the top half, mostly in order, but moving Dallas up a few spots is reasonable. Cooks is an interesting case. Traded for the fourth time now. He looked like he was going to have an excellent career the way he started out in New Orleans. He had a decent season with the Patriots and he's been productive everywhere else. If he can stick in Dallas with CeeDee Lamb, they could make for an explosive duo.

 

[BTTA]

No more expensive reaches in free agency, please. If they feel the need to draft someone, either a flashy early rounder or a project, fine. The alleged "need" for a star "impact" WR has been WAY overstated.

Its an annual ritual in Pats' Nation. Don't get in the way of religion.

 

[Steve102]

I listed the top half, mostly in order, but moving Dallas up a few spots is reasonable. Cooks is an interesting case. Traded for the fourth time now. He looked like he was going to have an excellent career the way he started out in New Orleans. He had a decent season with the Patriots and he's been productive everywhere else. If he can stick in Dallas with CeeDee Lamb, they could make for an explosive duo.

Yeah, that's really an enigma to me... that Cooks situation. Why the hell are teams bailing on this guy? There's gotta be something going on there that teams don't get into a long relationship with him.

 

[BTTA]

Yeah, that's really an enigma to me... that Cooks situation. Why the hell are teams bailing on this guy? There's gotta be something going on there that teams don't get into a long relationship with him.

The analogies to romance here are too many to begin listing.

 

[Steve102]

The analogies to romance here are too many to begin listing.

Maybe I am too literal. I don't follow you. Sorry my man.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Mentioned in another thread, we have a pretty competent stable of pass catchers I dont see us acquiring another WR unless Parker or Bourne are exiting which I also don't see. I think Bill likes parker alot more than this board and hes a poor man Dhop.

Juju
Bourne
Parker
Thornton
Geseki
Henry
Rham
Jrob

Lots of mouths to feed on this offense. Id absolutely love Dhop here, just dont see it happening. I think 14 is going to the CB position maybe a flyer on a WR in the middle rounds but dont see that number 1 walking through the doors.

I agree, but it all depends on what BB & BOB think of Thornton and Parker. Parker is the real deal, had good years with Miami and should be better this year. Thornton has a lot less film to go on - we can be optimistic but there's some risk there. It's possible we make a move for an established guy or use a 2nd rounder, and then if Thornton also develops in camp, we trade away Bourne in September.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

You take issue with my statement while in the same breath making it either/or involving tight ends, which by definition aren't the same animal.

I'm sorry but this post is weak. Whinging over whether it's a WR or TE? I brought up two and one was Kelce who's essentially a big slot.

Your premise is that without a top-five quarterback an elite world-beating wide receiver OR TIGHT END is required for a team to be championship caliber. Of course, that sure makes it easier but I wouldn't say mandatory in the right context.

I certainly didn't say an elite WR/TE is required for anything. It was pretty clear what my point was.

Teams with the top tier targets are leading the league in points scored, total yards and passing yards. I mean I literally posted as much along with their efforts to aquire solid WR2 like Smith, Waddle etc. Pretty clear if you read the post but I'll break it down further. Again looking at points scored, total yards and passing yards. This time excluding KC & SF so no nasty TE are in there.

Miami - Hill - 11 (pts) 6(total) 4 (pass)

LAC - Williams 14 (pts) 9 (total) 10 (pass)

Vikings - Jefferson 7 (pts) 7 (total) 5 (pass)

Buffalo - Diggs - 4 (pts) 4 (total) 8 (pass)

Dallas - Lamb - 3 (pts) 10 (total) 14 (pass)

Cincinnati - Chase 8 (pts) 15 (total) 7 (pass)

Vegas - Adams - 12 (pts) 11 (total) 11 (pass)

Rams - Kupp - 27 (pts) 32 (total) 27 (pass) Stafford/Kupp hurt most of the year

Jax - Kirk - 13 (pts) 13 (total) 13 (pass)

Arizona - Hopkins 21 (pts) 22 (total) 18 (pass) Murray/Hop both missed a lot of time

Seattle - Metcalf - 9 (pts) 12 (total) 12 (pass)

Philly - Brown - 2 (pts) 2 (total) 9 (pass)

Tampa - Evans - 25 (pts) 14 (total) 2 (pass)

Detroit - St Brown - 5 (pts) 3 (total) 6 (pass)

14 teams with at least one top tier-ish WR and a upper echelon WR2.

