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If We Pick At 15

2020 Patriots Season:
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Ivan

Hall of Fame Poster
Similar to WRs there is a love affair in this forum with pass rushers that exceeds the Patriots' value propositions in regards to single skill to draft capital to cap room.

There is particularly not high value placed on single skill players on the defensive side of the ball when the Pats have had a high pick in the first round. Now if this kid is a true five tool player, plays the run as well as rushes the passer as well as has a high football IQ - THEN the possibility rises immensely of selection. But if he's just a pass rusher - what evidence is there of the Patriots historically selecting a single high skill guy in the early first round (especially defensively)?
Well, he’s not “ just a pass rusher,” and he is an exceptional prospect, and it’s starting to look more and more like he’s not going to make to #15.
Right now the Patriots have to be looking at how to win without the best QB, and a great defense and a strong run game are keys to achieving that. And the Patriots will now have 3 top ten draft choice QB’s in their division. What’s the best way to make their lives miserable, a dominant pass rush. Combine this with a dominant run game and you can chew up the clock and get opposing offenses of the field quickly, and they will almost always give you a good shot at winning that game.
 

50-yard-line

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Well, he’s not “ just a pass rusher,” and he is an exceptional prospect, and it’s starting to look more and more like he’s not going to make to #15.
Right now the Patriots have to be looking at how to win without the best QB, and a great defense and a strong run game are keys to achieving that. And the Patriots will now have 3 top ten draft choice QB’s in their division. What’s the best way to make their lives miserable, a dominant pass rush. Combine this with a dominant run game and you can chew up the clock and get opposing offenses of the field quickly, and they will almost always give you a good shot at winning that game.
How many Wolverines will BB put on our line? like a Rutgers secondary all over again!
 

Ochmed Jones

Pro Bowl Player
Assuming San Fran takes fields at 3, we could (maybe) see Jones and parsons both available at 15.

which would bb take or would he trade down?
 

DropKickFlutie

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Assuming San Fran takes fields at 3, we could (maybe) see Jones and parsons both available at 15.

which would bb take or would he trade down?

Amazing question. This is real hard. If Mac Jones or Parsons are both there ? I gotta go with Mac but my lead inclination is to go defense first with either Parsons, Paye, Horn if available there. I just think Mac fits a lot of what we need for a passing attack.
 

Ochmed Jones

Pro Bowl Player
Amazing question. This is real hard. If Mac Jones or Parsons are both there ? I gotta go with Mac but my lead inclination is to go defense first with either Parsons, Paye, Horn if available there. I just think Mac fits a lot of what we need for a passing attack.

if jones is there at 15, bb can call Washington or New Orleans and rape either of them.
 

FredFromDartmouth

In the Starting Line-Up
if jones is there at 15, bb can call Washington or New Orleans and rape either of them.

It would be very surprising if Jones is there at 15 (SF takes him at 3). If he is, the Patriots take him. He has the second most accurate arm in this draft class (with Zack Wilson having the best); it would be a shame to let him slide through our fingers.

BTW, I feel that Jacksonville should take Wilson. Then Lawrence falls to the Jets and BB would be able to torment him twice a year.
 

PScottman

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Well, he’s not “ just a pass rusher,” and he is an exceptional prospect, and it’s starting to look more and more like he’s not going to make to #15.
Right now the Patriots have to be looking at how to win without the best QB, and a great defense and a strong run game are keys to achieving that. And the Patriots will now have 3 top ten draft choice QB’s in their division. What’s the best way to make their lives miserable, a dominant pass rush. Combine this with a dominant run game and you can chew up the clock and get opposing offenses of the field quickly, and they will almost always give you a good shot at winning that game.
And that's the thing - I don't have any hubris regarding ability to scout, evaluate, draft football players. Not only can I not tell the future, neither can anyone else - and that's all a draft is - an educated guess, but if a kid can do four or five things really well athletically as well as has a demonstrated ability to absorb, and then repeat physically, knowledge - that educated guess is probably a much higher percentage gamble. It sounds like this kid may be one of those multi-talents which would pique the Patriots interest, but then he may not either.

That said, I also don't have any historical precedence with the Patriots under Belichick that "pass rush" as just one of those skills is rated higher than any other defensive skill. In fact, if past drafting holds true, he tends to try and fill that niche later or via veterans that have demonstrated the ability over time (Anderson, Carter, etc). Patriots teams don't tend to "harm" young QBs with "ears pinned back" pass rush, but instead scheme complexity and "setting them up" by showing them something over and over to get them comfortable with a look only to change it in a certain pressure situation.
 

JarOfMayo51

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
Casserly has Justin Fields going at #24 to the Steelers lol

not a chance in hell he falls that far, and i would basically call for BB to be fired if he passed on fields at 15
 

Ivan

Hall of Fame Poster
How many Wolverines will BB put on our line? like a Rutgers secondary all over again!
And that worked out really well. Michigan gets a lot of top end talent, Paye is a great prospect, I like this draft class, I think there is a ton of talent in it.
 

Ivan

Hall of Fame Poster
And that's the thing - I don't have any hubris regarding ability to scout, evaluate, draft football players. Not only can I not tell the future, neither can anyone else - and that's all a draft is - an educated guess, but if a kid can do four or five things really well athletically as well as has a demonstrated ability to absorb, and then repeat physically, knowledge - that educated guess is probably a much higher percentage gamble. It sounds like this kid may be one of those multi-talents which would pique the Patriots interest, but then he may not either.

That said, I also don't have any historical precedence with the Patriots under Belichick that "pass rush" as just one of those skills is rated higher than any other defensive skill. In fact, if past drafting holds true, he tends to try and fill that niche later or via veterans that have demonstrated the ability over time (Anderson, Carter, etc). Patriots teams don't tend to "harm" young QBs with "ears pinned back" pass rush, but instead scheme complexity and "setting them up" by showing them something over and over to get them comfortable with a look only to change it in a certain pressure situation.
I agree with much of what you are saying, you make some very good points, but there is always a top tier of talent in every draft that usually only runs 8-12 players deep, and that’s a a tier of players that the Patriots never have a shot at, and that always includes the top pass rusher. Once you go pass that tier things level out to some degree, and I think that changes the way you have to look at it. In this instance the QB’s are pushing the best talent at other positions down a bit, which puts guys like Paye and Horn in play depending upon how the board falls on draft night, And as the draft gets closer it’s looking more and more like Paye will be gone when the Patriots pick, in which case you have to have a series of back up plans, fortunately in this draft there are a number of ways they can play it, and the only thing that matters in the end is getting it right. And if there is a run on all the top players at their positions of need then they could go BPA, or start trading back to pick up more day 2 picks. M choice of Paye was based upon 10 or so locks being gone when they pick, but if he joins that group then it means they have to look elsewhere. I would love to see a proxy thread starting at #6 on draft night, to lock in the top choices people here are making.
 

BayAreaPatsFan

On the Roster
"Indefinitely" ?? One season = indefinitely??

debbie downer GIF
Not just indefinitely one poster remarked that if we dont get a QB this draft we will be "spiraling downards to jetsville" . Step away from the ledge, please !!
 

scout

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
Not just indefinitely one poster remarked that if we dont get a QB this draft we will be "spiraling downards to jetsville" . Step away from the ledge, please !!
Speaking of the Jets. Just read an article on a draft story.

 

rochrist

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Should be hard for anyone to resist taking Horn. Doubt he will be there. Maybe Paye? Hopefully the 5 QBs, the 3 WRs and Pitts, plus a couple of OTs, so that someone falls to us.
I'd expect Horn or Surtain to be there. I'd prefer Horn but either way.
 

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