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jmt57

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Excellent stuff
I feel a desire to bump this up to the top of the forum multiple times daily, past the eleventy-seven covid/political threads with zero discussion about the game of football that are now dominating this forum.

Thank You.
 

ViperGTS

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
Ahhh if only the Patriots could suck for a year or two, and get a bona fide QB and pass rusher. Oh wait, San Fran did that in a way. Got Jimmy G, he got hurt and it got them Bosa. Hell they may even get another top 5 pick this year. It could set them up for years to come. However, too many people can't see the big picture and instead focus on the present.
 

Gumby

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
Ahhh if only the Patriots could suck for a year or two, and get a bona fide QB and pass rusher. Oh wait, San Fran did that in a way. Got Jimmy G, he got hurt and it got them Bosa. Hell they may even get another top 5 pick this year. It could set them up for years to come. However, too many people can't see the big picture and instead focus on the present.

would you be talking about the first coach who could theoretically break the 5-year HOF induction rule when he retires?
(Based on unanimous consensus he belongs)

I am pretty sure he finds it unacceptable to try for anything less than at least playoffs, if not div champ being the std for a „decent“ effort and season.

And, food for thought: how many 1st rnd picks played for BB who were NOT drafted by Pats? How many HOFers weren’t 1.rndrs?
 

farn

PatsFans.com Supporter
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Sometimes, fans get enamoured by the ultra-talented athlete that can wow the crowd with his gifts. I suspect BB loves talent as well, but he seems to seek out players that are (1) willing and (2) able to learn these game plans week-week w/o messing up or complaining. In the cap era, it is rare for a team to be so superior in talent that they can steamroll the league.
 

PScottman

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
In the cap era, it is rare for a team to be so superior in talent that they can steamroll the league.

This is the one point where you have to agree with the "draftologists" that are critical of the Pats - In a cap environment hitting big on a draft, especially at high $ positions (QB, WR, DE), can set up a team very well for a 4-5 year span with the rookie scale. Very much boom and bust approach however.
 

PP2

Pro Bowl Player
I feel a desire to bump this up to the top of the forum multiple times daily, past the eleventy-seven covid/political threads with zero discussion about the game of football that are now dominating this forum.

Thank You.


Thanks, sometimes I don't even know why I bother trying. There's been very little response or interest in pure football stuff, the x and o's. It's always all about the drama.
 

Vindicate

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
Thanks, sometimes I don't even know why I bother trying. There's been very little response or interest in pure football stuff, the x and o's. It's always all about the drama.

I eat this stuff up so I'll always enjoy it!
 

gitgronked82

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
Nice. The defense where we rush 3, play man, and have one high and two underneath zones was definitely effective. It’s not a good feeling as a fan watching Mahomes have all day and scramble around the pocket waiting for guys to get open, but our guys did an awesome job holding up in coverage on “broken” plays, which they knew would likely be extended due to rushing only 3. Also nice that with the underneath zones, Mahomes could run around to extend plays, but usually didn’t have too much potential to run downfield... usually
 

captain stone

Hall of Fame Poster
I am pretty sure he finds it unacceptable to try for anything less than at least playoffs, if not div champ being the std for a „decent“ effort and season.
Then why hasn't he signed players from outside the building to help at the positions where we obviously need it?
 

Dragda

Yes, it's really me...
PatsFans.com Supporter
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
I also scratched my head at the mention of Butler being a run stuffer. But he did it last game. Perhaps he’s more than a long down and distance lineman at this point in his career. It’s worth keeping our eye on.
 

IndianPat

Third String But Playing on Special Teams
Ahhh if only the Patriots could suck for a year or two, and get a bona fide QB and pass rusher. Oh wait, San Fran did that in a way. Got Jimmy G, he got hurt and it got them Bosa. Hell they may even get another top 5 pick this year. It could set them up for years to come. However, too many people can't see the big picture and instead focus on the present.
The grass is always greener on the other side, right? Ignore the fact that a franchise QB (Cam Newton) was gift wrapped to us and an under study QB who is developing in the system for the last two years. Lock Cam up for four more years and with a solid team, this team can notch up 10+ wins every year and be always in contention for a play off berth.
Hell no. Lets suck for two years and draft a "Darnold or Allen" and a Chandler Jones and suck for two more years. In the mean time, you and others can ratchet up another couple thousand more posts about how bad we suck.
 

sb1

Pro Bowl Player
Ahhh if only the Patriots could suck for a year or two, and get a bona fide QB and pass rusher. Oh wait, San Fran did that in a way. Got Jimmy G, he got hurt and it got them Bosa. Hell they may even get another top 5 pick this year. It could set them up for years to come. However, too many people can't see the big picture and instead focus on the present.

Teams don't tank on purpose and even if they suck for a couple years there's no guarantee they'll get a star at the top of the draft. See Jest, NY
 

sb1

Pro Bowl Player
The grass is always greener on the other side, right? Ignore the fact that a franchise QB (Cam Newton) was gift wrapped to us and an under study QB who is developing in the system for the last two years. Lock Cam up for four more years and with a solid team, this team can notch up 10+ wins every year and be always in contention for a play off berth.
Hell no. Lets suck for two years and draft a "Darnold or Allen" and a Chandler Jones and suck for two more years. In the mean time, you and others can ratchet up another couple thousand more posts about how bad we suck.
Belichick will take the top 5 pick and trade down anyway for some Rutgers dude or a Division II stud.
 

PScottman

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Belichick will take the top 5 pick and trade down anyway

So I did some boolean on this and asked "top 10" as far as traded out of vs just Top 5. My memory said he didn't trade "out" when he had a low pick - he might trade "down" if he thought he'd still get his guy. Given there isn't really any data from top 5 since he won too much to get there there often I did find the following:

------------------------------

4. 2003: Acquired Baltimore’s second-round pick (No. 41 overall, TE Bennie Joppru, by Houston) and a 2004 first-round pick (No. 21 overall, DT Vince Wilfork) in exchange for a first-round pick (No. 19 overall, QB Kyle Boller)

By allowing the Ravens to climb the board for Boller, the Patriots were able to land one of the top defensive tackles in franchise history the following year. They also included the 41st overall pick in a subsequent trade that landed them productive safety Eugene Wilson (36th overall, 2003).

5. 2007: Acquired San Francisco’s 2008 first-round pick (No. 7 overall, DT Sedrick Ellis, by New Orleans) and a fourth-round pick (No. 110 overall, CB John Bowie, by Oakland) in exchange for a first-round pick (No. 28 overall, OT Joe Staley)

Looks one-sided on paper, huh, with the Niners landing a franchise left tackle in Staley? Not so. The Patriots used that future first-rounder to trade down and select linebacker Jerod Mayo at No. 10 overall in 2008 (and add a third-round pick they used on bust Shawn Crable). The fourth they received gave them the ammunition to swing the Moss trade.
-------------------------------

However, if your wider point is simply trading on draft day regardless of position - that seems 100% true. 2002, 03, 06, 07, 09, 10, 17, 18 (just what I could find quickly - it's probably every year frankly) all had one or more moves regardless of draft position. Very active.
 
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