7 have a top 10 scoring O.

11 have top 14 scoring O.

7 have top 9 total yards

12 of the top 15 passing yards.

I never said elite WR = championships. It's very much a team game but more than obvious how important the position has become.

That alternative context would be a top-10ish, heady QB working with an array of capable No. 2-level WRs and TEs alongside a top-tier running game, all supported by solid defense.

So far Mac has been closer to 20-25 than 10. He was somewhere between 15-18 his rookie year and bottom 10 last year. It sounds good but you're looking to catch lightning in bottle with that formula.

Recent league history is littered with examples of elite QBs with elite receivers falling short. Pats fans need look no further than SB 42.

Bad results don't mean bad process.

You think have a better chance without elite players?

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

If a WR is truly impact, why is another team going to give him up? If team X has an impact WR, do we want to pay the king's ransom it'll take to get him? Dhop is probably the best option that won't cost the moon, but Randy Moss for a 4th isn't out there right now. I'd rather take Johnston at 14.

A bunch of different reasons.

As easy as the cap is to manipulate some teams still can't figure it out. See Oakland and Mack. GB and Adams. New Orleans has been losing players for years bc of their cap situation.

Some players need a change of scenery and culture.

Some teams know they'll suck so theyll invest in the future with picks.

I'd only take Johnston or JSN in the first.

 

[PatsFan2]

If a WR is truly impact, why is another team going to give him up? If team X has an impact WR, do we want to pay the king's ransom it'll take to get him? Dhop is probably the best option that won't cost the moon, but Randy Moss for a 4th isn't out there right now. I'd rather take Johnston at 14.

Because some Teams do well at Drafting them Green bay after losing Adams got Watson who looks like star in the making.

 

[Steve102]

I'd only take Johnston or JSN in the first.

I agree here, Johnston over JSN. I think Johnston is the first WR off the board.

 

[Ivan]

Half the WR room wouldn't dress on game day.

So what move would you make to try and make them a serious playoff team? Are you satisfied with where they are at? Is there a draft pick you think they can take to make them a serious playoff team?

 

[Tunescribe]

I'm sorry but this post is weak. Whinging over whether it's a WR or TE? I brought up two and one was Kelce who's essentially a big slot.

I certainly didn't say an elite WR/TE is required for anything. It was pretty clear what my point was.

Teams with the top tier targets are leading the league in points scored, total yards and passing yards. I mean I literally posted as much along with their efforts to aquire solid WR2 like Smith, Waddle etc. Pretty clear if you read the post but I'll break it down further. Again looking at points scored, total yards and passing yards. This time excluding KC & SF so no nasty TE are in there.

Miami - Hill - 11 (pts) 6(total) 4 (pass)

LAC - Williams 14 (pts) 9 (total) 10 (pass)

Vikings - Jefferson 7 (pts) 7 (total) 5 (pass)

Buffalo - Diggs - 4 (pts) 4 (total) 8 (pass)

Dallas - Lamb - 3 (pts) 10 (total) 14 (pass)

Cincinnati - Chase 8 (pts) 15 (total) 7 (pass)

Vegas - Adams - 12 (pts) 11 (total) 11 (pass)

Rams - Kupp - 27 (pts) 32 (total) 27 (pass) Stafford/Kupp hurt most of the year

Jax - Kirk - 13 (pts) 13 (total) 13 (pass)

Arizona - Hopkins 21 (pts) 22 (total) 18 (pass) Murray/Hop both missed a lot of time

Seattle - Metcalf - 9 (pts) 12 (total) 12 (pass)

Philly - Brown - 2 (pts) 2 (total) 9 (pass)

Tampa - Evans - 25 (pts) 14 (total) 2 (pass)

Detroit - St Brown - 5 (pts) 3 (total) 6 (pass)

14 teams with at least one top tier-ish WR and a upper echelon WR2.

7 have a top 10 scoring O.

11 have top 14 scoring O.

7 have top 9 total yards

12 of the top 15 passing yards.

I never said elite WR = championships. It's very much a team game but more than obvious how important the position has become.

So far Mac has been closer to 20-25 than 10. He was somewhere between 15-18 his rookie year and bottom 10 last year. It sounds good but you're looking to catch lightning in bottle with that formula.

Bad results don't mean bad process.

You think have a better chance without elite players?

There's no need for snark or defensiveness here, we're just having a discussion. It wasn't "whining" to point out you added tight ends to the equation when wide receivers was the initial topic. But that's fine.

After revisiting your initial response I think I have a clearer idea of what you're driving at. Just the same, I'm not convinced the Pats' receiving corps, including tight ends, isn't already playoff-worthy without another marquee name added. Mac was the league's 13th-ranked QB his rookie season (according to Pro Football Reference) and I consider last year an aberration. I anticipate significant improvement from him this coming season -- AT LEAST top-13 and hopefully beyond, in which case he's flirting with top-10 status. Of course, a lot hinges on him making that leap.

Let's say Thornton develops further as a downfield threat. With Schuster, Bourne and Parker in the mix plus Henry/Gesicki, do you still see glaring needs? If so, in your opinion who/what should they aim for?

 

[n6249c]

So what move would you make to try and make them a serious playoff team? Are you satisfied with where they are at? Is there a draft pick you think they can take to make them a serious playoff team?

Stand pat on receivers, upgrade the OL.

 

[Steve102]

Stand pat on receivers, upgrade the OL.

Which is probably what will happen, sending the board into meltdown they didn't draft a WR.

 

[PatsFan2]

There's no need for snark or defensiveness here, we're just having a discussion. It wasn't "whining" to point out you added tight ends to the equation when wide receivers was the initial topic. But that's fine.

After revisiting your initial response I think I have a clearer idea of what you're driving at. Just the same, I'm not convinced the Pats' receiving corps, including tight ends, isn't already playoff-worthy without another marquee name added. Mac was the league's 13th-ranked QB his rookie season (according to Pro Football Reference) and I consider last year an aberration. I anticipate significant improvement from him this coming season -- AT LEAST top-13 and hopefully beyond, in which case he's flirting with top-10 status. Of course, a lot hinges on him making that leap.

Let's say Thornton develops further as a downfield threat. With Schuster, Bourne and Parker in the mix plus Henry/Gesicki, do you still see glaring needs? If so, in your opinion who/what should they aim for?

Parker? can't separate Parker?

 

[PatsFan2]

Here are the best WR corps in the NFL:

Cincinnati (Burrow) - Ja' Marr Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd
Miami (Tua) - Tyreek Hill, Jaylen Waddle, Braxton Berrios
Philadelphia (Hurts) - A.J. Brown, DeVonta Smith, Quez Watkins
San Francisco - Deebo Samuel, Brandon Aiyuk, Jauan Jennings
Minnesota (Cousins) - Justin Jefferson, K.J. Osborn, Jalen Reagor
Buffalo (Allen) - Stefon Diggs, Gabe Davis, Khalil Shakir
LA Chargers (Herbert) - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Joshua Palmer
Arizona (Murray) - DeAndre Hopkins, Marquise Brown, Rondale Moore
Seattle (Geno) - DK Metcalf, Tyler Lockett, Dee Eskridge
LV Raiders (Garoppolo) - Davante Adams, Jakobi Meyers, Hunter Renfrow
LA Rams (Stafford) - Cooper Kupp, Allen Robinson, Van Jefferson
Tampa Bay (Mayfield) - Mike Evans, Chris Goodwin, Russell Gage
Denver (R. Wilson) - Jerry Jeudy, Courtland Sutton, Tim Patrick
Dallas (Dak) - CeeDee Lamb, Brandon Cooks, Michael Gallop
NYJ (Rodgers) - Garrett Wilson, Corey Davis, Allen Lazard
Detroit (Goff) - Amon-Ra St. Brown, Josh Reynolds, Jameson Williams

That's the top half of the league (roughly in order).

Should the Patriots be wedged in there somewhere or are they in the bottom half?

NEP (Mac) - JuJu S-S, DeVante Parker, Kendrick Bourne

NEP = Yuck Juju needs better on the outsides to effective inside.

 

[203Pat]

Ideally I would want Jeudy for a second round pick. He is still young (only 24 going into the 2023 season) and has some familiarity with Mac already. Even though Bill O'Brien never coached at Bama when Jeudy was there at least there is some familiarity there with how Alabama does things offensively as well. Jeudy is an ascending talent who will be on his third coach in four years in Denver and maybe he pushes for a change of scenery and helps force the Broncos hand.